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I'm talking about fleet battles. Feds will be fielding 16+ photons. There's a big difference between expecting 16 damage and expecting 42. Every shot drops a shield and forces the ship to either turn away or get Miziaed.

I'll have a similar number of QWTs.

By Richard Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Wednesday, December 28, 2022 - 06:30 pm: Edit

Close at high speed or disengage. Every time they have to turn away and then turn back towards you, you can close the range.

QWTs are hard to shoot down in quantity. Once you get close enough to get hits, it starts getting nasty.

Yeah, you'll take damage first, but there's nothing you can do to prevent that if you want to try to damage the Feds.

Stay on passive fire control as you close for the free EW. You may wish to power some ECM as well, as long as it doesn't cost you speed. Maybe burn batteries on the initial turns if it gets you more speed.

By Ginger McMurray (Gingermcmurray) on Wednesday, December 28, 2022 - 07:24 pm: Edit

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Quote:

Between both ships you have 12 control channels which means you can have two turns of QWTs on the board at any given time.

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By Gregory S Flusche (Vandar) on Wednesday, December 28, 2022 - 09:03 pm: Edit

I just went into SFBOL. I wanted to try something.

I think that the QWT is the best long-range plasma in the game. It will travel 30 hexes and still do 1 damage. 27-29 1-1-1. 22-26 1-2-1. Only a R can reach 30 hexes. The S 25 hexes. It still takes 6 phaser damage to take out the splash and 11 more to kill 1 damage point for the QWT. The S torp at 25 2 phaser to kill 1. at 24 10 to take out 5. But any damage reduces that warhead. Ships carry 2 S torps or 4 QWTs. The built in ECM also helps the QWTs take less damage from phasers unless the ship uses ECCM.

Plasma Torps and QWTs are not launched at the target but at were the target wants to be.

The Fed with overloads wants range 8. Meet him there with Your torps. Better would be range 9. The Fed wants range 12 for optimum Prox shot. Meet him at range 13.

In Your above post. Starting range 60. The Fed is going to get to range 30 fire 16 prox torps. Crashing a shield. Then run from the QWTs and reload.

Seeking weapons can be launched max range of 35. launch at 34 or 32. Then Slip away. The QWTs will close on the Feds. The Fed wants range 30. He moves forward. The Paravians keep out of range 30. The QWTs close. The Feds close. At any kind of speed the QWTs will hit at around 21 moves. In my run On SFBOL. They could hit at 19. Mind You that was the FED pushing forward to try and get range 30. Inside 21 moves that is 1-3-1 outside 1-2-1. 16 QWTs can hurt at that range.

The Fed can of course turn off. Run out the QWTs. But would never reach range 30 ever. That makes it a long-range phaser duel.

By Stewart Frazier (Frazikar3) on Wednesday, December 28, 2022 - 10:38 pm: Edit

Reserve Warp power in batteries, after the Fed turns off from firing, face and increase your speed to close that gap!

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Wednesday, December 28, 2022 - 11:36 pm: Edit

Bear in mind that passive fire control is only of use on turns you are too far away to consider launching QWTs. Despite being self-guiding seeking weapons, they still require the launching ship to have active fire control under (FQ1.312).

Although, if you aren't going to be launching on a given turn anyway, you should be able to maintain a high battle speed while under erratic maneuvers. One handy side-effect of "lost empire" Paravian ships having so many impulse boxes, perhaps.

Also, I was under the impression that the Range 35 thing is only for guided seeking weapons under (F3.31), with each type of self-guided seeking weapon having its own rules regarding how far away it can be launched.

On a somewhat related note, do you know if the Fed ships you are dealing with have any Type-III drones they can launch at you? If so, they could send waves of type-IIIs on ballistic courses towards you, while saving their control channels for fully guided (and/or ATG) drones to be launched once you close the distance.

One more note: if you do decide to close on a rearming turn, your ships have a lot more boarding parties than they do, though there aren't as many transporters by which to deploy them in open space (as opposed to landing their ships on planets and unloading them there once down). Still, if there are enough ships with working transporters close enough to threaten an enemy ship with hit-and-run raids - or even a boarding action - that might be an option to consider.

By Ginger McMurray (Gingermcmurray) on Thursday, December 29, 2022 - 02:32 am: Edit

The match ended. I took some damage as expected. No damage to enemy ships but that wasn't my goal. The goal was to cause economic damage by bombarding the planet and hitting some civilian ships.

I took more damage than I should have on a couple of ships by being miziaed. Part of it was lack of forethought on my part and turning at the wrong time. Part of it was just getting flustered at SFBOL. It's impossible for my brain to track things when there are 50 tokens on the board and the log window scrolls by too fast to read.

That's nothing to do with QWTs, though. At least they were easy. They don't worry about t-bombs so I could just stack them all on top of each other, select them all, click the move arrow, and chill.

My drone-using opponent had to duck and weave small stacks and single drones to make sure one t-bomb didn't get rid of them all. His drone game was absolutely beautiful to behold. Only a couple actually hit but I used every resource at my disposal to prevent it and he steered me around the board perfectly.

I think it would have been an amazing game in person.

By Richard Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Thursday, December 29, 2022 - 03:00 am: Edit

Do QWTs destroy drones automatically?

By Ginger McMurray (Gingermcmurray) on Thursday, December 29, 2022 - 09:58 am: Edit

No. But they do 6 damage inside range 14 and 7 within range 7.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Saturday, December 31, 2022 - 04:27 pm: Edit

On a side note: if "Mapsheet P" timeline Paravians were to find themselves participating in Operation Unity, they might find that their quantum wave torpedoes would be ill-suited to dealing with the outer shielding of Lesser Magellanic Cloud warships - for the same reason that PPDs are sub-optimal against the Volley Reduction Factor under (MD2.215).

Which of course is not a problem so long as the "lost empire" Paravians stay on script and focus their efforts on destroying the Andromedans. But it might be counter-productive for them if they end up deeming the reptilian Jumokians to be yet another "demon" species to add to their hit list...

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Speaking of Paravian tactics in faraway places: while it remains to be seen whether or not a new "update" file might provide a greater degree of context for the four antiproton variant hulls offered in playtest for the Omega-Paravians in Captain's Log #54 - to include specifying whether or not any of the rules and SSDs in Module C6 can be "double-dipped" for use in the Omega Octant - it is possible to line up certain Omega empires as likely opponents for playtesters to consider trying out against them:

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Trobrin: As shown on the five Omega hex maps, the primary threat to the Omega-Paravians prior to the Andromedan and Souldra invasions was from the silicate Trobrin Empire. However, in the subsequent Seventh Cycle, the Paravians would provide support to the Trobrin in their latest war with the salamander-like Probr.

As with plasma empires in the Alpha Octant, the Trobrin have less powerful implosion torpedoes on their Size Class 4 ships. The direct-fire implosion bolt is equally dangerous on large or small ships, however.

Also, there is a warp refit offered for the playtest Trobrin early command cruiser in the recently-uploaded Captain's Log #52. Were such warp refits to become more widely available to the Trobrin fleet, this might make life more complicated for any opposing Omega-Paravian warships.

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Probr: While the Probr are amphibians rather than reptiles, I wouldn't be surprised if they were considered "close enough" to warrant a slot on the Paravians' list of "demon" species to be destroyed. Either way, as noted above, the Probr-Trobrin War of Y214-Y220 sees the Paravians launch relentless raids into Probr territory - raids which continued even after the Trobrin Empire itself agreed to an armistice.

If one were to assume that the Omega-Paravians use the same quantum wave torpedoes as their "lost empire" counterparts, one might then consider what a duel between the QWT and the Probr high energy acceptance torpedo might look like. Not least in terms of determining whether it would be more effective for the Probr to accentuate their HEATs and use their TAs to guide them to their targets, or to use standard HEATs (and skip arming the TAs) in order to spend that power elsewhere.

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FRA: With a number of "demonic" reptilian species acquiring Federal Republic of Aurora citizenship over time, no doubt the Omega-Paravians take a dim view of their fellow "blow-ins" from the Alpha Octant. Indeed, once the Aurorans begin to intervene on behalf of the Probr in their war with the Trobrin during the Seventh Cycle, the odds of these empires running into one another would shorten dramatically.

Short-range cannons are useless against QWTs, but there are FRA ships which swap their SRCs out for tachyon missile racks. A mix of phaser-1s, light photons, disruptors, and TM-B racks might make an FRA destroyer squadron a challenging prospect. And if six standard photons on a Fed DNG wasn't dangerous enough, how about the four standard and two heavy photons on an FRA dreadnought?

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Mæsron: The Mæsron "New Alliance" was dragged into the Probr-Trobrin War of the Seventh Cycle against is wishes, but that didn't prevent the Paravians from sending large reconnaissance-in-force squadrons into Mæsron space.

In theory, QWTs could be used to target tachyon missiles. In practice, each TM would need more killing than an equivalent Alpha Octant drone - not least if the Mæsron player is paying for various missile upgrades.

Plus, the tachyon gun is more accurate and more flexible than the altered-scale photons being used by the FRA.

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Souldra: On the one hand, the "splash" elements of QWTs could be used to try and oblige a Souldra opponent to keep from bunching their soul shield blocks in one or two facings.

But on the other hand, there are all the other things the Souldra bring to the table (DMPs, DMTs, Shards, etc.) which might give even the Omega-Paravians nightmares. Not least since all those Paravian Marine squads only serve as fodder for Black Shard vampirism...

Indeed, one might wonder if the adoption of antiproton technology in the Seventh Cycle was in no small part a reaction to their experience with the Souldra (and, for that matter, the Andromedans), as much as it was at planning ahead for new wars against more "traditional" Omega powers.

By Gregory S Flusche (Vandar) on Thursday, January 12, 2023 - 07:10 pm: Edit

I am playing a campaign where I am playing the Paravians. I am wondering if it would be worth buying a carrier group.

The first thing I noticed. Was the need for Escorts. Most have a DWE are FFE. The bigger carriers can have a CWE. All of the escorts have 2 QWTs. The carriers have the same amount of QWTs as the class of ship they are a variant of.

A DWV 105 BPV 3 QWTs. 8 quail fighters. (one cane be a EW fighter).74 BPV.
DWE 104 BPV 2 QWTs.
DW 99 BPV 3 QWTs.

Total 382 BPV 8 QWTs, 7 quail fighters 14QWTs. (Launched all at once or over time)

A DWL 108 BPV 4QWTs
DW 99 BPV 3 QWTs
DW 99 BPV 3 QWTs

Total 306 BPV 10 QWTs.

The carrier group has 2 less QWTs than the standard group and costs more in BPV. It does have 14 QWTs on the fighters. I could launch 1 fighter and then have 10 QWTs. The QWTs on the fighters operate just like the ones on the ships. Except they cannot be overloaded. Quail fighters are speed 15.

There is a higher turn launch rate of QWTs but then reloading the fighters drops it. I think if I launch a few fighters at a time. Could Stretch out the number of QWTs from the fighters.

Anyone else pros cons please.

By Ginger McMurray (Gingermcmurray) on Thursday, January 12, 2023 - 08:04 pm: Edit

What are the campaign rules for replacing fighters?

By Gregory S Flusche (Vandar) on Thursday, January 12, 2023 - 08:48 pm: Edit

In this one of Matts there is no cost for replacement fighters.

By wayne douglas power (Wayne) on Thursday, January 12, 2023 - 10:00 pm: Edit

Greg,

The carrier group is a good one the standard group could have an FF+ (74) added to force total = 379, closer to your carrier groups 382 bpv, or perhaps an FFS+ for 81 would be useful (depending on your opponents and the scenario battle).

By Jeff Guthridge (Jeff_Guthridge) on Friday, January 13, 2023 - 07:04 am: Edit

Greg, looks like you’ve found a good base to experiment from. The fighters should probably try something akin to a “Kings Line” style attack while the carrier and escorts stay back a bit.

QWTs are rather hard to put down, but don’t do all that much damage, particularly if they have to run a ways to find their targets. Overwhelming salvos are nice in theory, but practically guarantee the target weasels. So it’s a balancing act. Enough QWTs on target to keep pressure up vs not so many to make weaseling attractive. The Konga Line fighter attack plays into this.

The fact that fighters are replaced ‘free’ in this campaign is nice because the carrier group itself can wade in after the fighters expend themselves softening up the enemy.

By Mike Grafton (Mike_Grafton) on Friday, January 13, 2023 - 07:49 am: Edit

I don't remember off hand, but how much energy do QWT cost for fighter reloads? 1 per charge?

By Gregory S Flusche (Vandar) on Friday, January 13, 2023 - 06:16 pm: Edit

Matts campaigns are very heavily automated. Everyone starts with so many borders with other players. Each turn starts with the bidding phase. The program randomly sets up the scenarios for each border. Each scenario has its own victory conditions. Awards for the victor can be a border with that player or a random new border. Economic points for or Income points for the winner. There can also be -Economic points, Income points or loss of a border for the defender.

You have your fleet (pool of ships) that you then assign to each border/scenario you want to fight. Ships can be crippled. They may be sent back for repairs/upgrades. Then not available for that turn. The ships you send must make a legal fleet by S8. Some scenarios may also limit ships and give ships or units.

You also purchase new ships or upgrade/repair existing ships.

Then there is the combat phase. You play out the battles that the scenarios provide. We use SFBOL for the battles most times.

Mike:
A QWT for fighters are treated like Disrupters. 2 points to arm one QWT in the reload box. They are loaded with 1 per deck crew action.

I do not mind someone weaseling QWTs. More so in fact if I have another wave ready to launch that turn. Even without the second wave. The ships will be slow, and Overloads can then be used as well on the next turn. Unlike plasma torpedoes QWTs can be launched every turn.

The Kongo line does seem to be a good plan. I am worried about using FFEs. They can easily be crippled with mass fire at long range. Historically the carriers all have at least one FFE/FFA as escort. Then a DWE/DWA or the size class 3 a CWE/CWA. With the Flexable escort rules used in F&E. I could use a DWE/DWA as the size class 4 escort.

At this point I am thinking I will try a carrier group. The size depending on the cost and how many EPs I have next turn.

By Ginger McMurray (Gingermcmurray) on Saturday, January 14, 2023 - 01:25 pm: Edit

I'd absolutely go with the fighters and free replacements.

By Gregory S Flusche (Vandar) on Thursday, November 07, 2024 - 09:26 pm: Edit

Playing the Paravians. I have noticed that all of the ships except the DN and raid mother ships. (I am not using the raid mother ships) Have a B turn Mode. Most races I have played have varying turn modes by size class. The size class 3 normally being one higher than the size class 4. While the small FFs are even Nimble and have an A turn mode.

I have found this makes maneuvering groups of mixed ships easier. With long-range launching of QWTs. The smaller ships are less susceptible to mass fire.

The DW is almost as good as the LC. It does have fewer phasers but the same amount of QWTs. It also costs more in BPV.

This also brings me to another problem I am having. In Y123 The HC comes in at 120 BPV. The Gorn CA is also 120 BPV. (no refits) In Y170 the Gorn CA gets the + refit jumping the BPV to 146. The Paravian CA gets 2 APR for 122 BPV. Then the Gorn CA becomes the BC and has 160 BPV. A 58-point difference in BPV. Now the Gorn LC with refits is 122 BPV and the HDD is 117 BPV. Match ups can be made.

The ISC Y168 for the PPDs. The CC 208 with no Plas-F. The CA 173 BPV. Between 51 and 86 BPV difference. If You add the partial F refit. a few BPV more. Even the LC is 137BPV.

This brings me back to the above. I can buy escorting DD are DWs. to make up the difference. Perhaps even a LC.

We do try to limit the ships to three are four ships a side or single ship duels. The paravian CC is 135 BPV. I can get an FF but io find it is more a liability then some help 2 PPDs and it is in bad shape. I can buy a HC and LC and that seems to work better. Against the CA I am back down to a DD or FF escort. With only one PPD not so bad.

So, rounding up BPV and including the cost of Commanders options. Does give me stronger ships.

any thoughts

By Gregory S Flusche (Vandar) on Sunday, November 10, 2024 - 01:43 pm: Edit

Paravians

My first thought was somehow firing a wave of QWTs. late in the turn. Then follow up with a early wave next turn. Forcing the other player to deal with two waves.

What normally happens is that I get the first wave off. After corning diving. The ISC or Gorns who I am playing against. Eat the first wave a lot of times on an AFT shield. Blast me with the PPD and launch Plasma or the Gorn may bolt inside range 10. Then run out the second wave. I then have to deal with incoming plasma. Close to the edge of the map. With a larger map or starting from opposite ends of the map does give me some room to run. This still does not work well. Versus a direct fire race, it is even worse. They have a damaged shield and I have a down shield and internals. As a determined player will get into overload range. Unless I run away with my aft end to them. I run out of room to run.

What is working is launching my QWTs at range 21 from the target. If the target turns to evade the long-range shot. Then I can turn in after and launch next turn with the target near the map edge. Depending on where I can even launch overloads. That also leaves me plenty of room to avoid incoming plasma. If the target Flies to go through the QWTs. I can get them to hit a forward shield. At any kind of closing speed, I find the QWTs hitting in the 8-14 range doing 1-4-1 and overloads still hitting. The target can slip over or even turn to take the QWTs on the AFT shields and increase the range bracket. To 15-21 still doing 1-3-1.

In the case of pushing thru the QWTs and front shield damage I then can fire my phasers on the damaged shield. I tend to take more damage then. On the next turn I get my revenge with close range QWTs.

If they slip out and fire the PPD or as the Gorn launch plasma. We end up in the circle of death. Target turns right I turn right now out of each other's FA. I am running out the plasma. Still with more room to run then before.

not sure if this helps amy one with Paravians.