Even in Tourny, a WW lends its EW, so I think they should in a 'light EW' campaign.

Make sure to clearly define what 'natural' sources are, some people may argue later that fighter built in EW is 'natural'.

In one post it says 182 and 173, is it supposed to be 173?

Thanks,
Seth

By Ken Burnside (Ken_Burnside) on Sunday, November 08, 2009 - 07:06 pm: Edit

It's supposed to be Y173.

Natural sources are:

1) Small target mods
2) Erratic Maneuvers
3) Anything provided by terrain.

Unnatural sources are:

1) Scouts lending EW.

Anything that is NOT on the above list doesn't exist.

By John Smith (Johnsmith) on Friday, November 13, 2009 - 01:12 am: Edit

Just curious, is there a reason why you allow some natural sources of EW, but exclude others?

By John Smith (Johnsmith) on Thursday, January 14, 2010 - 04:19 am: Edit

I'm thinking about trying to get some rules down for an expanded Admirals Game. The basic idea is a 3 player version, sort of a "what if" of the original Klingon-Lyran invasion of the Hydrans. I'm figuring the joint forces of the invaders would be 150% - 200% of the Hydrans. However, with free fighter/PF replacements I hope to make the Hydrans have a bit more of a chance.

The question is: how to prevent the Klingons/Lyrans from dumping all their production into carriers, thus gaining the same advantage? I'd like to avoid artificial limits like restricting the number of carriers to a certain number. Anyone have a bright idea?

By Terence Sean Terry O'Carroll (Terryoc) on Thursday, January 14, 2010 - 05:02 am: Edit

Discount the Hydran replacements but not the Coalition's. Or perhaps, hybrid fighters are free but not carrier fighters.

By Ken Burnside (Ken_Burnside) on Saturday, October 30, 2010 - 03:25 pm: Edit

I have had three people approach me about doing another run of DbOM.

If you're interested, check in here. If we have 6 players and two alternates, I will probably administer it.

I will be recommending the following changes to the rules:

1) Eliminate Warp Gates. Nobody's used them in DbOM 1.

2) Everyone submits a list of the 15 ships they intend to build their fleets from. I'm seeing that most people are sticking to about 7-8 hull types total, so this isn't a serious limit.
2a) At the start of the game, everyone gets to submit a subjective BPV for every ship submitted by other players. I will then average all the subjective BPVs with the listed G3 BPVs, and that will be the price of the unit for this campaign.

3) Every 6 turns, with the voting phase, players may retire a hull class and replace it, repeating the subjective BPV/averaging step above.

By Josh Driscol (Gfb) on Thursday, November 11, 2010 - 09:27 pm: Edit

WYN Race Question

UTF2.234 states no Fleets containing Auxiliary units can be given a support order.

Also UTF4.43 states the "Nancy" is under normal SFB restroctopms. The Nancy being the AxDN.

The SFB restrictions on The AxDN say that if used in scenario's like SG17.0 it would arrive only when the WYN players total die rolls at 1 per turn reaces 40 or more.

My question is this SG17.0 is just a regular WYN scenario a defense no reinforcements i know the aux DN couldn't be given a support order. But could it participate in an attack Order? And if so would it arrive with all other units at the beginning of the scenario or be penalized, and would this affect the entire fleet or just the Nancy. Or can the Nancy be present from the beginning in a defense situation.

Thanks, GFB

Anoter AxDN question can the AxDN move two zones if starting from a push star?

By Ken Burnside (Ken_Burnside) on Friday, November 12, 2010 - 12:23 am: Edit

The Nancy would have to roll at the start of each scenario before she arrived.

Auxiliary units cannot get a double move off a pushstar.

By Ken Burnside (Ken_Burnside) on Friday, November 12, 2010 - 12:28 am: Edit

Current list for The Abattoir of Compromise:

Leslie Richardson (The_Geek)
Josh Driscoll (GaiusFrakingBaltar)
Stephen Henson (Erebus)
Peter Theonen (Eol)
Tony Moscowec (Teemo)
James Bunker (Valonqar) (Alternate*)

EastCoastFolks has expressed interest, but I don't have his real name.

We just need one more alternate, preferably one who isn't playing in DbOM, and we're good, if ECF signs up.

By Josh Driscol (Gfb) on Wednesday, November 17, 2010 - 04:47 pm: Edit

Neo Tholian Question

In G3 most Neo Tholian Ships are listed as NFP in warship status. I assume for the campaign they are not no further production.

Also I was told that only ships in R modules are allowed and that specifically Captains Log published ships were not allowed.

I guess that makes the NCH unproducable in TAoC. It was from CL # 25. So a secondary race tholian has only a few web caster ships available the NCA being the largest.

Am i corect about the NCH being unavailable or could it be an exception. It doesnt seem that overpowering. With snares unavailabe i would really like to be able to get my web caster fleet limit from one ship and the NCH is the only one in SC 3 or smaller.

Thanks, GFB

By Josh Driscol (Gfb) on Wednesday, November 17, 2010 - 04:52 pm: Edit

lol, never mind the NCA has two,

By Christopher M Schrader (Eastcoastfolk) on Saturday, November 20, 2010 - 12:52 pm: Edit

TAoC

Some Questions and suspected answers.

1) Can Andros Displace an opponent into a Death Barrier or force them to disengage? Answer: Bounce of Barrier based on UTF7.311

2) Is a Fighters 2 points of built in ECM/ECCM voided by UTF7.13 or considered a Natural Source? Suspected Answer is Fighters do not get there 2 point ECM/ECCM.

3) Can Carriers provide EW support to their fighters? Suspected answer is yes as a scout would also have this option.

4) As D15 is not excluded can ground combat be used to attack GB units, and commandoes for H&R? Suspected answer yes.

If I'm making any bad assumptions let me know.

By Ken Burnside (Ken_Burnside) on Saturday, November 20, 2010 - 08:45 pm: Edit

Chris:

1) The attempted displacement will bounce, unless the unit being displaced is eligible to disengage.

2) Correct. Fighters do not get their built in ECM/ECCM

3) No, carriers cannot lend EW to their fighters. See the "It's tourney SFB, with the following additions: Scout lending to units, terrain modifiers, erratic maneuvers."

4) Yes, you can have commadoes for hit and run raids. I'm not decided on advanced ground combat; I'd be tempted to say no - I never felt advanced ground combat made any sense within the contest of SFB tactical battles.

By Christopher M Schrader (Eastcoastfolk) on Saturday, November 20, 2010 - 09:03 pm: Edit

Thanks Ken,

There may be a few more questions like this each I'm tempted to say day but will try to make it a weekly thing ;)

By Josh Driscol (Gfb) on Monday, November 22, 2010 - 04:35 pm: Edit

Hello Genglemen,

I hava a question on the FED CVP Patrol Carrier, Ken pointed out that it should have the historical fighters. Sadly i bought the master rules, and don't have section R for module F2.

Ken said it probably carried F 18's, my question is would F 18B+'s be appropriate for this carrier's fighter wing?

Anyone with the actual entry for the CVP in there section R, i could really use the fighter deployment from Y181 to recalculate this units cost.

Thanks, im sure wishing they would publish a master R section in the near future.

By Tony Moskowec (Teemo) on Monday, November 22, 2010 - 08:02 pm: Edit

Hi GFB. I get Y173-Y177 18xF - 18
Y177-Y180 18xF - 18B
Y180-Y183 18xF - 18B+
Y183+ 18xF - 18C

By Josh Driscol (Gfb) on Tuesday, November 23, 2010 - 11:59 pm: Edit

Thanks again Teemo.

By Josh Driscol (Gfb) on Wednesday, December 08, 2010 - 05:37 pm: Edit

There was talk about limiting the Str of G10 web for the campaign to str 20 max.

If thats a final decision perhaps it should be incorporated into the rules.

By Christopher M Schrader (Eastcoastfolk) on Sunday, December 12, 2010 - 01:38 pm: Edit

Time for another batch of Questions.

1. Plasmas built in ECCM (D6.393) and Drones with ATG built in ECCM (FD5.26) are not permitted by (UTF7.13)? I think baned under Campaign Format. Debated when using Plasmas on a Ship using EM and the D(6.361) Proximity of Detonation table.

UTF7.24 "Supporting fleets must always be placed 20 hexes away from the nearest enemy units, and their hexes of arrival are chosen by the enemy."

Spawns these questions:

2. Can any enemy unit be the 'nearest' enemy unit, provided that no other enemy unit is closer than 20 hexes to the arrival hexes.

3. Can i pick an arrival hex for my opponent 20 hexes from my trailing unit that is conveniently in the mine field my opponent dropped to make me take the long way around. (Serves him right for Littering)

4. Can I seed Shuttles or use Drones set on Ballistic paths to serve as remote points on the map for selecting the arrival point of enemy support fleets.

5. If 4 is yes can i seed enough points with units on the map to result in their being no hex at least 20 away from any of my units and prevent the arrival of the supporting fleet.

6. Can I select an arrival hex for the enemy support fleet in or near Terrain(say rings or dust clouds).

7. Are all ships of the Support Fleet stacked on the arrival hex.

UTF7.25

8. Is this the rule that covers the WS of arriving support fleets.

With prior thanks for your guidance,

Chris (ECF)

By Ken Burnside (Ken_Burnside) on Sunday, December 12, 2010 - 07:20 pm: Edit

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR SIZE=0><!-Quote-!><FONT SIZE=1>Quote:</FONT><P>Time for another batch of Questions.

1. Plasmas built in ECCM (D6.393) and Drones with ATG built in ECCM (FD5.26) are not permitted by (UTF7.13)? I think baned under Campaign Format. Debated when using Plasmas on a Ship using EM and the D(6.361) Proximity of Detonation table<!-/Quote-!><HR SIZE=0></BLOCKQUOTE>

Plasma ECCM is explicitly allowed in tournament, so would self guiding drones. Therefore, they fall under the "If it's legal in tournament, it's legal here" inclusion.

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR SIZE=0><!-Quote-!><FONT SIZE=1>Quote:</FONT><P>UTF7.24 "Supporting fleets must always be placed 20 hexes away from the nearest enemy units, and their hexes of arrival are chosen by the enemy."

(DBOM7.233) Each player will be provided with the turns of arrival for any of their opponent’s supporting fleets by the Overseer, but not their own. Supporting fleets must always be placed within 5 hexes of a placement hex. This center hex must be 20 hexes away from the largest enemy unit (by size class) present; in case of ties, the tie braker is chosen by the enemy.
(DBOM7.234) The center hex of the fleet is chosen by the enemy; it may not be in a hex with terrain unless no other alternative is present at a valid distance on the map. All reinforcing ships must be within 5 hexes of the hex chosen, but may not be closer than 20 hexes away from the designated enemy unit. The placement of individual units in hexes within these constraints and the initial facing are chosen by the fleet’s owner. (There is no obligation to have the entire fleet appear in a single hex, for instance).



8. Is this the rule that covers the WS of arriving support fleets.<!-/Quote-!><HR SIZE=0></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have added two more rows to the weapon status table:

Fleet is arriving on a support order for its own side: +1
Fleet is arriving on a support order for an ally: +0

By Josh Driscol (Gfb) on Monday, December 13, 2010 - 04:42 am: Edit

Thank you Ken

Those seem like reasonable rules to me I support them. Also the WS changes in support order situations make alot of sense.

To clarify take the following fleet

Its been ordered to support the its player's race fleet in an adjacent zone, or a puhsstar two zones distant.

This Fleet is composed of
1 a CVB Carrier(Fed)
2 a CAD+ Drone Bombardmend Cruiser/Scout Ship designation in annex G3 2 channels
3 a DW (Fed) War Destroyer

These ships arrive on a turn that the Overseer gives the opposing player or faction before the scenario begins.

There WS modifiers are +1 Fleet is arriving on a support order for its own side: +1

+1 Scout Ship as defined in G3 notes with a dimond

So the base WS I +2 gives the supporting fleet WS III on arrival at the battle.

For this fleet that would mean
4 fighters max deployed as CAP from the CVB
2 Special Shuttles can be prepared per ship
Heavy Weapons armed and holding at standard level
up to 10 percent of the crew may be converted to Militia on all ships
If i wanted to i could be asswumed to have fired drones on imp #28 of the turn before i arrived, those drones could be placed as close as 16 hexes from the center of the enemy fleet by the rules above.

However those drones cant be placed within three hexes of there target(S4.13)

But obviously thouians could not be pinwheeled for several reasons. Nor are there tholians in this fleet. I think there is a rule that you cannot be in a pinwheel before the battle starts in DboM, and certainly not when arriving as a support fleet.

So the fleet could have launched
2 drones from the CVB
7 drones from the CAD+
1 drone from the DW
8 drones from the F 15 CAP
all up to 4 hexes away from the launching unit

Is this correct?

Does the CAD not count for a plus one bunus?

By Josh Driscol (Gfb) on Monday, December 13, 2010 - 07:14 am: Edit

Sry S4.13 clearly stipulates one drone max per fighter, so thats the way the cookie crumbles

So, 14 total drones could be launched on imp 28 on the turn before the support fleet arrives?

Or is there an exception preventing this in DBoM/TAoC?

By Ken Burnside (Ken_Burnside) on Monday, December 13, 2010 - 11:05 am: Edit

Pushstar Questions (so they're in one place)

1) The pushstar is a radius 7 object.
2) The pushstar's effects start not from the center hex of the pushstar, but from the closest hex of the pushstar's surface. The ranges are otherwise identical to a black hole's ranges.
3) The pushstar's effects push the owning player away from the surface of the star on the impulses specified at the range indicated by the black hole rules.
4) In all other ways, a pushstar's effects on objects is treated identically to a black hole's. This means it does not move mines, webs or objects with positional stabilizers.

OK - now onto intent:

The reason why the opposing player chooses which hex an object is shoved into if there's any ambiguity is so that the pushstar is at least somewhat annoying to play in.

By Ken Burnside (Ken_Burnside) on Monday, December 13, 2010 - 11:06 am: Edit

There is already a rule in place saying that Tholian ships may not be ina pinwheel prior to the start of the scenario.

The drones and fighter CAP mentioned look right to me.

By Josh Driscol (Gfb) on Monday, December 13, 2010 - 06:23 pm: Edit

Thanks ken for the response we will have to change the way we were handling the pushstar when we play again.