IMHO the Chlorophons shoudl get strictly RC fighters.

By Daniel Riegler (Futonrevolution) on Friday, March 26, 2010 - 08:08 pm: Edit

I certainly can't blame you for missing (OFP3.15) - the myriad of range bracket changes must have taken tons of rechecking! 1950s sci-fi movies have led me to over-romanticize the Sigs, my head filled with daydreams of foo fighters laying down PE covering fire for the GAS shuttles disgorging tripod walkers, yet still that rule hadn't fully sunk in until this week.

Fighters' KWFs, PFs' KWLs, and carriers' KWHs vs. a Probr carrier group would be rather nightmarish to playtest... maybe in O10 or later, if at all; I can't imagine there being enough time in a decade to iron that monstrosity out.

The Chlorophon DDE has had the idea of an unmanned shuttle acting as a mobile and/or pre-plotted T-bomb (a slightly more flexible anti-fighter defense) kicking around here for awhile but, even with the 'keep away stick-and-move' racial theme, it feels a bit like Nucian mine technology to me.

By Daniel Riegler (Futonrevolution) on Saturday, April 03, 2010 - 11:07 pm: Edit

Another nitpick...
(OE16.35) mentions that hypercannons do not cause feedback when fired at range zero. However, to the chagrin of many a Drex captain on the Vari border, hypercannons cannot hit at a true range of zero (OE16.341).

By Steve Petrick (Petrick) on Sunday, April 04, 2010 - 04:12 pm: Edit

Daniel Riegler:

Hypercannons cannot hit if fired at a true range of zero. But you could fire a hypercannon at such a range in the Qixavalor Cloud specifically for the purpose of triggering a cloud explosion, and a fighter with an HCL can fire the weapon while inside the bay of an enemy ship.

"(G7.8122) If the weapon cannot fire at range zero, use the range one column."

By Daniel Riegler (Futonrevolution) on Wednesday, April 14, 2010 - 03:05 am: Edit

Ahh, I hadn't thought of that; thanks for pointing those tactics out.

By Sidney G. Kanouse (Konus67c7) on Saturday, June 12, 2010 - 11:09 pm: Edit

I've been studying my Omega Sector modules a little closer lately and have noticed a few things. The Trobrin ships, especially their heavier vessels, pack alot of punch. The Probr have a target changing torpedo that can do speed 64. The Worb CA is definately a match for any Alpha CA. Last, but not least, this sector has viruses, otter people, living rocks, "space cows", robot crewed ships, and a little slice of the Federation to boot. I'm starting to like this place; need to fly Omega more often.

By Sidney G. Kanouse (Konus67c7) on Saturday, June 19, 2010 - 06:51 pm: Edit

I may be flying a Measron ship soon. I need some pointers on Tachyon Missiles. They look like they can do some damage. What is a good way to "mix" up the individual missiles to throw off an enemy? Thanks for any feedback.

By Andy Vancil (Andy) on Sunday, June 20, 2010 - 02:29 am: Edit

The first thing to realize about TMs is the upgrades are severely overpriced. For the cost of filling your racks with fancy missiles, you could just about bring another ship. Given that they have a slow launch rate, can't go in scatterpacks, require two control channels, and have post-launch restrictions that make them difficult to use in close combat, I wouldn't count on them to be a major factor in the battle. Focus on getting the best usage out of your tachyon guns and managing your power (you won't have enough) and your maneuver relative to your weapon arcs (your weapon arcs suck).

With that said, here are a few ideas. Note that the year of the battle (if it is historical) will limit what you can do, as many of the coolest missile improvements are not available until later years.

Given the slow launch rate for your missiles, don't waste points upgrading all of them. A ship with two TM-A racks would take 6 turns to empty them; many battles are over much quicker than that, or at least see racks destroyed before that. Concentrate your upgrades on a few missiles.

Consider how your opponent will be defending against the missiles. Will he shoot them down? Use more armor. Outrun/maneuver around them? Use faster propulsion. Tractor them? Add some anti-tractor. Lots of good range-1 missile defenses? Throw in some phaser modules and have the TM shoot at range 2. Note that if you concentrate too much upgrade in one aspect of the missile, you limit its effectiveness. For example, too much armor without warhead upgrades just encourages your opponent to eat the missile (which may or may not be worth it). A fancy TM without anti-tractor upgrades will get tractored.

Since each space point added slows the missile down by one hex per turn, the speed of a missile can reveal its loadout, particularly in earlier years when your loadout options are limited. Design different types of TMs so that their final speed works out the same. A speed-20 TM could be a basic missile, a 16 warhead/12 armor missile with 24 propulsion, a large frame with propulsion-28 and lots of goodies, etc.

In battle, improve your launch rate by launching on either side of a turn break. A ship with two racks can launch a missile from one on impulse 32, and from the other on impulse 1 of the next turn.

Think of a TM as two drones. Use TMs as you would use drones on a ship that doesn't have very many drone racks and doesn't have a scatterpack. However, don't get too close before launching. And don't focus too much on them. Work on getting your TGs at the right arming level and in arc, and lay some damage on your opponent.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Tuesday, June 22, 2010 - 12:12 pm: Edit

I was thinking about how to handle the Mæsrons, myself - not least in terms of how their ships might transfer to FC (as part of the Omega conversion project).


One thing I noted is that some of the Alliance ships remind me, if anything, of how a Middle Years Carnivon fleet might fly like. Similar turn modes on some ship classes, TGs in place of Disruptor Cannons, TMs in place of Death Bolts, though no Heel Nipper analogue. Ironic, when you consider that one of the founding Alliance member species is rather wolf-like!

If we ever see TL12 Carnivon ships in Stellar Shadows (or perhaps in some other part of the galaxy?) I wonder how well such a comparison might hold up.


When it comes to getting a handle on the ships of the Alliance, would it be an idea to play at least one or two games with only the standard missile loadouts first, with the focus on getting settled in with handling the ship itself (not least in terms of its TG use) - and only then moving on to throwing in the odd fancy missile or two?

Are the ships viable enough with 'just' a complement of the standard types?

By Andy Vancil (Andy) on Tuesday, June 22, 2010 - 03:31 pm: Edit

Yes, they are viable, in some ways more so, as you are not paying the excessive BPV upgrade cost.

However, if you wanted to keep things simple and balanced, it would probably be better to have a mixture of basic TMs and a single upgraded type, analogous to giving a drone ship type-1s and type-4s. Try propulsion-24, explosion-16, armor-12, tractor -1 (speed 20, BPV +2).

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 06:07 pm: Edit

According to the R-sections of various Alpha Octant survey PFs in Module R12, several empires' PFQs were given over to civilian use, albeit with a reduction in phaser quality.

While a similar reduction is not necessarily viable for Omega Octant empires (given the relative scarcity of 'true' Phaser-2 equivalents; the PQ-2 and PP-2 having somewhat different roles for their operating fleets) would it be fair to suggest that certain Omega PFQs were also made available to civilians in their owning empires, or perhaps sold or leased to equivalent organisations in friendly empires?

For example, could one expect to see a Mæsron PFQ sub-let to a Tazol or Wallimi civilian agency, or perhaps to an organisation within the FRA (especially after the Auroran accession to the Alliance in Y209)?


Indeed, I was wondering if the likes of the Aurorans, who refused to build their own PFs, would end up having a smaller version of the market the Federation would have, in terms of buying or leasing survey boats (or maybe even some sort of Omega workboat equivalents?) from the Mæsrons, Probr, Iridani, Qixa, Jindarians (if the ones in Omega ever built any) or anyone else willing to sell...

By Sidney G. Kanouse (Konus67c7) on Thursday, August 12, 2010 - 09:43 pm: Edit

I'll chime in here since there is no proposal section for Omega. I have noticed a glaring gap in the Trobrin fleet. There is nothing between the FFL and the CA in Omega 1 or 2 that I know of. If this is the case I would like to see a DD,DW,CL, or CW somewhere in between in a future product. The large BPV gap makes Trobrin fleet composition less than ideal. Just thought I would drop a hint.

By Terry O'Carroll (Terryoc) on Thursday, August 12, 2010 - 10:32 pm: Edit

Makes me wonder, did the Omega powers develop skiffs or the equivalent? Did the Omegans ever turn gunboats into workboats?

By Andy Vancil (Andy) on Thursday, August 12, 2010 - 11:05 pm: Edit

There have been a few proposals for a Trobrin CL floating around. There is tourney cruiser on SFBOL that might give you some idea of what it would look like. Cut the engines back to 18 warp to get the power curve back in line.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Saturday, September 25, 2010 - 01:53 pm: Edit

Sidney:


If it helps, the Omega (and Magellanic) proposal section is here.


However, I would say that there might have been a conscious decision to give the Trobrin an unorthodox array of ships; they have better cruisers and dreadnoughts, but are less flexible in fleet variations compared to, say, the Probr or Mæsrons.

(Maybe that could be one of the changes the Empire might choose to make in the late era; using hot warp technolgoy to build relatively cheap war cruisers in order to counteract the Souldra and Andromedan invaders?)


Oh, and I'd love to see Omega workboats, myself; I'd imagine the likes of FRA space (where, like the non-Orion part of the Federation, has no indigenous gunboat design) could be a healthy market for Mæsron, Probr, Iridani or other such boats.

By eric jimerson (Lord_Errock) on Friday, November 12, 2010 - 06:56 pm: Edit

Wow. 8 years of discussions.

Has there been a release of Omega sector ground combat bases? Looking specifically for a (x)P4 and any heavy weapons bases.

Also wondering if there ia a HCH ground base, and if it has something better than hex-spine arcs.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Monday, November 15, 2010 - 04:35 pm: Edit

EDIT: Sorry, should have gone in the Q&A thread.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Wednesday, January 12, 2011 - 06:53 pm: Edit

Over in Alpha, (U6.0) has been around for quite a while; updated now and then to account for new ships, support units, and so forth, when allowing people to play out an abstracted form of the Operation Unity campaign.


Could there be a similar U-file for Operation Concerted Strike?


I was thinking about how it might run relative to Unity; it would be similar in some ways (locals banding together to fight Andros) but different in others.

For one, rather than launching a three-pronged advvance upon the LMC, Concerted Strike would see a march upon the Ryn Nebula; the last known major Andromedan foothold in this half of the galaxy. Rather than having a mostly secure home space (and industrial base) to support operations, the Omega powers involved were still just beginning to recover from the tidal wave bearing down upon them. Rather than relying on the support of the third Desecrator and the stream of reinforcements coming in from beyond the LMC, the Andros here were themselves rushing to get as many ships as they could behind the Nebular Wall.


I was thinking that, instead of three routes leading from the galaxy to the LMC, there could be a set of "outer" provinces representing the core space of the participating empires (or areas from which Andro ships from other invasion zones would be fleeing from), a "middle" space covering the areas between these areas and the Ryn Nebula, and an "inner" province for the last Andro bastion.

The "outer" provinces would each cover one or more of the powers known to have taken part in Operation Concerted Strike; the Mæsron Alliance, the Federal Republic of Aurora, the Probr Revolution, the Trobrin Empire, the Koligahr Solidarity and the Chlorophon Association. (To that list, I would ask to add the Iridani Questors; their Crusade Quests had been active in Omega since Y199, and their passing the secret of the RTN on to the various Omega powers helped make Concerted Strike possible. Plus, one could easily imagine some of their Quest ships taking part directly, as part of their ongoing mission to destroy the Andromedans.)

Each "middle" province would start with an Andro RTN node; the Omega empires would have to destroy each node, and place their own bases, akin to what Unity fleets do in their own invasion paths. However, there would be several such provinces, not all of which would lie directly between an empire's core space and the Ryn Nebula; these would be ones the Andromedans would use to try and send ships into the Nebula. In order to fully cut the Nebula off from the outer RTN, the onus would be on the Omega empires to do something about these nodes, too.

Eventually, the empires would reach a series of provinces directly adjacent to the "inner" Nebula province; at this point, the Omega empires would have to try to get their task forces in all at once to prevail.

(My thought was that the Andros might have placed at least one RTN node in each hex behind the Nebular Wall; this would allow them to rapidly respond to any incursion coming in at a single point. Historically, the Mæsrons had been trying to pitch Operation Concerted Strike since Y195; they had a go at dislodging the Andros from the Nebula by themselves in Y195, and tried again alongside the Probr in Y197. Both attempts fared rather poorly. Fortunately, the other neighbouring powers were more willing to listen by the Y200s.)

In terms of building new units, the Andros could be said to have at least one Construction Battle Station in the Nebula, but would need to rely on new arrivals fleeing from elsewhere to get new motherships.


Ultimately, an Operation Concerted Strike campaign should be bloody; historically, the united Omega empires prevailed, but lost almost nine-tenths of the forces sent through the Nebular Wall. (After the campaign, it seems the Mæsrons were left holding on to the Nebula; it's shown as part of Alliance space on the Y210 map.) when it comes to balancing such a campaign for the U-section, one might expect a similarly bitter, but (just about) doable fight for the Omega empires involved.


There are a number of ship types that might have taken place historically, but which aren't in print yet; things like war cruisers and X-ships. However, as with (U6.0), one could envision later revisions adding such units into the campaign as and when required.


So, does any of that sound interesting?

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Thursday, January 13, 2011 - 01:43 am: Edit

I don't think the ships the Omegans had at that point have been published... I vaguely think I remember seeing something somewhere talking about the possiblity that possibly Omegan units at this time were speed 30 capable. But I could be wrong.

By George Duffy (Sentinal) on Thursday, January 13, 2011 - 03:20 pm: Edit

That's an easy fix, when the next Omega module is printed (hopefully the one about speed 30 warships... hint hint ;)). OU6 (Operation: Concentrated Strike) can be added at the end of the rulebook section.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Thursday, January 13, 2011 - 04:03 pm: Edit

Even with the new types of ships (speed-30 cruisers, "war" classes, even X-ships) which were around by then, there still seems to have been more than a few of the currently-published classes in service during, or even after, Concerted Strike.

The first PF tenders and space control ships were largely based on the known dreadnought hulls; some of these ships (such as the Probr and Worb SCSs) weren't fielded until after the Invasions had come to a end. Indeed, thanks to Omega 5, we have the first confirmed unit to have taken part in Concerted Strike; the R-section entry for the Koligahr SCS states that one such ship (presumably alongside its escorts) led the task force sent by the Solidarity into the Ryn Nebula.

The sample scenarios in Omega 5 don't refer to specific encounters, but do state that during the Seventh Cycle, many "show the flag" missions used to try and re-establish each empire's spheres of influence involved older ships supported by some advanced technologies (such as PFs).

Plus, given how badly affected the various empires' economies and logistical networks had become by Y202, to the point that two powers (the Worb and Iridani) had to re-build their primary fleet yards from scratch, they likely wouldn't have been able to simply phase out all of their surviving older ships even if they had wanted to.


Even without the SSDs for the newer ships, it's possible that Concerted Strike depended to a significant extent on the older ships (and the newer gunboats we do have in print) in order to carry the day.

If so, that could be enough to at least get the ball rolling.


Actually, it would be pretty interesting to see a snapshot in Captain's Log taking a first look at Operation Concerted Strike; that could help set up the parameters around which a U-section scenario could be built.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Thursday, February 03, 2011 - 02:35 pm: Edit

I was talking to Barry a bit about TMs, and it occurred to me that it might be an idea to offer newcomers to Omega a series of "off-the-shelf" missiles that might be commonly used by this or that missile-equipped empire.

While the full customization rules would still be there for players to gradually ease in to, it might help people wanting to get the hang of these weapons to have a few samples; perhaps even tailored to this or that particular empire or sub-faction.

For example, one could suggest that such-and-such a Vulpa insurgent cell tended to go with this-or-that variant as a means of streamlining their logistical efforts, while Insert-A-Name Corporation in the FRA offered a particular brand missile to the Auroran Navy, or suchlike.

(One of them could be the loadout Andy offered earlier in the thread, perhaps. I didn't want to promote the options I laid out for the FC project, though; they are slightly adjusted here and there to fit semi-neatly into that game system.)

Again, the idea would not be to take away from the modular rules already in place; more to try and find a means of guiding newcomers to a few sample loadouts, in a way which could add a little historical flavour in the process.


Any thoughts?

By Barry Kirk (Barrykirk) on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - 05:42 pm: Edit

Recently completed the Sigvirion Tournament cruiser. Now I know that this section of the forum is devoted to Omega in general and not to tournament ships, but it brought something into focus.
This is the second or possibly the third Omega race, which I've got a tournament cruiser for that looks really cool on paper, but at least in the tournament arena, the ship and it's weapons and systems can't be balanced.

I'm not saying the ship that I've introduced isn't balanced. I'm saying that the race as a whole isn't and can't be without changing some of the rules for that race.
One idea I had was to introduce tourney specific rules for the tournament ship to try to fix the race. Than go back to Steve Petrick with play test results and say, "This race is broken, but with this change as shown from play testing, it can be fixed."

Any case, I've got one minor tweak along those lines for the Koligahr, where the tournament only rule is that Microphasers treat plasma torpedoes exactly the same as all other phaser types.
I'm considering a much more major change for the Sigvirions, but I'll hold off on implementing it until I've got a few more of the Omega ships "balanced" properly.

By Barry Kirk (Barrykirk) on Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 05:08 pm: Edit

This is a re-post of something I just posted on the FC BBS, but it pertains to SFB

From a discussion I've had with Gary. I understand that the Koligahr will most likely be in the next update to the FC: Omega project.

The Koligahr and several other races use micro phasers and one of the peculiarities of micro phasers in SFB is that they are much better at damaging plasma than any other phaser type.

In SFB micro phasers damage most types of plasma at 1/1 instead of 1/2. They damage HEAT at 1/2 instead of 1/3.

Since they tend to have a higher average damage output than alpha quadrant phasers at close range and than on top of that they essentially do double damage against plasma. Any ship equipped with micro phasers is going to chew up a plasma armed ship.

Example, a Koligahr CA armed with 8 PM-1 and 2 PM-3 all able to fire in the front centerline has a plasma S impact it's #1 shield at a range where that plasma would do 30 damage, if it fires 5 PM-1 at the plasma, it completely negates the plasma!!! This is automatic since the PM-1s do 6 points of damage each at that range, no more and no less.

By comparison, a Fed CC with 8 P1 and 2 P3, in the same situation if it fired all of it's phasers at the plasma would do an average of 50 damage to the plasma reducing it by 25 points. It would still have 5 points left on it.

That same Koligahr, if it ran into two plasma S in the same impulse, again both impacting on the #1 shield, could fire 5 PM-1 at the one plasma killing it and fire the remaing 3 PM-1 and both PM-3 at the other plasma doing 26 damage to it and reducing it to 4 points of damage.

So, that Koligahr CA can ram two plasma S at point blank range and take less shield damage than a Fed CA ramming only a single plasma S!!!

In FC there are no Enveloping and no pseudo plasma. A Koligahr can just walk right through a volley of plasma torpedoes without ill effect. Sure it burns it's phasers doing it, but it still has it's anti-matter cannons and anti-matter cloud generator to dish out offensive punch on it's target.

The following turn, it gets to use it's phasers against a target which has no plasma deterrent.

A Gorn Dreadnaught could probably take a Koligahr CA, but that's about what it would take.

Can we get rid of the enhanced plasma damage for micro phasers please?

I would also ask for that in SFB, but I don't think I'll get anywhere with that.

Below is my data to back this up.

For regular alpha P1

Range 0 Average damage is 6.5
Range 1 Average damage is 5.33
Range 2 Average damage is 4.83

Whereas PM-1

Range 0 Average damage is 7.0
Range 1 Average damage is 6.0
Range 2 Average damage is 5.0

For regular alpha P3

Range 0 Average damage is 3.83
Range 1 Average damage is 3.67
Range 2 Average damage is 3.00

Whereas PM-3

Range 0 Average damage is 4.0
Range 1 Average damage is 4.0
Range 2 Average damage is 3.0
_________________

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 05:41 pm: Edit

I should clarify that the Koligahr are in the next batch of empires that I would wish to consider for development in FC, but that they (and anyone else) would at least have to wait for the five empires that are in the current playtest pack to get up and running before being made open for consideration.

But even if it might be a while before I turn to them, I'd feel obliged to base their microphaser rules on their SFB originals; only if the change is made in Star Fleet Battles would I feel comfortable departing from the improved ratio in FC.