| By Jason E. Schaff (Jschaff297061) on Saturday, April 18, 2026 - 10:46 am: Edit |
In later time periods, the Orions build bases up to the size of BATS, also supporting the conclusion that bases can be build without tugs, LTTs, etc.
| By Mike Grafton (Mike_Grafton) on Sunday, April 19, 2026 - 11:24 am: Edit |
I say that the MB was just the end result of earlier MB like pods. Maybe a 4 space pod equivalent toted by a "ore carrier" or equivalent.
| By Mike Grafton (Mike_Grafton) on Monday, April 20, 2026 - 07:56 am: Edit |
Maybe these darn things got bigger and better as time went on.
So you started with a militarized Complat. Then you got a thing designed to be built around a double size pod core module. Then more and more stuff.
I don't have a great mental picture in my head, but I can't imagine that these are "stick built" on site using plates and beams, all the stuff installed, etc.
So much better to be building modules at a "major" world or shipyard and just plugging them together out in the boonies where you need your base. Not least because at your shipyard you don't have to dorm your workers, have all the random specialist engineers on site for the year it takes to plug & integrate the systems, store all those random "long lead time" widgets on site...
As SVC knows, there are ALWAYS tidbits you got to have or everything comes to a halt. Often these are doorframes, custom beams, imbeds, etc.
For example on a modern construction job, the HVAC ventilation ducts are NOT fabricated on site mostly. "Tin knockers" are perfectly able to do so, but they can crank out the pieces in their shop more efficiently. BTW, "Sheet metal mechanics" don't get anything like the respect they deserve. They can do some really clever stuff. And generally speaking they actually design their own ductwork using the "prints" as a guideline. But they do their own flow calculations, size the ducts...
Another example, in Afghanistan I was responsible for building the first "Permanent' quarters (aka CHUs) in late 2005. Sure we could have locals build them of Concrete blocks, mud bricks, repurposed Connex containers, but we got knocked down Container houses delivered by flatbed. Basically the floor was prebuilt and wall sections were stood up on it. Then roof built out of prefab components. Caulk, electrical work and AC units... I got made the construction superintendent because no one else on site had ever been any kind of construction manager... I mean, I had worked as safety guy on construction projects and attended all the meetings, walked the site with the real foremen & superintendents, etc.
I have a picture on one of my instructables of me and Adrian (rhe CORs guy) https://www.instructables.com/The-Awesome-Fail-Power-of-living-working-overseas/ section 7, pic 7 going to ream out a LN crew...
| By Mike West (Mjwest) on Monday, April 20, 2026 - 04:04 pm: Edit |
i honestly though that mobile bases were considered an innovation that changed how war worked. Their development was the enabler of the all-out war that settled in after its invention. I would think that making earlier versions of it would destroy that framework. So, I am struggling to understand this entire conversation.
| By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Monday, April 20, 2026 - 09:29 pm: Edit |
Mike, this happens when people do not know the history.
They are approaching the problem knowing the solution, and assuming that the same solution in the General War years automatically applies to earlier times.
| By Steve Petrick (Petrick) on Tuesday, April 21, 2026 - 03:31 pm: Edit |
Something applied to earlier years as the Lyran empire was able to destroy the nascent Peladine republic, the Hydran kingdom was able to destroy the Borak star league, the Hydran kingdom itself was conquered by the Klingon empire and liberated from the Klingon empire, the Lyran empire and the Kzinti hegemony conquered (or at least drove of the Carnivon hordes, the Paravian raiders were destroyed by the Corn confederation. So, something enabled these wars. I will add that the Jindarians are still hiding from whatever overcame there eruption into space, and who knows how long ago that was.
| By Mike West (Mjwest) on Thursday, April 23, 2026 - 10:33 am: Edit |
SPP,
Now I'm really confused, as my understanding came from you. So, either you've decided that needs to change, or I completely misunderstood all this time. If it was the latter, then earlier mobile bases would have already been published, at least in a CL. So, I'm going with changed?
Anyway, when I say "all-out war" I mean what happened in the General War. The General War was presented as a fundamental shift from how wars had happened prior to it. The 4PW was the "prototype" of the General War that laid its foundation and was the proving ground for the new logistics patterns. The General War was the full implementation of it. The Andromedan War was the further development of it.
War obviously still happened before it, but its nature was fundamentally different. In those cases, empires seemed to need to take over locations quickly and efficiently, turn the former enemy locations into the required logistics nodes. Mobile bases changed things by allowing the navies to very quickly build their own logistics nodes extremely quickly. Or, more importantly, rebuild their own nodes when they were destroyed.
In all of your example, except for the Hydrans and Jindos, the defeated party was basically limited to a single world. Take it out and you win. Bye Bye Peladine, Borak, and Paravians. Even limited logistics works for those efforts. And for the efforts of other conquered empires that haven't been detailed yet. The Jindos don't count, as they have their own means of logistics that are unique to them and not used by anyone else.
The main counter example would be the Hydrans. However, they aren't as much of an issue because of the Lyrans. The Lyrans are close enough to all of the on-map Hydran areas such that they could provide the necessary forward support from their forward bases. The Hydran territory just isn't that "deep", and existing logistics networks could be stretched just enough to cover all of the Hydran's on-map area. This also explains why the off-map areas were untouched: That extended past what could be supported. If they had mobile bases, then the Hydrans could have been completely conquered, because they would have been able to extend their network as far as desired. Without that, they were limited to as far as their existing structures could support: the "map edge".
And, in all of the examples above, the victors never suffered significant loses. Maybe they lose a base here and there, but nothing that removes their ability to push the war forward. In the Hydran example, the Hydrans were not able to take out all of the Lyran border bases. Without that, the Lyrans always maintained their ability to project power into all of of the on-map Hydran space. Contrast that with the Federation in the GW where they lost all of their border BATS (and the linch-pin SB) pretty much immediately. Under the old paradigm, they could only hope to defend what was left and maybe push back to the original borders. With mobile bases, they can keep pushing forward. Past that, allowing them to take up the offensive when the opportunity arose. (Now, they didn't seem to have any interest in taking over enemy territory permanently, but they needed that ability to project further to drive the enemy back.)
Also, it is my understanding that the mobile base wasn't a technological innovation so much as a tactical innovation. Sure, there could have been earlier mobile bases, but they just weren't thought of or made. That is also why they were developed by everyone pretty much at the same time. Once the idea was discovered, it was trivial for everyone to use the idea and build on it.
Anyway, the published history has no need of earlier mobile bases and making earlier mobile bases breaks or at least significantly changes the established history. Are they really necessary? Or even useful to the setting?
| By Steve Petrick (Petrick) on Thursday, April 23, 2026 - 01:25 pm: Edit |
Mike West:
I am not saying that there were earlier mobile bases or otherwise saying they are unnecessary to the game background. What I am saying was that something made conquest possible. It may have been the establishment and defense of forward bases. Maybe you identified a small empire (e.g., Peladine) beyond the fringes of your empire (in this case, the Lyran empire). You desire (no specific reason is provided) to incorporate it into your empire. So you build the logistics to attack it and incorporate it into your empire. It may have taken you a few years to prepare the attack, but you are an empire and if nothing else is diverting your attention (dealing with the Carnivons for example, or a war with the Kzintis, or perhaps the Klingons) you have all the time in the universe. In the case of the Peladine, they apparently did not notice you establishing a logistics node close enough to invade them, and history is what history is. Note that the Borak more or less invited the Hydran empire to establish logistics nodes throughout their space, and oops the Hydrans decided to move on the Borak first. Like I have previously indicated, there is a mystery how this all happened in the case of the Carnivons and Paravians, but a little thought allows the development of logistics chains where needed. The General War with more or less fixed borders which proscribed new logistics nodes outside of captured planets with will developed resources is where mobile bases come in.
| By Mike West (Mjwest) on Thursday, April 23, 2026 - 04:03 pm: Edit |
SPP,
Cool. I think we're either on the same page or close enough. Thank you for the additional explanation
| By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Thursday, April 23, 2026 - 09:34 pm: Edit |
In the case of the Carnivons, any logistical concerns on the part of the Kzintis and Lyrans to end their historical presence in the Alpha Octant was no doubt aided by the chronic lack of unity - or even of solidarity - between the various hordes.
While a handful of historical attempts were made to bring two or more hordes into a temporary coalition, and one more far-reaching effort was made to leverage such a pact towards a more lasting political union across Carnivon space, the "default" status was that each horde would stand - and, alas, fall - on its own terms. Thus, once the Kzintis and Lyrans realized that they could destroy each horde one at a time, their operational burdens were lessened considerably, even with the constraints of Y-era Alpha logistical nodes in place.
Notably, the "Carnivon Empire" timeline in Module C6 demonstrates how differently things might have gone had the hordes been brought into a single government. Despite the relatively small size of the "on-map" Carnivon holdings relative to those of the Kzintis and Lyrans, this would nonetheless have been enough to keep the feline empires at bay - so long as the Carnivons paid heed to the lesson that theirs would have to be purely defensive wars, lest an over-extension on one border fatally weaken another.
Although, as noted elsewhere, I think it would be interesting to speculate on a "lost empire" timeline in which the Klingons formed a Coalition with the Carnivons, rather than either the Kzintis or the Lyrans...
But at least, for any Carnivon exiles who might well have survived the fall, there was a more distant place for them to potentially escape to, where such lessons could be pondered upon in the face of new and unexpected struggles for survival.
-----
Meanwhile, the Paravians were themselves divided into five major continental tribes, which were only loosely governed by the Wingword (or central government). Indeed, it would appear that there was no such thing as a unified Early Years Paravian navy; each tribe handled its own deep space operations more or less independently, with little outside oversight.
Furthermore, with four of the five tribes dismissing the prospect of building extra-solar colonies or permanent deep-range bases, the long-distance raiding forces being sent into Gorn space would have to make it all the way back to the home system in order to be upgraded or refitted - most notably during the fateful transition to tactical warp drive and to "warp-class" weaponry.
This had a number of major operational and strategic consequences. Even with access to command ships with flag bridges, they seemingly never fielded a battle force with a "full" (by Gorn or Romulan standards) complement of warships in a single battle - not even in the defence of Paravia. Also, since the Gorns were able to use their forward fleet installations to facilitate their own upgrade to tactical warp drive, and since they had a unified navy to direct their operations, they managed to chase down and destroy a large number of Paravian raiding forces before they could be recalled and refitted. In so doing, they decisively altered the strategic balance on the Paravian front in their favour.
These factors, combined with Gorn victory in the Second Gorn-Romulan War, enabled the Gorns to begin the long and inexorable march to the Paravian home world.
Of course, the leader of the fifth tribe, Marengo Firecloud Wildfeather, had tried to convince his fellows of the need to take a different approach. Had he succeeded (or, in another timeline, had he not needed to), the resulting "Mapsheet P" would have emerged, no doubt to the chagrin of the Gorns and the ISC. Yet even then, it would not be until a near-miss involving a certain Sun Snake at the home system before these Paravians took serious heed of the need to "formalize" their fleet operations to something approaching the Alpha Octant norm, to include more heavily fortifying their core holdings as a backstop to their more aggressive campaigns going forward.
But even in failure, he was able to take steps to secure the future of his people, primarily through the hidden establishment of a "far nest" at Wingatha - where the exiles might have chosen to stay and prepare themselves to once again act as long-distance raiders, but instead decided to pack up once again, in hopes of one day making a new home for themselves on the other side of the Alpha/Omega Void.
| By Ken Kazinski (Kjkazinski) on Thursday, June 11, 2026 - 08:31 pm: Edit |
I was reviewing the Andromedan Order of Battle from (R10.1E). The rule states that in Y165 there are 6 Intruders, 1 Infestor, 4 Couriers and 20 Vipers. I cannot account for the 2 of the 4 Courier from production or arrivals. Where did the additional 2 Couriers come from?
| Int | Inf | Viper | Courier | |||||||||
| Year | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total |
| 158 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 3 | 3 | 1 | 1 | |||||
| 159 | 1 | 2 | 0 | 3 | 6 | 1 | 2 | |||||
| 160 | 2 | 1 | 1 | 6 | 2 | |||||||
| 161 | 1 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 7 | 2 | ||||||
| 162 | 1 | 4 | 1 | 1 | 8 | 2 | ||||||
| 163 | 1 | 5 | 1 | 1 | 3 | 12 | 2 | |||||
| 164 | 0 | 5 | 1 | 1 | 3 | 16 | 2 | |||||
| 165 | 1 | 6 | 1 | 1 | 3 | 20 | 2 |
| By Mike Grafton (Mike_Grafton) on Friday, June 12, 2026 - 12:11 pm: Edit |
The easy answer would be that in Y164 a Intruder or Infestor arrived wuth its Sat SHips and something bad happened. Like it met up with a Whole family of Space Dragons and just a couple couriers escaped.
| By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Friday, June 12, 2026 - 06:07 pm: Edit |
I'm not entirely sure I'd be in too much of a hurry to lean into that provisional order of battle, as printed in Module C2.
For one thing, there's the Magellanic history from Module C5 to consider: before any Andromedan warships can be placed in the Alpha Octant, or even along the three Rapid Transit Network routes which historically ran from the LMC to Alpha itself, the invaders would have needed to complete their "first wave" of conquest within the Cloud proper.
For another, there's a difference between how many Andromedan ships were sent to the LMC via the Intergalactic Trunk Line from M31 overall, and how many of those were assigned to what one might perhaps refer to as the "Alpha Octant Theatre Command" in particular - as opposed to those kept in reserve within the LMC proper, as well as those assigned to the campaign over in the Omega Octant.
Plus, even in Alpha, there's a broader range of units from Module C3 onwards which would have to be accounted for: not least, in terms of deciding which ones can be built "locally" (either at construction battle stations, or at one of the Desecrators themselves) and which are required to be brought in along the ITL directly.
Although, it's one thing to say as much in hindsight, after First Contacts in both the LMC and in Omega allowed for a more nuanced accounting to be made. It's another to consider the many challenges faced by those in the Alpha Octant prior to this.
Even so, while it is interesting to consider the historiography of the Andromedan War from an in-universe perspective, there might need to be a more thorough reappraisal of what the Andromedan OOB can be, from a campaign compatibility perspective.
| By Ken Kazinski (Kjkazinski) on Friday, June 12, 2026 - 06:08 pm: Edit |
What is the starting year for (U6.0) Operation Unity?
Based on "The operation took two years, leading to final victory in Y202", I am thinking the start of the scenario is Y200.
| By Ken Kazinski (Kjkazinski) on Friday, June 12, 2026 - 06:10 pm: Edit |
Gary - The listing is for the forces in the Lesser Magellanic Cloud, not the Alpha quadrant.
| By Ken Kazinski (Kjkazinski) on Friday, June 12, 2026 - 06:14 pm: Edit |
Mike (R10.1E) does state the Intruder was lost enroute or in the Cloud. I would tend to think in the Cloud or the number of Vipers would not be correct.
| By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Friday, June 12, 2026 - 06:41 pm: Edit |
Even in the case of the Andromedan ships in the LMC, the data from Module C2 has since been superseded by the data in Module C5.
For example: the year of first arrival in the C5 timeline is Y138, with the completion of the first Desecrator in Y145. This is much earlier than the arrival date that had previously been listed in C2, and accounts for the need for the invaders to have waged war against the Magellanic Powers in a time frame which still allowed for them to begin the process of establishing the Alpha and Omega RTNs in the "proper" time frame.
Furthermore, at the time C2 was first published, only one Desecrator was known to historically exist: that which was destroyed in the final act of Operation Unity.
As per C5 (and as per the Sixth Cycle history in the 2011 Omega Master Rulebook), there are four known Desecrators.
The first was completed in the LMC in Y145 and destroyed by the Magellanic Powers in Y154.
The second was completed in the LMC in Y152, damaged (but not destroyed) in Y163, left unrepaired until Y200 (when it was tasked with constructing a Devastator), and destroyed (along with the incomplete battleship) during Operation Unity.
The third was completed in the LMC in Y158 and became "the" Desecrator by the time of Operation Unity.
And a fourth was put under construction in the Iridani Cluster at some point after the Andros conquered this region in Y193; it was still in an incomplete state when it was destroyed by the Iridani during the Grand Quest of Y195-197.
-----
As for Operation Unity itself, the year in which it was launched is set at Y200.
-----
I should note that I tried to take account of the above when writing the A Brief History of the Andromedan War datafile from Captain's Log #49. How well I managed to do so is, of course, a matter I leave to those who have read, or who might one day read, this document for themselves someday...
| By Ken Kazinski (Kjkazinski) on Friday, June 12, 2026 - 07:11 pm: Edit |
Hi Gary,
I understand the data changed in C5, but I would still like to know in the context of C2 where the other 2 Courier's came from.
| By Ken Kazinski (Kjkazinski) on Friday, June 12, 2026 - 07:57 pm: Edit |
Reviewing the data from C5, starting in Y138, shows almost the same data as in C2. If C2 start is Y138 and not Y158, then both would be mostly correct. With the exception of the Couriers.
| Desecrator | Intruder | Infestor | Viper | Courier | |||||||||||
| Year | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total |
| 138 | 0 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 3 | 3 | 1 | 1 | |||||||
| 139 | 0 | 1 | 2 | 0 | 3 | 6 | 1 | 2 | |||||||
| 140 | 0 | 2 | 1 | 1 | 6 | 2 | |||||||||
| 141 | 0 | 1 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 7 | 2 | ||||||||
| 142 | 0 | 1 | 4 | 1 | 1 | 8 | 2 | ||||||||
| 143 | 0 | 1 | 5 | 1 | 1 | 9 | 2 | ||||||||
| 144 | 0 | 1 | 6 | 1 | 1 | 10 | 2 | ||||||||
| 145 | 1 | 1 | 6 | 1 | 10 | 2 |
| By Ken Kazinski (Kjkazinski) on Saturday, June 13, 2026 - 10:25 am: Edit |
I put together the information from C5 and using the table from (R10.1E) but adjusting to start at Y138 instead of Y158 (-20). I kept the 2 additional Couriers as production to align with the (R10.1E) Y158 Order of Battle.
| Desecrator | Devastator | Dominator | Intruder | Infestor | Conquistador | Python | Viper | Cobra | Terminator | Mamba | Courier | Energy Module | Medium Cargo Pod | Pseudo-Satillite Ships | Satellite Bases | Super Energy Modules | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Year | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Losses | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Total | Arrival | Production | Losses | Total | Arrival | Production | Losses | Total | Notes |
| 138 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 3 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 139 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 6 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 140 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 6 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 141 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 3 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 7 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 142 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 4 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 8 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 143 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 5 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 3 | 12 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 3 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 12 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 144 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | -1 | 5 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 3 | 16 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 24 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 145 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 6 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 3 | 20 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 36 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 146 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 7 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 23 | 3 | 3 | 0 | 0 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 48 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 147 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 8 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 26 | 3 | 6 | 0 | 0 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 60 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 148 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 9 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 29 | 3 | 9 | 0 | 0 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 72 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 149 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 10 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 32 | 3 | 12 | 0 | 0 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 84 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 150 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 11 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 35 | 3 | 15 | 0 | 0 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 96 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 151 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 12 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 3 | 38 | 4 | 6 | 25 | 0 | 1 | 1 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 108 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 152 | 1 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 13 | 1 | 1 | 2 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 41 | 4 | 6 | 35 | 0 | 1 | 2 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 120 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 153 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 14 | 1 | 1 | 3 | 1 | 3 | 3 | 44 | 4 | 6 | 45 | 0 | 1 | 3 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 132 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 154 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 15 | 1 | 1 | 4 | 1 | 4 | 3 | 47 | 4 | 6 | 55 | 0 | 1 | 4 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 144 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 155 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 16 | 1 | 1 | 5 | 1 | 5 | 3 | 50 | 4 | 6 | 65 | 0 | 1 | 5 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 156 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 156 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 18 | 1 | 1 | 6 | 3 | 8 | 50 | 8 | 12 | 85 | 0 | 3 | 8 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 168 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 157 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 20 | 1 | 2 | 8 | 3 | 11 | 50 | 8 | 12 | 105 | 0 | 3 | 11 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 180 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 158 | 1 | 3 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 22 | 1 | 2 | 10 | 3 | 14 | 50 | 8 | 12 | 125 | 0 | 3 | 14 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 192 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 159 | 3 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 24 | 1 | 2 | 12 | 3 | 17 | 50 | 8 | 12 | 145 | 0 | 3 | 17 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 204 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 160 | 3 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 26 | 1 | 2 | 14 | 3 | 20 | 50 | 8 | 12 | 165 | 0 | 3 | 20 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 3 | 12 | 216 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 161 | 3 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 28 | 1 | 2 | 16 | 3 | 23 | 50 | 8 | 12 | 185 | 0 | 3 | 23 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 6 | 12 | 228 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 162 | 3 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 30 | 1 | 2 | 18 | 3 | 26 | 50 | 8 | 12 | 205 | 0 | 3 | 26 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 9 | 12 | 240 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 163 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 2 | 32 | 1 | 2 | 20 | 3 | 29 | 50 | 8 | 12 | 225 | 0 | 3 | 29 | 4 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 12 | 12 | 252 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 164 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 3 | -1 | 34 | 1 | 5 | 25 | 5 | 34 | 50 | 16 | 12 | 253 | 1 | 1 | 2 | 6 | 37 | 4 | 6 | 6 | 6 | 6 | 3 | 15 | 12 | -4 | 260 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||
| 165 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 37 | 1 | 5 | 30 | 5 | 39 | 50 | 16 | 12 | 281 | 1 | 2 | 2 | 6 | 45 | 4 | 6 | 12 | 6 | 12 | 3 | 18 | 12 | 272 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 166 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 3 | 3 | 40 | 1 | 5 | 35 | 5 | 44 | 50 | 16 | 12 | 309 | 1 | 3 | 2 | 6 | 53 | 4 | 6 | 18 | 6 | 18 | 3 | 21 | 12 | 284 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 167 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 4 | 3 | 43 | 1 | 5 | 40 | 5 | 49 | 50 | 16 | 12 | 337 | 1 | 4 | 2 | 6 | 61 | 4 | 6 | 24 | 6 | 24 | 3 | 24 | 12 | 296 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 168 | 3 | 1 | 2 | 6 | 8 | 51 | 1 | 10 | 50 | 10 | 59 | 50 | 38 | 18 | 393 | 2 | 6 | 4 | 9 | 74 | 4 | 6 | 30 | 6 | 30 | 3 | 27 | 12 | 308 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 169 | 3 | 1 | 2 | 8 | 8 | 59 | 1 | 10 | 60 | 10 | 69 | 50 | 38 | 18 | 449 | 2 | 8 | 4 | 9 | 87 | 4 | 6 | 36 | 6 | 36 | 3 | 30 | 12 | 320 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 170 | 3 | 1 | 2 | 10 | 8 | 67 | 1 | 10 | 70 | 10 | 79 | 50 | 38 | 18 | 505 | 2 | 10 | 4 | 9 | 100 | 4 | 6 | 42 | 6 | 42 | 3 | 33 | 12 | 332 | 0 | The Andromedans first send forces to Milky Way. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 171 | 3 | 1 | 2 | 12 | 8 | 75 | 1 | 10 | 80 | 10 | 89 | 50 | 38 | 18 | 561 | 2 | 12 | 4 | 9 | 113 | 4 | 6 | 48 | 6 | 48 | 3 | 36 | 12 | 344 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 172 | 3 | 1 | 2 | 14 | 8 | 83 | 1 | 10 | 90 | 10 | 99 | 50 | 38 | 18 | 617 | 2 | 14 | 4 | 9 | 126 | 4 | 6 | 54 | 6 | 54 | 3 | 39 | 12 | 356 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 173 | 3 | 1 | 2 | 16 | 8 | 91 | 1 | 10 | 100 | 10 | 109 | 50 | 38 | 18 | 673 | 2 | 16 | 4 | 9 | 139 | 4 | 6 | 60 | 6 | 60 | 3 | 42 | 12 | 368 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 174 | 3 | 1 | 2 | 18 | 8 | 99 | 1 | 10 | 110 | 10 | 119 | 50 | 38 | 18 | 729 | 2 | 18 | 4 | 9 | 152 | 4 | 6 | 66 | 6 | 66 | 3 | 45 | 12 | 380 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 175 | 3 | 1 | 2 | 20 | 8 | 107 | 1 | 10 | 120 | 10 | 129 | 50 | 38 | 18 | 785 | 2 | 20 | 4 | 9 | 165 | 4 | 6 | 72 | 6 | 72 | 3 | 48 | 12 | 392 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 176 | 3 | 1 | 2 | 22 | 8 | 115 | 1 | 10 | 130 | 10 | 139 | 50 | 38 | 18 | 841 | 2 | 22 | 4 | 9 | 178 | 4 | 6 | 78 | 6 | 78 | 3 | 51 | 12 | 404 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 177 | 3 | 1 | 2 | 24 | 8 | 123 | 1 | 10 | 140 | 10 | 149 | 50 | 38 | 18 | 897 | 2 | 24 | 4 | 9 | 191 | 4 | 6 | 84 | 6 | 84 | 3 | 54 | 12 | 416 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 178 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 25 | 6 | 129 | 1 | 6 | 146 | 6 | 155 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 929 | 1 | 25 | 6 | 9 | 206 | 4 | 6 | 90 | 6 | 90 | 3 | 57 | 12 | 428 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 179 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 26 | 6 | 135 | 1 | 6 | 152 | 6 | 161 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 961 | 1 | 26 | 6 | 9 | 221 | 4 | 6 | 96 | 6 | 96 | 3 | 60 | 12 | 440 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 180 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 27 | 6 | 141 | 1 | 6 | 158 | 6 | 167 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 993 | 1 | 27 | 6 | 9 | 236 | 4 | 6 | 102 | 6 | 102 | 3 | 63 | 12 | 452 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 181 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 28 | 6 | 147 | 1 | 6 | 164 | 6 | 173 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1025 | 1 | 28 | 6 | 9 | 251 | 4 | 6 | 108 | 6 | 108 | 3 | 66 | 12 | 464 | 0 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 182 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 29 | 6 | 153 | 1 | 6 | 170 | 6 | 179 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1057 | 1 | 29 | 6 | 9 | 266 | 4 | 6 | 114 | 6 | 114 | 3 | 69 | 12 | -2 | 474 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 183 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 30 | 6 | 159 | 1 | 6 | 176 | 6 | 185 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1089 | 1 | 30 | 6 | 9 | 281 | 4 | 6 | 120 | 6 | 120 | 3 | 72 | 12 | -1 | 485 | 5 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||
| 184 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 31 | 6 | 165 | 1 | 6 | 182 | 6 | 191 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1121 | 1 | 31 | 6 | 9 | 296 | 4 | 6 | 126 | 6 | 126 | 3 | 75 | 12 | 497 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 185 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 32 | 6 | 171 | 1 | 6 | 188 | 6 | 197 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1153 | 1 | 32 | 6 | 9 | 311 | 4 | 6 | 132 | 6 | 132 | 3 | 78 | 12 | 509 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 186 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 33 | 6 | 177 | 1 | 6 | 194 | 6 | 203 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1185 | 1 | 33 | 6 | 9 | 326 | 4 | 6 | 138 | 6 | 138 | 3 | 81 | 12 | 521 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 187 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 34 | 6 | 183 | 1 | 6 | 200 | 6 | 209 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1217 | 1 | 34 | 6 | 9 | 341 | 4 | 6 | 144 | 6 | 144 | 3 | 84 | 12 | 533 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 188 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 35 | 6 | 189 | 1 | 6 | 206 | 6 | 215 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1249 | 1 | 35 | 6 | 9 | 356 | 4 | 6 | 150 | 6 | 150 | 3 | 87 | 12 | 545 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 189 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 36 | 6 | 195 | 1 | 6 | 212 | 6 | 221 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1281 | 1 | 36 | 6 | 9 | 371 | 4 | 6 | 156 | 6 | 156 | 3 | 90 | 12 | 557 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 190 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 37 | 6 | 201 | 1 | 6 | 218 | 6 | 227 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1313 | 1 | 37 | 6 | 9 | 386 | 4 | 6 | 162 | 6 | 162 | 3 | 93 | 12 | 569 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 191 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 38 | 6 | 207 | 1 | 6 | 224 | 6 | 233 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1345 | 1 | 38 | 6 | 9 | 401 | 4 | 6 | 168 | 6 | 168 | 3 | 96 | 12 | 581 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 192 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 39 | 6 | 213 | 1 | 6 | 230 | 6 | 239 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1377 | 1 | 39 | 6 | 9 | 416 | 4 | 6 | 174 | 6 | 174 | 3 | 99 | 12 | 593 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 193 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 40 | 6 | 219 | 1 | 6 | 236 | 6 | 245 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1409 | 1 | 40 | 6 | 9 | 431 | 4 | 6 | 180 | 6 | 180 | 3 | 102 | 12 | 605 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 194 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 41 | 6 | 225 | 1 | 6 | 242 | 6 | 251 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1441 | 1 | 41 | 6 | 9 | 446 | 4 | 6 | 186 | 6 | 186 | 3 | 105 | 12 | 617 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 195 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 42 | 6 | 231 | 1 | 6 | 248 | 6 | 257 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1473 | 1 | 42 | 6 | 9 | 461 | 4 | 6 | 192 | 6 | 192 | 3 | 108 | 12 | 629 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 196 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 43 | 6 | 237 | 1 | 6 | 254 | 6 | 263 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1505 | 1 | 43 | 6 | 9 | 476 | 4 | 6 | 198 | 6 | 198 | 3 | 111 | 12 | 641 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 197 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 44 | 6 | 243 | 1 | 6 | 260 | 6 | 269 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1537 | 1 | 44 | 6 | 9 | 491 | 4 | 6 | 204 | 6 | 204 | 3 | 114 | 12 | 653 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 198 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 45 | 6 | 249 | 1 | 6 | 266 | 6 | 275 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1569 | 1 | 45 | 6 | 9 | 506 | 4 | 6 | 210 | 6 | 210 | 3 | 117 | 12 | 665 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 199 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 46 | 6 | 255 | 1 | 6 | 272 | 6 | 281 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1601 | 1 | 46 | 6 | 9 | 521 | 4 | 6 | 216 | 6 | 216 | 3 | 120 | 12 | 677 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 200 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 47 | 6 | 261 | 1 | 6 | 278 | 6 | 287 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1633 | 1 | 47 | 6 | 9 | 536 | 4 | 6 | 222 | 6 | 222 | 3 | 123 | 12 | 689 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 201 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 48 | 6 | 267 | 1 | 6 | 284 | 6 | 293 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1665 | 1 | 48 | 6 | 9 | 551 | 4 | 6 | 228 | 6 | 228 | 3 | 126 | 12 | 701 | 5 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 202 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 49 | 6 | 273 | 1 | 6 | 290 | 6 | 299 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1697 | 1 | 49 | 6 | 9 | 566 | 4 | 6 | 234 | 6 | 234 | 3 | 129 | 12 | 713 | 5 | Operation Unity arrives. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 203 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 50 | 6 | 279 | 1 | 6 | 296 | 6 | 305 | 50 | 14 | 18 | 1729 | 1 | 50 | 6 | 9 | 581 | 4 | 6 | 240 | 6 | 240 | 3 | 132 | 12 | 725 | 5 |
| By Stewart Frazier (Frazikar3) on Saturday, June 13, 2026 - 06:19 pm: Edit |
Where did the production of Vipers come from (Y143)?
Where are the initial SatBs needed for the Desecrator (Y145)?
| By Ken Kazinski (Kjkazinski) on Saturday, June 13, 2026 - 10:05 pm: Edit |
I used the table in (R10.1E) and changed the dates to start in Y138 and not Y158. Based on (R10.1E) the intruders brought the base parts. See C2 page 30.
| By Ken Kazinski (Kjkazinski) on Thursday, June 18, 2026 - 09:27 pm: Edit |
I am looking at some old Star Fleet Times issues. SFT18 had the Josers listed. There are a number of ships listed with ship descriptions but no SSD. The ship descriptions do not show how to create an SSD for the ships.
Are there any SSDs in the files or descriptions on how the ships are configured?
| By Jeff Anderson (Jga) on Friday, June 19, 2026 - 11:25 am: Edit |
Respectfully, Ken, methinks the Josers were meant as a one-time piece of humor.
Don't get me wrong, I thoroughly enjoyed them, too, but they're probably not going to even make it into a formal E-series playtest module, let alone a C-module.
Still, we have them available for fun, so if someone tells us to "Take off, eh," we can still enjoy them.
(And personally? I'd like to imagine them as possibly a faction in a Canadi'en "Civil War," but I know that's probably going too far... 
| By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Friday, June 19, 2026 - 02:09 pm: Edit |
If anyone has Joser SSDs I will be happy to spin them into a PDF release.
| By Shawn Hantke (Shantke) on Friday, June 19, 2026 - 04:06 pm: Edit |
Star Fleet Times #18 has five Joser SSDs.
| By Ken Kazinski (Kjkazinski) on Saturday, June 20, 2026 - 07:36 am: Edit |
the ship descriptions for the ships that do not have SSDs did not say how to change the published SSD's so you could use the ships, which is the reason for my question.
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