Archive through June 11, 2006
Star Fleet Universe Discussion Board: Star Fleet Battles: Star Fleet Universe Training Command:
Tips for Training SFB:
Archive through June 11, 2006
Don't know how many have tried, it, but I would think that using Early years ships for Training would be helpful.
There are no overloads, no scatterpacks for a while, no fighters, smaller ships, only Vulcans have scouts, EW is less, Bases are smaller.
James:
A number of other rules change in (predictable but) not inherently obvious ways. Like Trans and Trac ranges, for one.
This can confuse people badly. Especially if you don't warn them you're using a timeline module.
My concern about training in Early Years is the possibility of boredom and frustration. Without overloads it is very difficult to make things go boom, which is part of the attraction in learning the game.
Indeed - there's an essay on the Rangers part of the web site, which details how I taught SFB for years with the tourney ships.
http://www.starfleetgames.com/rangers/training.htm
is the URL; I've found it works well for teaching "real" SFB, and gives each player enough of a reward to come back to see what happens next time. I've taught dozens of people the game by this method and can attest that it does work.
Ok,
I have a tip for training SFB. First, find an engineer (a real engineer). There's one at work (electrical/computer engineer) who I've convinced in the span of 2 days (with very little arm twisting) to try the game... and that's _after_ I showed him the rulebook.
Second, have them read the "Let's Play SFB" PDF on this site, making sure to explain that it's from a Cadet Training Handbook. If they start asking questions about the game after they've read it, especially if they're questions like "I noticed the ship was able to fire at two separate targets in the same impulse. Can ships fire everything all at once?", they're probably a good candidate.
I'm planning on trying a variation of the Ranger's Demo/training suggestions. I'll give him the Fed CC. I'll take either a D6 or an unrefitted D7 (possibly will weight it a bit more heavily in his favor). I like positive reinforcement but 'letting a new player win' never sat right with me. So I'll take a ship that's inferior instead and at the very least he should cause a lot of damage (especially since I'm still pretty rusty).
First couple of turns will be just what the Rangers' advice is, though I might add standard heavy weapons right away if he handles the movement/allocation/phaser rules easily (sneakily I already taught him basic movement when I first showed him the rulebook as an example of how 5 pages in the manual can really be distilled into a 2 minute explanation - so I might be able to slide in a bit more information right at the start).
Second or third turn, I'll explain overloads. Turn after that I'll explain drones (from the basic standpoint of what it is, what it can do and how fast it goes as I'll be the one launching them), labs, tractors (against drones only) and _maybe_ reserve power. Might leave reserve power til session 2.
An alternative 'scenario' I just thought of was a string of Klingon ships, starting with a Frigate, then when he destroys that, bring on a Destroyer. One at a time he should be able to handle them pretty easily.
Give him a BCG and you a D5.
Then don't look at it as letting him win, but rather as a chance for you to play your absolute hardest and still allow him to have fun. You'll porobaly have tough time even if he doesn't now about overloads.
If you can get two newbies at once then a BCH duel is fun because new players will like ships that "go boom good". Running out of weapons and having to CDR them back sucks (which is another reason why frigate duels are bad) and BCH are less likely to do that than any other ship.
Thanks for the advice Michael.
Unfortunately I only have the Basic Set so I think I'm going to go with a Fed CAR vs a Klingon F5B (me), fixed map. Was thinking I'd try floating since I'll be teaching him Proximity Photons pretty quickly, but I'd rather he have a chance to corner me if he plays it well.
My only 'fudge' will be if I take a drone hit, I'll go one column further down if we haven't reached the turn (3 or 4) where I plan to teach drones, or at least how to defend against them. I'll, of course, be upfront with the reason why (the 'story' will be it's an early training exercise for a cadet in Officer's Academy).
While flipping through the info for other scenarios I found the one with the Federation ship sabotaged (forget the title). I'm thinking that's a decent game a few sessions down the road (him as the Klingon obviously) if he plans to play again.
Robert
You're welcome.
The F5 is quite small, you might want to not teach him about overloads and then let him discover that your two Disruptors are keeping pace and how...I'm not really sure how he'll take that. Most people I know say;" Oh, can I do that too?" and I say;" Sure, but you're limited to a maximum range of 8 and it costs double the power...although in the case of Photons it's just 2 damage per point of warp power upto a limit of double the warhead"...and they dive in for huge quantities of destruction ( yes, it helps to say;"hurray, now I'm at range 8 and can use my overloads!" just before you fire )...but some people feel betrayed by that sort of thing.
Also since you're holding overloads until latter in the game, use only type IF drones. You might also load IVF drones in your ADD rack (if any, I don't have the SSD infront of me) to cripple your defences a little.
If he has a CAR+ you might want to let him fire drones at you and watch you shoot them down to figure out how he ought defend against drones.
Michael,
Thanks again for some good advice and commentary.
First game is tonight. I bribed with pizza and beer.
I actually made index cards for each turn to remind myself what to teach. I also put lines through the parts of the EA chart he won't have to worry about.
My plan changed a bit. I'm going to be starting at WS-III and explain the different TYPES of photon loadouts to him (OL, STD, PROX) just by using the charts (ie, damage, chances to hit) and hold costs (with a mention that Prox and Std types can be switched in the EA phase to each other or to overloads, but no overloads to either of the other two). As far as charging the Photons I'm only going to mention that they take 2 turns to arm once fired but can be held indefinitely. I'll let him in on my probable tactics, though given he'll be able to move pretty fast at WS-III I'm not completely sure I'll be able to avoid overload range on a fixed map! If not, there's always the 'reset' button when he blows me up.
What this basically does is, eliminate energy allocation on the first turn. He'll still have to do it, but it'll amount to filling in the costs for housekeeping, noting the Phaser Capacitor energy stored, and choosing hold costs (and type) for his photons. The rest of the energy will then go to Movement (per Ken Burnside's recommendations, I'm not teaching shield reinforcement in the first session at all).
Second turn will involve telling him how to arm photons, during which time I'll get to say "By the way, the Klingons can arm disruptors in only 1 turn." (actually I'll probably mention it in passing when I mention arming in turn 1 for photons), and how to refill the capacitors. If he fired lots of weapons, I look forward to seeing him realize just how much slower he'll be going...
Third turn will start with me saying, "Ok, look at the Tractor line on your EA form. Put a point into into it." and a description in general terms of what tractors do, and specifically that they're useful in drone defense, at which time I'll describe drones. We won't be doing ship to ship tractoring in Session 1.
I'm deliberately NOT giving him the CAR+, as I don't want him to worry about drones in the first game, other than how to kill them with basic tools (phasers and tractors). I will be using Medium speed drones, with one IV in the rack, so I can explain labs to him as they apply to drones.
If I play it well, he might be getting frustrated by Turn 4, having a hard time catching me or dealing with me following behind. That's when I'll explain HETs.
So at the end of the session, he should know:
1. Basic Movement + Sideslips + HETs
2. Basic Combat + Overloads + Proximity Torps
3. How to defend against drones using tractors, labs and phasers.
Session 2 will probably involve giving him a ship with a small number of drone racks (the CAR+ for instance) and teaching him how to use them. Definite topics will be shield reinforcement, damage repair and mid turn speed changes. Possible topics will mix and match from EW, Shuttles (Admin and Suicide to start with as the ships used will still have minimal drone racks - session 3 or later will introduce WW and SPs, and the extra functions of the tractor beam) and Hit and Run raids. At this point, I might switch to a plasma race while giving him a more drone heavy ship to play with.
A lot will depend, of course, on how much he likes the game after session 1 and whether I hear lots of questions like "So.. what does the transporter do?" ie, the more he seems interested in what ELSE the ship can do that I'm not showing him, the more quickly I can probably add new rules.
Things like Scanners, Sensors, uncontrolled status, Klingon Mutiny, etc, will be explained if they occur during the game itself, but probably not in advance (or session 3).
We just finished Turn 2 tonight and will continue the engagement two weekends from now (unfortunately I'm on a week long break starting Saturday).
All in all, I think it went well, considering that the trainee was the one who mentioned 'next time' first (always a good thing in teaching a wargame or on a date... now if I could just combine the two...).
When teaching, I realized, for the first time really, just how 'basic' SFB really is. In historical wargames there's a term used called 'chrome' or 'fiddly bits'. These are the things added on to the base game to add more flavor or make certain procedures more complex. In general, most designers and players subscribe to the theory that chrome/fiddly bits should be proportionally less than the base system itself (move, fire, etc). SFB obviously, subscribes to a different theory. ;)
Anyhow... brief report is as follows:
Federation CAR: Joe (trainee)
Klingon F5B: Me (hey, I'll take a F5, but I'm NOT gonna fly an unrefitted one against a Fed, even one flown by a trainee.. have you SEEN those aft shields?)
Combo Fixed/Floating map. What I mean is, the map was fixed for me. If I move off it, I lose. Since he's a newbie, the map is floating for him (only in the case of mistiming a turn), not if he simply goes straight off the map edge.
I stuck to my plan. First turn's Energy Allocation was EASY for him at WS III. I highly recommend this for a first game. All he had to decide was what level to set his Photons at and then count up his movement points from the remaining energy. That meant his first duel had a first turn with starting speeds of 25/24 (me/him).
First turn was relatively slow and standard. I sideslipped towards him, he went straight ahead (standard Fed/Klingon starting locations for the Duel), controlling the center of the map. He had chosen 2 standard load torps and 2 overloads. He fired one when we were at Range 12, when he realized we weren't going to get any closer for that turn. And he missed. He did some minor phaser damage on two of my shields while I hit with both of my standard load disruptors and a couple of Ph-2s (I rolled really well), taking his #1 down by 9 points. At the end of the turn he was a bit further than the center of the map towards me, still holding 2 OL photons and a standard.
Turn 2 I made a rather deliberate mistake. I charged all my phasers that had fired instead of gaining 4 more movement points from them. He ended up moving 22, charging one photon at standard, and I was moving at 21. He decided to switch modes on the standard photon he was still holding, to a proximity, and he continued to hold the other two as overloads.
I arced back around to try to slide by on the bottom edge of the map, and he waited to turn, using sideslips and straight movement instead, until I committed to my turn (to the bottom, rather than the top). While I had been sideslipping in a manner to indicate I would go that way, he didn't take the bait until I committed, which was a good sign of him grasping how to cut off an opponent.
We ended up at Range 4. I pointed out (again) how having both prox and overloads at the same time was diluting his strategy but he hadn't been sure he could reach overload range (whereas I was pretty positive he could reach Range 8 given he was still holding 2 OLs and a Prox/Standard, only loading his final torp). He did hit with the Prox earlier in the turn but up until this point none of my shields was close to failing.
Of course, range 4 to a Fed with 2 OL photons is a scary feeling for an F5, even an F5B. Fortunately, he only hit with 1, and rolled pretty crappily on his Phasers. Still, he did 25 points of damage, and 9 internals. I did hit with my disruptors (standards) and a couple of phaser 2's to put 10 on his #2 shield.
So that's where it stands currently. He had fun, he showed interest in playing again and some innate understanding of tactics. He wasn't overwhelmingly interested in 'other systems' that we weren't using, but he did show interest when I mentioned them. 
Is it a good sign that the trainee told me today that he dreamt about moving his ship on the map? ;)
Ahhh, yes. I've said it before and I'll say it again.
Take the movement system from CAR WARS and add it to the combat mechanics of BATTLETECH and you've got yourself a game that's about as difficult as SFB!
But hardly anybody beleives it...go figure!?!
Hmmm, so suddenly I seem to have 2 more folks interested (potentially at least) in SFB. As mentioned above, the first training session seemed to go well. I've been unable to continue though due to time constraints on the both of us.
Hopefully we'll get a chance to play this coming weekend, at which time I'll likely have 1, possibly 2, more players.
So... looking at the possibilities:
#1: Only have the same player as I did before. In that case we'll continue where we left off, continuing my plan of introducing a few more rules.
#2: Have one completely new player trying the game. In that case, I'll use the same training method I used successfully for the last guy.
#3: Have two newbies (whether two complete newbies, or one complete newbie + the fella I started to train last time) over. In this case, I'll use the same training method as above and let them fight it out in a duel, answering questions they might have.
#4: Have all three over. This one gets trickier. My instinct is to do something like 2 Federation CAs for one side, and a D7/D6 combo for a second side with me taking a D6 and basically restricting the two sides from 'in turn' strategy discussions (only between turn). I'd really be hesitant to do a free for all (either 3 players if I don't play or 4 players if I do) simply because I want to avoid a 'gang up on' type mode... But even with 2 on 2 there's the possibility of one player getting booted out early. I'm thinking, if it ends up with 4 total people, that if a ship is destroyed or disengages, I give them another ship, since the whole goal is to learn the game, not 'win' in the first session.
I was considering a quicker methode of motivational training.
Extreme SFB.
Various electrodes are adhered to the body corresponding to different internals. As each player takes damage they get shocked there. Hull hits are on the arms and legs, power hits in the gut, and other hits can be in more sensative areas. Like in SFB, taking too many bridge hits can leave you uncontrolled. Hit and run raids can be just plain mean.
I expect players to learn agressive and effective tactics at an accelerated rate.
The only valid result is victory.
Dang. All I can say is, for those who're only on SFB Online, ask around your area, especially those you work with (if there're any programmers, engineers, sci fi fans, just plain intelligent people).
In the space of a month and a half I went from figuring I'd only be able to play online to not having time to play online because I'm in the process of training 3-4 new players. Two from work (admittedly one's only here for the summer), one about 30 minutes away who just asked on another forum I'm active on if I'd be up for training someone, and the guy I normally wargame (historical stuff) with. And the area I live in is quite small (Cape Cod).
Of course, if SFB Online works best (time committments, etc) then this commentary should be ignored. ;) Heck, I don't know for sure how deep these guys are gonna get into the game. They might 'stop' at the basic movement/shooting level.
Anyhow...
So, tonight's the second training session. I still had the game from the first session set up, and the first fella (JG) is coming back. Second guy from work is also coming over (JM). My original plan had been to finish out the battle if only JG was here, but when I learned both were coming I initially figured I'd scrap the first game and start over with both of them in Fed CA's and me in two D6's (the F5 just isn't a challenge for a Fed CA on a fixed map, especially without drones - which I didn't teach at the start).
Then I got to looking at the map some more... Instead of starting over, we're gonna 'reinforce'. The slightly hurt F5 and the shield scratched CA (JG's) will remain on the map, and a new Fed CA (JM's) and a D6 (mine) will arrive.
It's still not an overly tough battle for them as I'll be waiting til at least Turn 2 to go over drones and won't have a scatterpack while they'll have their G-racks (I gave them a basic loadout of 2 IM and 4 ADDs so they can experiment a bit if they want). So they'll have a CAR+ each (magically giving the one on the map its + refit) and I'll have an unrefitted D6 and an F5K (yeah, I know, historically inaccurate ).
Saturday is a training session with another completely new guy (MD) and possibly JM. Since MD has played wargames before I might do a 2xCA vs 2xD6 battle with the K + UIM refits for the D6.
Anyhow, I'm having a blast and I've only held 1 training session so far. ;)
Session 2 went well. Just finished and I'd say since the other two guys were high fiving each other after scoring internals on me, that they enjoyed themselves.
For the record, they now know:
Basic Movement (including sideslips)
Everything about Phasers (except I don't think I mentioned they can be 'downfired'), Photons and Disruptors.
Type I and Type IV drones.
ADDs (and G Racks)
Labs (for identification of seeking weapons)
Very general ideas of 'uncontrolled' (told them how it happens when one of my ships took an inordinate number of control space hits in one volley - 3 out of 7 internals), sensor track and Klingon Mutiny.
I liked them commenting "Need more power... Mr. Scott, we need to go faster..." because I was able to bring up Mid Turn Speed Changes (unplotted even), and "Want to turn... NOW" which led to me mentioning HETs. They definitely want to know about HETs. One of them also asked specifically if shields could be repaired.
Next time I plan to add tractor beams (I would have when I brought up drones, except I forgot to mention it during Energy Allocation, and well, without scatterpacks they really didn't need to learn them quite yet).
Also will add HETs and probably shield repair. My goal is to get them out on a weekend when we can devote an afternoon to the game instead of 3 hours at a shot.
Then the next group of items to teach probably will be reserve energy, mid turn speed changes, CDR, and shield reinforcement (waiting to teach it so they get used to fighting at higher speeds).
That kind of feels like the elements that still produce a relatively streamlined version of the game. After that, things like shuttles (wild weasels, scatterpacks, suicide shuttles), transporter operations (including T-Bombs and hit and run raids but probably not boarding parties), tractoring enemy ships, etc will be next on the agenda.
But I gotta tell you, I like the 'simple version' of the game. It's refreshing to only have to worry about 'move and shoot' sometimes.
===
One reason FC is so much fun to play. Simpler,
faster, easier.
And as far as discovering the joys of teaching, woo hoo. It IS fun helping people learn, and
eventually to blow the crud out of the teacher.
I kind of guessed I'd get a FC comment on my above post.
I'm resisting buying it at the moment because, well, SFB is my current addiction and my budget can't support two. ;)
Also, it's pretty easy to come up with a 'stripped down' version of SFB (as I've discovered) if a simple 'move/shoot' game is desired.
Not to say that FC isn't a good game, I'm SURE it is. It sounds wonderful. Just that I think I can have both the streamlined and the meaty in SFB by itself.
Yep, it is fun to teach... but because of the staggering of trainees 'first times' it looks like I'll have to go through my spiel 4 times total.
Session 1: JG
Session 2: JM + JG
Session 3 (This Saturday): MD + JM
Sometime in the future: PL + any/all of the above trainees.
And I'm guessing the remaining two sessions will also be Fed/Klingon battles so by the time we finally get to new races I'll be very happy.
I'm still waiting for the REAL 'big moment'. When one of them asks "Ok, so where can I buy this stuff?".
One other area to look at is to let a player who already knows some stuff teach the newest player.
Robert: are you using minis yet? That will really get them sucked in...
MJC, thanks for the advice. I may definitely do that at the next session.
Greg, no miniatures yet, though I'm probably going to pick up the new Basic Set Counters (which I didn't know existed) as they're much nicer looking than the old set. I really don't have the space to use the larger maps so will be holding off on the miniatures.
My next purchases are going to be geared towards making things easier for the burgeoning gaming group, so I'll be picking up A++ (the three counter sheet version), R1 (which seems to have player aids) and the new style counters (R3 and R4 were next on my schedule, but by the time we need more ships than the Basic, Advanced and R2 sets, it'll be my next purchase date).
Im not sure what you mean by new style counters, but take a look at the megahex modules and the extra large color counters. next best thing to minis i think.
Session 3 went really well. An earlier comment by Michael really seemed prophetic when after explaining movement and combat, the guy said "This is Car Wars in space!" It also helped that he had recently picked up Advanced Squad Leader so was used to complex games...
We played for probably about 6-7 hours total and got two games in. I took a straight (unrefitted D6 except with the UIM refit) against a fully refitted (except for the AWR refit) Fed CA. He crushed me, mainly because I hadn't gotten the hang of maneuvering on a closed map with a Klingon. 50 points of damage internal in one Alpha Strike pretty much toasted me.
Game 2 we took the same ships, except I fully refitted the D6 and gave him the AWR refit. He grew to dislike drones, at least targeted on him. We weren't playing with scatterpacks or wild weasels. His first set of internals was only 4 this time, and he hit nothing of importance. My first set (gotta love UIM.. especially when it doesn't burn out all game) was probably the best I've ever rolled on a DAC. 11 hits, I think 8 were weapons or power (basically two 3's, two 11's, a 4, 5, 9 and 10).
That made me a bit too overconfident and instead of continuing to maneuver at range 5-8 I closed in to knife fight and in spite of hitting for around 20+ more internals (including a type I drone), I then took a 3 torp alpha strike through a weak shield. It was only 2 OLs but combined with his remaining phasers the D6 was very suddenly in much worse shape than the CA (I think it was 40 internals total).
I really had forgotten how much damage the CA can take and still be dangerous. At that point the battle was more or less over but we went through some slow moving (ships) yet quick turns until he blew me up.
With him, I taught:
Same information I taught the other two players
+
HETs
Shield Repair & CDR
Tractor Beams (for purposes of drones)
Shield Reinforcement
So... session 4 has the potential to be interesting...
Ideally I would have all 4 of the new players, but if I do, the mix would be me, MD (the guy I just trained who's a step beyond the rest now), JM and JG, and PL (never played).
Probably in that case, I'd teach PL directly in a duel and have the other three play a game out themselves. PL would pick up the game as quickly as MD I think so if it were over the weekend we'd probably have the whole group up to the same level.
Equally likely is my first three trainees. In that case I think it would probably be two teams with me and JG on one side, against JM and MD. One thing I'd think about doing would be to set it so that it'd really be two separate duels on the same map to prevent one person from being knocked out too quickly (likely me against MD to show the other two some of the better tactics to use, and JM vs JG).
The goal for session 4 is to get everyone on the same page, and just play for awhile using the currently taught set of rules.
Then for the next game, start adding new races. I figure whenever Kzinti are added would be a good time to teach scatterpacks + wild weasels + t-bombs. If Gorn are added instead, then it would be wild weasels + tractoring enemy ships + plasma. Will try to introduce Gorn before Romulans to avoid the added complication of the cloak. In any case, mid-turn speed changes will be taught midway through session 4, or at the start of session 5.
Chad,
If you order a set of extra countersheets on the starfleetgames store, you can get 'new style' counters for the Basic Set (only). These are basically Federation Commander style 1/2" counters.