Archive through February 07, 2021
Star Fleet Universe Discussion Board: Star Fleet Battles: Star Fleet Battles Online: SFB Online Client: The New Look for the Client: Archive through February 07, 2021
By Paul Franz (Andromedan) on Wednesday, January 27, 2021 - 09:25 pm: Edit

I will be releasing a new version of the client which changes the initial screen. I have recorded it in the YouTube video of my SFU On Call podcast. But I will be posting a short video clip here a little later tonight to give people a heads up. It is not a huge to the client, but I feel like it is step towards making the client a but more "modern".

By Paul Franz (Andromedan) on Wednesday, January 27, 2021 - 09:50 pm: Edit

Short Video on the new initial screen

By Gregory S Flusche (Vandar) on Thursday, January 28, 2021 - 05:30 pm: Edit

Refuse to connect is says

By Paul Franz (Andromedan) on Thursday, January 28, 2021 - 07:36 pm: Edit

Gregory,
You need to use one of the alternate connections because you Anti-Virus is blocking the port used by the the default connection.

By Gregory S Flusche (Vandar) on Friday, January 29, 2021 - 05:55 pm: Edit

ahhh

By Paul Franz (Andromedan) on Friday, January 29, 2021 - 09:49 pm: Edit

What I think it is meant by "modern"


As part of the comments about the SFU Online Client is that it is not "modern". Unfortunately, nobody gave an example or definition, so I will tell you my take from the game videos and screenshots that I have found on the inter webs.

1. The client is full screen. So:
a) The only thing that you are using at that time is the client and nothing else.
b) If go into a game (either as an observer or a player), that is the only thing you see.
2. The game board takes up most of the screen.
3. Any "windows" have no decoration. (No minimize, maximize or way to resize). The windows move by clicking on a part of the "window" and drag.
4. Most "windows" are popups. That is they are designed to come up and then after you find the information in them they are dismissed.
5. The edge of the "windows" are just borders, no shadows or other highlighting. It has a very flat look to it.
6. No menu at the top of the screen.
7. Popup menus are fine. But icons are preferred.
8. Drag and drop is nice, but not required.

By wayne douglas power (Wayne) on Friday, January 29, 2021 - 11:03 pm: Edit

I am used to using the client as is (and still learning more every game), I do not like the idea of having to learn a new "modern" one. With the new "modern" client some computers may have trouble running it or loading it.

By Russ Simkins (Madcowak) on Saturday, January 30, 2021 - 07:22 am: Edit

A modern look - my guess is that calls for modern are thinking of the flashy graphics like those in all the games I've seen listed as examples. Games with development budgets that include graphic artists and a team of coders. That's all pretty to look at but anyone who has bought more than a couple of computer games has some list of beautiful looking but painfully unplayable games.
I look at all my favs and in all but a few, the graphics are substandard to many of their competitors products but the gameplay is so compelling.
SFB is a compelling game for all of us obviously or you wouldn't be here reading this. The issue to me is how to best translate this game to a computer screen and less about how pretty it looks. I have a friend who is a devoted player of a very gorgeous online game (WoW) and scoffs at anyone who plays and ugly game like Minecraft. The level graphics are decades apart. Yet WoW has somewhere around 5 million players while Minecraft is over 126 million.
I liken the modern argument to that directed at our game's SSDs. There is a clamor for an updated look to the SSDs. Yet I myself have looked long and hard at how they could be improved. Sure you can slap a pretty ship graphic under all the boxes and a few tweaks but ultimately the question is, does any of that make the game more fun to play?
SFB is a great game and stands strong against other similarly themed games even if the aesthetics aren't as contemporary as .
Paul asked a great question somewhere of "What are your expectations of how SFB Online should work?" That is a great question and the one I think would be the most helpful to hear opinions on.

As for Wayne's concerns, Paul has strongly stated in recent podcasts that keeping the existing subscribers satisfied is THE top priority.

I think I'm on my fourth one-year subscription for time reasons have yet to spend that precious resource on deciphering the interface. Kind of a bucket list thing to get to play someday but having only a weak understanding of how it works allows me to offer opinions of someone new to the client. For my part I've spent several days pondering and Paul is going to get a good account of what I would envision if I were to write a computer based SFB head-to-head game. How it would work and what advantages it might offer. I have a good list of ideas and maybe some of them won't be ridiculous!

By Aaron Staley (Awwwdrat) on Saturday, January 30, 2021 - 11:46 am: Edit

Paul, when can we come together and do a podcast on what i want to do?

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Saturday, January 30, 2021 - 08:39 pm: Edit

You aren’t going to replace the ship graphics, Aaron. Just making sure you understand what I told you a month ago. There is just nothing to be gained for all the effort and uproar.

By Aaron Staley (Awwwdrat) on Sunday, January 31, 2021 - 03:14 am: Edit

Its really so sad that dogs can't purr.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Sunday, January 31, 2021 - 04:19 am: Edit

Grrrrr

By Paul Franz (Andromedan) on Sunday, January 31, 2021 - 02:13 pm: Edit

Ignore the two dogs in the back. :-)

The idea of this topic is to engage with current subscribers (since most of long time subscribers and like the Discussion Board) and do a few things here:



As Russ pointed out, the current subscribers are very important to me. But I do see that the client needs to change. It needs to be simplified and made more straight forward. Some of the obvious ways to do that will be to remove some functionality which I don't see people using. Some of those are:



Some of it will be reorganizing things. For example, the way games are saved. Currently you can either save games locally on save them "online" (i.e. in the "cloud"). That was one of those this that was mentioned in the client survey that players wanted but already exists. Which tells me that it is too "hidden" for people to see. (For people in the know it is under "Game\My Online Games" menu)

There are some things that I have thought about for awhile and have yet to figure out.



Some of the changes I think that the veteran players will look forward to. For example, I change the map so that when you click and drag the mouse it moves the map instead of needing to use the scroll bars.

Some of the changes I think the veteran players will just shrug because it does not change anything for them. For example, the three removals from the menu above.

Obviously if any the changes I make, upsets a long standing player I want to here it. So please, feel free to send me feedback.

So please help me to improve the client in a way that you want to see it be better.

By Russ Simkins (Madcowak) on Monday, February 01, 2021 - 08:44 am: Edit

Made big progress on my "report" this weekend and continue to plug away at creating something presentable...

By Paul Franz (Andromedan) on Monday, February 01, 2021 - 08:19 pm: Edit

Russ,
I can't wait for your report.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Monday, February 01, 2021 - 10:26 pm: Edit

I would like to see it too.

By Paul Franz (Andromedan) on Friday, February 05, 2021 - 10:50 pm: Edit

As I wait for the report from Russ I will post some of my specific to ideas for changing the client:

1. Remove the menus from the client (specifically the ones at the top of the window or screen) and either require people to use context/popup menus or icons from a tool palette.

2. Make the current tool palette that is at the top of the board floating (which can do now), but orient the palette to in a up/down instead of left/right orientation.

3. Remove the tabs for the Impulse Chart, Notes and Logs. These will still be available but only as floating windows. (There would be a tool on the tool palette)

I think those will be agreeable by most current players and future players will like the simplification.

By Gregg Dieckhaus (Gdieck) on Saturday, February 06, 2021 - 12:11 am: Edit

My biggest want is the ability to flip the map so when I start at 2530 I'm not upside down!

By Russ Simkins (Madcowak) on Saturday, February 06, 2021 - 05:43 am: Edit

Still workings on it. Been a busy week (don't get home until 1 am) but have the weekend to get at least the first part of it to you. You want details so I'm trying to deliver something with real value.

Gregg's idea is brilliant

By Russ Simkins (Madcowak) on Saturday, February 06, 2021 - 08:41 am: Edit

Got a couple more hours of work done. 4:30am so I'm going to crash. Oh yeah, I'm a KC Chiefs fan so the hours for Sunday's efforts might be a little shortened! TOUCHDOWN KANSAS CITY!!!

By Paul Franz (Andromedan) on Saturday, February 06, 2021 - 01:12 pm: Edit

Gregg's idea has been asked for, for around 10 years. The difficulty is the amount of code that is required to be modified for such a "little" feature. All of the code points that calculate position and orientation need to be changed so that they go through a translation layer. When you drag the ship up means direction D not direction A. Direction A for a counter means pointing down not up.

BTW, there is one question I have about the feature. Would people want the hex numbers upside down at the bottom of the hex at the so that the orientation matches a real board or would you want them at the top of the hex upside right? But the Y coordinate goes up as you go up the screen?

By Frank Lemay (Princeton) on Saturday, February 06, 2021 - 08:42 pm: Edit

If you are taking a poll Paul re the upside down hex numbers, I will say 'nope'

Cheers
Frank

By Paul Franz (Andromedan) on Saturday, February 06, 2021 - 09:16 pm: Edit

Frank,
Yes. I am taking a poll.

By wayne douglas power (Wayne) on Saturday, February 06, 2021 - 11:40 pm: Edit

I say nay, the map being upside down (starting in hex 1701D) is no problem for me (to much code work for to little).

By Paul Franz (Andromedan) on Sunday, February 07, 2021 - 10:51 am: Edit

Wayne,
At the moment, that feature is far down the list compared to the goal of modernizing the interface.

I have a feeling that I am going to put out the release with all of the changes and people are then going to voice issues when what I have been doing and it will be too late.

Oh well, there is only so much I can do to engage with the veteran players.

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