VT variant glued together with other bits and pieces of starships used by the Fralli...

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Monday, September 09, 2019 - 08:15 pm: Edit

I missed this comment... sorry for coming back late, (as it were...)

VT use by the Fralli...

Oh my. The irony of such beautiful flower named ships filled by Fralli crews.

Do you suppose the Orion Pirates can sue the Fralli home world for violating the "truth in advertising" statutes?

By Michael Grafton (Mike_Grafton) on Tuesday, September 10, 2019 - 12:24 am: Edit

The Fralli corvette was the "Western Skunk Cabbage (Lysichiton americanus)"

https://www.livescience.com/29815-seven-fetid-flowers-1010tk.html

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Tuesday, September 10, 2019 - 06:30 am: Edit

So... does that mean there were 27 hulls built, instead of the 26 already discussed in the VT topic? At the very least, the Fralli should have built two. is there a "Eastern Skunk Cabbage" variety?

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Wednesday, September 11, 2019 - 04:39 pm: Edit

There are no standing rules in place defining a "Fralli Refit."

It appears that the Fralli somehow acquire a hull (without its original engines) and in the course of overhauling the ship for service mash together a after hull section of a different Federatin ship. Then slap some underpowered warp nacelles on the result. (See powerista, the Fralli proposed national guard proposal etc.).

So.

The Fralli found a VT saucer, and decided to renovate it. Any ideas? Anyone?

By Gregory S Flusche (Vandor) on Wednesday, September 11, 2019 - 05:13 pm: Edit

HELP Just do not put a over ride view screen. So the Fralli Captain can not send a picture of himself/Herself to every screen on the enemy ship.

Resulting in a Mutiny on a Klingon ship. While other ships would have to roll to find witch systems can still function.

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Wednesday, September 11, 2019 - 05:47 pm: Edit

I love the thought, but any rule that results in a "soft mission kill" result is on the auto reject list.

That one, just might have to wait for GURPs PD rule errata.

Then again, rumor has it that the GURPS PD editor has a soft spot for the Fralli. She just might conclude that the Fralli need ALL THE HELP THEY CAN GET.

Once the final proofs are done, the first the Steves will hear of it is when the complaints come in in the after action reports...

By Jason E. Schaff (Jschaff297061) on Wednesday, September 11, 2019 - 05:47 pm: Edit

It might result in the ship's crew being instantly downgraded to poor status (nauseated by so horrible a sight) or upgraded to outstanding status (sudden overriding motivation to rid the universe of such a horror).

What is that whistling sound I hear? Ruh-roh! Cookware incoming!!!
(channel goes silent)

By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Wednesday, September 11, 2019 - 08:00 pm: Edit

Take the VT saucer and replace the engines with skiffs.


Garth L. Getgen

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Wednesday, September 11, 2019 - 09:45 pm: Edit

Won't work.

Skiffs are still size class 5, and use module K rules for interceptors.

The VT saucer is size class 4, and operates as a normal ship.

You ***might*** get away with mounting skiff type engine nacelles on the VT... not sure how that would work. No one has EVER proposed such an outlandish thing to Petrick... at least no one who lived long enough to brag... errr, umm, (cough, cough) report. That's right, report on SPP's reaction.

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Wednesday, September 11, 2019 - 10:23 pm: Edit

The Fralli conversion of a Fed VT:

They took a badly wrecked VT and replaced both warp engines with a single (malfunctioning) DD engine (it has 8 warp boxes, but one produces no power). The saucer was very badly damaged, and they had to remove the front 40 percent of it, managing to install the rear section of a Klingon E2 in it's place (though they had to turn it sideways). Unfortunately, it proved to be the case that the rear 40% of the saucer was also unrepareable and ended up being replaced by the front of a POL (minus the nose - no photon torpedo) turned backwards.

The Federation Star Fleet denies this ever was constructed, no witnesses could be found who would admit to seeing it.

By A. David Merritt (Adm) on Wednesday, September 11, 2019 - 10:56 pm: Edit

Given that the Fralli are in hex 3201 I doubt they can easily get a hold of any usable foreign ship, other than an Orion.

The only options I see are;

1) A VT replaces the front end of a POL.

2) Somehow a Free Trader of some sort is welded to the back end.

3) An LR is welded to the back end.

4) The wings off an Orion SAL is welded to the sides of a VT.

Any of the above could be fitted with military grade freighter engines.

By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Wednesday, September 11, 2019 - 11:10 pm: Edit

No, Jeff, I'm saying put the whole SKIFF (pair) on the VT, not just the Skiff's engines.


Garth L. Getgen

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Thursday, September 12, 2019 - 06:46 am: Edit

Garth, I understood you.

Skiff engines are not the same as regular warp nacelles.

You want to argue with Petrick, fine. But Skiffs are handled as interceptors under rule K, and have different operating characteristics.

First issue, you have now created the first (so far, only) size class 4 skiff powered war ship in star fleet battles.

Second, skiffs normally are serviced on planets at operations bases. As I recall, the VT is a Federation class 1 saucer design, is not normally capable of atmospheric flight. It can land on a class M planet. Once. Getting back into orbit might require assistance.

Third, adds to the movement cost of the whole ship (both the VT and the skiff. If it keeps the photon, it slows it even more when having to power the photon, and stops it if full overload is required.

Bad tactics I suspect.

By Gregory S Flusche (Vandor) on Thursday, September 12, 2019 - 11:45 am: Edit

we are making a good ship?

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Thursday, September 12, 2019 - 03:25 pm: Edit

Vandor:
Probably not, but it should still be a legal ship by the established rules.

In any event, it will have a flower name, and possibly ugly up to its wazoie! Grin.

By Jeffrey George Anderson (Jeff) on Thursday, September 12, 2019 - 11:31 pm: Edit

I wonder...

We all know that the classic, old style Federation CL is a ship with a strong enough structure to land on a planet. Would it be possible to make use of that structural strength to make a hard weld to the forward dorsal section of one of the pods hauled by Federation Tugs?

Here's what I'm thinking (and yes, please feel free to laugh at me saying that I'm "Thinking"). What if the Fralli were to take the forward hull section of an old style Federation CL, line up the accessways to the navigational deflector with the turboshaft connection points on a Federation CVA pod, and weld the two of them together.

The rear hull from the CL could then be hard welded to the connection points at the aft end of the pod, where it normally would connect up with a second pod when hauled by a tug.

The resulting ship, being shy of power, MIGHT be able to be fitted with the tiny secondary hull of an NCA; something that the fast NCA showed is able to handle the strain of a third standard Warp engine (at least that's MY assessment from the SSD).

The resulting Fralli CVA would be able to deliver as many as 26 ADMIN to the Field of Gory... Uhh, GLORY... and, umm, I think that sort of ship would likely have a movement cost of 2, but still, with 36 units of WARP, would be limited to a maximum speed of, at best 19. I'd also expect it to have a turn mode of F (at best).

(Mind you, I'm definitely NOT a Professional Engineer, so I could be WAY off base with all this...)

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Friday, September 13, 2019 - 08:26 am: Edit

ADM had listed one option as the VT saucer replaces the front end of a POL...

As I recall, the Fralli national guard/ FralliPOL thingy was a Federation frigate saucer mated with a POL rear hull. Not sure if either Steve commented on it, so I do not know how well it was received.

Point is, a VT converted into a FralliPOL thingy would be a logical (if ugly) smaller stablemate for the frigatePOL. One photon instead of two, but otherwise very similar layout and weapons suite. Probably will end up with one less phaser 1 as well.

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Friday, September 13, 2019 - 03:36 pm: Edit

To follow up.

The movement cost of the VT saucer is 1/4=0.25

The rear hull of a POL hull is half of 1/3... call it 1/6.

The result of ADM first point would thus be ((1/4)+(1/6))X MC.

Expressed in a different manner, it would be, ((3/12)+(2/12))=5/12 MC

More than 1/3 and less than 1/2.

To put it in to numbers, the resulting ship needs less than 16 warp power boxes to achieve 30 hex per turn, 10 or more warp power points to get to speed 24 (using warp power only).

5 points of warp power would push the hull 12 hexes per turn.

Impulse could increase the speed up by one hex per turn.

A different / larger rear hull would give a different result.

I just do not see a fed full size rear hull being available, unless it was a W or Y tech era that.

By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Friday, September 13, 2019 - 06:27 pm: Edit

Is THIS what you want??


Garth L. Getgen

By A. David Merritt (Adm) on Friday, September 13, 2019 - 07:29 pm: Edit

That looks about right, although I could see cutouts on the saucer, and keeping the two shuttles.

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Friday, September 13, 2019 - 08:14 pm: Edit

Guys, it's a better PoL Than the POL+

3 phaser 1's, (one 360 degrees!)
1 photon torpedo.
4 phaser 3's.
2 drone racks (type G?)

By A. David Merritt (Adm) on Friday, September 13, 2019 - 08:35 pm: Edit

If it is intended to be a FF equivalent it ought to be. If you want to limit it's production to a handful, give it a bad break down rating, and a low speed capability, like National Guard units have.

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Friday, September 13, 2019 - 09:50 pm: Edit

The Federation badly needs a new production police ship for the X era. For a variety of reasons, the only X1 hull in the running is the Federation Frigate as it is too weak for the line of battle in the ISC pacification, the Andromedan invasion and the onset of the Trade Wars. That could be a opportunity to assume control of the whole class of ships for police duty sometime after year 202.

Until/ unless a X1 saucer design is approved and enters production, the POL+, and the "modern" police ships in captains log will just have to soldier on.

This PVT (police corvette?) is about the best armed size class 4 hull yet.

There was a comment in one of the captains logs about the engine manufacturer of the POL 5 point engines concerned about future production orders. A PVT design that uses three POL warp engines and a movement cost of about 5/12=0.41667 would be a kind of dream come true for them.

Even with a bad break down rating, (speed is still open for negotiation until the steves decide), a PVT could be an Interim production ship until an actual Xpolice ship shows up.

By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Saturday, September 14, 2019 - 11:56 am: Edit

Answering Jeff's comment in another topic, ref putting the engines on top: It doesn't matter if they're on top or bottom, because to weld on a POL aft cylinder means it would have the same number of decks above and below. The rim of the saucer is only two decks thick, so it would attach at Decks 4 / 5 out of 8. As long as the VT's engines are 30+ meter apart, they'll clear the aft hull.

As to the Police needing an X-POL, personally, I don't think they do. They would be retiring the POL in favor of re-purposing retired FFGs.


Garth L. Getgen