In the Star Fleet Universe, as well as over in the post-1979 Franchise, there is the concept of a "fleet museum", in which ships of historical renown are maintained and curated for future generations to experience.

So far as the Franchise Fleet Museum is concerned, there is an article covering it over on Memory Alpha - though I would advise anyone wanting to read more about it to bear in mind that said article contains major spoilers for season 3 of Star Trek: Picard before clicking this link. (There is at least one ship in the Franchise Museum which might be a welcome sight around here, even if its name and registry do not line up with their SFU equivalents...)

Here in the SFU, various issues of Captain's Log have explicitly noted two retired Federation ships as being in the Star Fleet Museum; while there is also a Star Fleet ship and a Vulcan ship noted as being converted into museums, though it's not specified whether either or both are in the Star Fleet Museum or located elsewhere.

But then, even the location and configuration of the Star Fleet Museum itself is as yet unknown...

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So, I thought it might be interesting to create this thread, so as to use it for the following purposes:

1. To list all of the known instances where a given ship has been noted as being placed in the Star Fleet Museum.

2. To list any other "museum ships" noted as existing somewhere in Federation space,

3. To speculate on what other ships or units of note - Federation or otherwise - might be found at the Star Fleet Museum,

4. To postulate on what configuration the Star Fleet Museum itself is in, as well as where it might be located, plus how it was founded and evolved over time,

and

5. To consider what other "museum ships" might exist elsewhere in the Star Fleet Universe, and how those museums might be located, configured, and maintained by their respective empires.

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So far as I am aware, the Federation "museum ships" confirmed to exist - in the Star Fl9eet Museum or (possibly) elsewhere - are as follows:

The heavy cruiser NCC-1700 USS Constitution; noted as being converted into a museum ship (yet not explicitly noted as being in the Star Fleet Museum itself) in Y209, according to the "developmental history" article in Captain's Log #52,

The Galactic Survey Cruisers NCC-1809 USS Challenger and NCC-1810 USS Columbia; both were transferred to the Museum in Y205, according to the "class history" article in Captain's Log #41,

and

A Vulcan Warp-Refitted Command Cruiser (either Sagavok or Sarpedion); one of these two ships is a museum, on account of it hosting the peace talks which ended the First Federation-Kzinti War. Its location is presently unknown.

Personally, I could think of a few other ships of note which might be interesting candidates for inclusion at the Star Fleet Museum - not least of which being the legendary CVL NCC-1802 USS Darwin, which is noted as being retired from active duty in Y208.

Are there candidate ships you might have in mind, in terms of potential inclusion in the Star Fleet Museum?

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Monday, September 04, 2023 - 08:22 pm: Edit

So far as the Franchise Fleet Museum is concerned, the Director of the United States Naval Academy Museum has posted his thoughts on its on-screen portrayal from Picard season 3 - again, spoiler alert - in this YouTube video, for anyone so interested.

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Back to the Star Fleet Universe version:

It might be worth clarifying whether or not there are separate "service museums" for the Federation Police, for the Star Fleet Marines, and/or for the major National Guards (of Earth, Mars, Vulcan, Andor, etc.). Or, for that matter, if there is a Federation-wide "Museum of the National Guards", covering all of them at once, alongside any distinct museums run by each of the various member worlds.

Also, it might be worth seeing what, if any, connection there is between these museums and the Star Fleet Bureau of History, as noted in Prime Directive Federation. No doubt the various museum ships to be found across Federation space (and beyond) would be useful pints of reference, and objects of research, for authors and analysts writing up the various in-universe volumes published by this Bureau on a regular basis.

And regardless of where these museums are to be placed, one might need to ensure that there are enough support facilities on hand both to maintain the ships in the collection and to make sure that no-one tries to abscond with any of them, without being quite so elaborate as to risk getting poached by any of the active duty services...

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Personally, I would guess that the Star Fleet Museum has its own dedicated civilian base station, plus a maintenance dock capable of servicing at least one of the museum ships at a time, if needs be.

This might put a size limit on the type of ships to be placed in the museum. As in, if the maintenance dock can only berth a heavy cruiser at best, it would be much more difficult to maintain, say, an Early Years dreadnought.

So far as ships to include in the Museum, I'd hope to see at least one ship from each of the eras of warp travel: an old non-tactical warp ship from the First Romulan War; a warp-refitted Terran light cruiser; one of the Y-era "saucer-and-nacelle" hulls; and, at some point after Y205, perhaps a first-generation X-ship of note?

I would go head and say that the Constitution is berthed at the Museum, when she isn't operating under her own power in the manner of her wet-navy counterpart back on Earth.

Further, I'd say that the Vulcan museum ship is here too. The Vulcans themselves considered the use of this ship as a museum to be "illogical", so it would make sense for the Federation Council (who pushed for this to happen) to be the ones to "pick up the tab" by moving the ship to the Star Fleet Museum.

Aboard the civilian base station itself, one could reconfigure one or more of the hangar bay modules to operate "working models" of various Federation attack shuttles; other, non-fight-capable samples (to include an area for "donated" craft from other empires) could be stored in the station's cargo bay.

As for where to place it: I'm not saying it ought to go in the Sol system, not least since the other member worlds might not be keen on Earth (and, by extension, Mars) getting yet more of the good stuff. But, if it were to be parked somewhere at Sol... how about in orbit of Callisto? A moon large enough to host useful surface depots and other facilities aimed at supporting the museum, yet far enough from the worst of Jupiter's magnetosphere to keep a series of older hulls at a more manageable maintenance level.

Actually, now that I think of it, if the Star Feet Museum were to be put in orbit of Callisto, I would then place the Marine Museum on (or under) the surface of the moon itself; perhaps even parking a commando variant hull (or few) on the surface adjacent to it for good measure.

Not sure where I'd put a would-be Federation Police Museum (or a would-be Museum of the National Guards), though I'd picture the Earth and Martian National Guards maintaining their own separate museums elsewhere in the Sol system.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Wednesday, September 06, 2023 - 02:47 pm: Edit

FYEO

Peace Time: Chinese Military Museum Ships
September 4, 2023: China is adding a nuclear submarine and a Kilo-class diesel-electric submarine to its growing number of museum ships. With these new additions China will have seven museum ships. Worldwide there are over 200 museum ships, most of them established and maintained by non-government organizations. In China the government owns and maintains the seven military museum ships. Many countries maintain some commercial vessels as museum ships. All but two of the seven Chinese military museum ships were foreign built. The Chinese built museum ships include a destroyer and a nuclear submarine. The rest were originally obtained from Russia.
Chinese are particularly proud of the nuclear submarine museum ship because the sub was built in China. It is a Type 091 Long March No. 1 SSN (nuclear attack boat), completed in 1974. This first Chinese SSN was definitely a learning experience, not fully entering service until the mid-1980s. The Type 091s are small (4,100 tons) as SSN’s go and have a crew of about 75 sailors. French sonar was installed, and a lot of the other electronics came from foreign suppliers. In the 1980s it was thought the Chinese would just scrap this class but they kept repairing and updating them. The 091s are hopelessly out of date but five were built, one has been retired and the oldest is being turned into a museum ship.
The other Chinese museum ships include three destroyers, one frigate, and a Kiev-class Russian aircraft carrier. The Chinese are particularly proud of the museum ships built in China, especially the nuclear submarine.
There are a growing number of military museum ships worldwide, but many of them are not maintained by the government but by private groups. The growing number of museum ships has created a crisis in dealing with the growing cost of maintaining old warships as museums and tourist attractions. Most of these vessels are in the water and literally rusting away. Many are now in need of major refurbishment, which can cost over $100 million for a carrier or battleship. Even smaller ships (cruisers, destroyers, and submarines) can require over $20 million to put back into shape to just sit in the water, receive visitors, and not sink or fall apart the next time a major storm hits. Most of the largest of these museum ships are American, largely because the U.S. has had the largest fleet in the world for nearly a century.
The end of World War II and the Cold War put a lot of warships out of work. Most were broken up for scrap or sunk using weapons as a form of training. But increasingly over the years many were donated by the U.S. Navy for use as museum ships. Most of these were smaller ships, like PT Boats or patrol boats. A small seaside town could afford to maintain these small craft with local volunteers and some cash donations. But many cities sought to obtain large ships. This led to five aircraft carriers (USS Hornet, Intrepid, Lexington, Midway, and Yorktown) and ten battleships (USS Alabama, Arizona, Iowa, Massachusetts, Missouri, North Carolina, New Jersey, Texas, Utah, and Wisconsin) becoming impressive and very expensive to maintain museum ships. The Arizona was sunk at Pearl Harbor during the infamous 1941 Japanese sneak attack and a museum and memorial built around the largely submerged vessel. The other carriers and battleships are tied up at a pier and visitors are allowed to view many parts of the ship.
There are also over fifty destroyers, cruisers, amphibious ships, and submarines serving as museum ships. More are on the way, if the cost of maintaining current museum ships does not scare off everyone. The World War II Museum Ships are all up for major refurbishment and the few that have had it have demonstrated that this sort of thing is very expensive.
For example, in 2009 the U.S. Navy retired its last non-nuclear aircraft carrier, the USS John F. Kennedy. The navy offered the ship to any government or non-profit organization that wants to maintain it as a museum ship. The navy never found any organization willing or able to turn the carrier into a museum ship and it was scrapped in 2021. Entering service in 1968, the Kennedy was 321 meters (1052 feet) long and displaces 82,000 tons. It would have been the largest museum ship ever. The big problem was that it could cost several hundred million dollars to transform it into a museum ship and maintain it.
The U.S. Navy has long been willing to donate old ships to groups that were willing to maintain the retired vessels as museum ships. But the navy attached some very expensive strings. That is, the navy expects the ship to be kept in decent shape. This is a problem with many old metal ships, as they rust. And eventually they rust so much that the hull is breached and ultimately will collapse. The navy has not yet repossessed any museum ships but a growing number of these ships are deteriorating. Refurbishment is so expensive that some sponsoring groups are considering letting the navy have the ship back.
For example, the World War II era Essex class carrier USS Intrepid, in New York City, returned to its display berth in 2009, after a two year refurbishment costing $120 million. The entire hull was examined, in dry dock, for decay and over a hundred square meters (nearly a thousand square feet) of hull had to be replaced. A sister ship of the Intrepid, the Yorktown, requires a similar refurbishment. Since 1975, the Yorktown has been on display in Charleston, South Carolina, with several other museum ships. The Yorktown, which entered service four months before the Intrepid, needs the same kind of work. The navy is insisting on it, with the alternatives being sending the ship to the breakers or a lawsuit. The naval museum in South Carolina is in a bad situation, as $120 million is hard to find, even when the economy (and wealthy donors) are doing well. The big donors are much harder to find these days.
Another popular option is to use old ships for target practice. A prominent example of this is how most of the 30 decommissioned Spruance class destroyers were used for target practice. Some old warships are sunk closer to the shore, to provide reefs for fish and scuba divers. Running a SINKEX (sinking exercise) enables the navy to test some theories on how vulnerable, or invulnerable, modern warships are. But environmentalists oppose these two methods as well because it puts toxic materials into the ocean.
Going to the breakers is now seen as viable because of more efficient breaking techniques and higher prices for recycled metals. For the moment anyway.

By Lawrence Bergen (Lar) on Thursday, September 07, 2023 - 12:29 pm: Edit

The USS Hornet located in Alameda CA hosts many events in addition to being a museum. Two notables are a NYE celebration and auction fundraising event and a Boardgame Con every year.

By Eddie E Crutchfield (Librarian101) on Friday, September 08, 2023 - 09:12 am: Edit

Unfortunately many of the groups that want these ships as museum dont understand or plan for the long term maintenance that is needed. Even the ones that do are surprised at the cost. One you might be familiar with is the USS Texas the cost for it having work done on the hull and sone other repairs is 9 to 12 months and 35 million. I think if I remember it is being done with state funding and a matching federal grant.

By Eddie E Crutchfield (Librarian101) on Friday, September 08, 2023 - 09:35 am: Edit

The Sullivans the destroyer in Buffalo received 7.5 million from the Government for its repairs. Ships like that represent an important part of American history. The non-profits that run many of these ships are just not as popular as they once were as we become further removed from the events they participated in. Maybe we should take some of the money politicians raise to get elected to support our history. Sorry it is just a sore spot with me having visited and donated to many

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Sunday, September 10, 2023 - 03:39 pm: Edit

For comparison's sake, the Lyran Democratic Republic kept the LCA Republic as a museum ship in orbit of Demorak; according to the writeup in Module C3A, the LDR navy's Seventh Fleet (tasked with the ship's upkeep) operated small craft - mostly shuttles - in order to ferry tourists to and from the ship.

As for the Republic itself, the majority of its systems were dormant: according to (T12.3321), only the bridge, forward hull, impulse, batteries, sensor, scanner, one admin shuttle bay (with an advanced admin shuttle as of Y195), two transporters, and one tractor beam were active. While its shields could be operated at minimum strength. This was enough to keep the lights on, to protect the ship from floating orbital debris, and to ensure backups are in place should the tourists aboard need to be evacuated in a hurry... such as, say, when two Dominators show up in the vicinity to cause trouble.

The Seventh Fleet also operated various museums on the planet's surface, all dedicated to "The Revolution".

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Presumably, whichever agency is tasked with maintaining the Star Fleet Museum would follow similar guidelines, albeit on a larger scale.

To that end, I would perhaps suggest that Star Fleet operates the museum itself: under the primary auspices of the aforementioned Bureau of History, with the required support from the appropriate Bureaus (Logistics, Personnel, Veterans' Affairs, etc.) required to keep everything in order.

Also: while the writeup for the Jovian system in Prime Directive Federation mainly focuses on the other three Galilean moons (Io, Europa, and Ganymede), it doesn't say much one way or the other about Callisto. Although, in "our" universe, NASA appears to favour Callisto over the others as a future outpost site - not least since the surface radiation level is equivalent to a "mere" 0.1 mSv per day. (Not sure what the levels are like in orbit of Callisto, however.)

Would any or all of this make Callisto more, or less, suitable to host the Museum, I wonder?

By Mike Grafton (Mike_Grafton) on Monday, September 11, 2023 - 07:43 am: Edit

Of course, maintenance could be done by recruits as part of their training.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Monday, September 11, 2023 - 02:32 pm: Edit

When I wrote the GSC article, I didn't want to list the Challenger or Columbia as destroyed or scrapped out of respect. I did not think that Star Fleet would sell such a ship to private hands, so I put them both in the museum although two such ships seems a bit much. I probably should have listed one as a training vessel.

By Douglas Saldana (Dsal) on Monday, September 11, 2023 - 03:15 pm: Edit

I think you would want a museum to be where the people are, so Earth would be a better location for Starfleet's flagship museum. Also, the ships would be more accessible (to a larger number of people) if they were internally docked, so Earth's Starbase would be ideal. If a single docking module was set aside for use by the museum, you could have maybe 4 ships docked internally, a couple of more externally docked and use of a shuttle bay/deck for smaller craft.

While the museum might be run by the Bureau of History, the maintenance and staffing of the ships could be the responsibility of the 8th fleet (which oversees training ships and the mothball fleet). 8th fleet would have the necessary experience maintaining older vessels and, in contemporary history, it is not unusual for museum ships to have served as training ships prior to their retirement. 

The actual line-up of ships might change from year to year as ships are loaned out to (or received from) other museums. The ships themselves may be kept in varying states of repair. Anything from ships fully restored to operating condition (so they may take part in various commemorations, holidays and naval reviews) to complete wrecks documenting the savagery of war. Some ships might be used in a "living history" role (with actors rather than star fleet personnel) or refurbished while on public display for those interested in the process of restoring old ships.

There are likely even some foreign ships on display (captured, purchased, or on loan from friendly governments) and possibly an "ancient" wreck from a fallen civilization. 

By Ryan Opel (Ryan) on Tuesday, September 12, 2023 - 02:54 am: Edit

Challenger and Columbia rotate between the Earth National Guard and the Fleet Museum. Replacing the Amergio Vespucci as Earth's exploration ship.

By Mike Grafton (Mike_Grafton) on Tuesday, September 12, 2023 - 08:21 am: Edit

You DON'T want hordes of "tourists" wandering around your starbase. Better a dedicated COMPLAT or something.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Wednesday, September 13, 2023 - 04:02 pm: Edit

I wouldn't see Star Fleet wanting to take up valuable docking room in an "active-duty" starbase to house one or more museum ships. Nor would I see them doing what the Franchise museum does, in terms of what manner of facility would be used (or decommissioned from active service) to host the museum itself.

On the other hand, there are plenty of civilian base stations "below" the level at which a facility must be accounted for in Federation and Empire terms. Using one of those - plus a maintenance dock in which a given ship can be berthed for the occasional overhaul, and whichever ground-based assets would be needed in order to support both orbital facilities - should be enough to keep the museum running without unduly subtracting from the "active duty" fleets.

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I mention Callisto as a proposed site for the museum for a couple of reasons.

For one thing, Earth orbit is a pretty crowded place: with Star Fleet, the Federation Police, the Earth National Guard, the Federation Assembly and Council, envoys and ambassadors travelling to and from the rest of the Federation (and beyond), plus all manner of civilian transport units going to and fro. It all adds up to a hectic traffic control environment.

While the Jovian system is populated, the bulk of attention there is focused on Ganymede, which acts as the main transit hub for the region; and on Io, which offers a hazardous work environment, to say the least... Callisto, on top of its benefits in terms of the local radiation levels, would provide a more controlled environment for the museum traffic-wise.

Plus, while it might be a bit more of an inconvenience for tourists from Earth (or Mars) to go to Callisto to see the museum were it placed there, visitors from outside of the Sol system would not notice much of a difference. Although, they might still be annoyed at it being in the Sol system in the first place, given how much it already outweighs the rest of the Federation in economic and political terms. (Indeed, Callisto might be seen as a political compromise: keeping the museum in the Sol system without parking it in Earth or Mars orbit.)

But, of course, if another site ends up being a better choice going forward, well and good.

By Douglas Saldana (Dsal) on Wednesday, September 13, 2023 - 06:50 pm: Edit

Earth is, by far, the largest population center in the SOL system and is likely to make up the majority of the museum's patrons. If the museum is located in Earth orbit, traffic control would actually be LESS of an issue since people would be able to reach the museum by transporter (and those arriving by shuttle would at least have a shorter trip). Visitors from other systems are not likely to be visiting SOL just to see the museum and would probably be visiting Earth anyway. Even the museum staff are likely to prefer "an easy commute".

I still think setting aside a Starbase module is a better option than a dedicated civilian station. I doubt it would be cost effective to construct a civilian station solely for the purpose of a museum (tickets sales probably wouldn't pay the operating costs much less than cost to build it). As to the Starbase losing that "valuable docking room", keep in mind that the extensive infrastructure of the home system (shipyards, repair docks, civilian stations, ground-based spaceports and industry) would likely result in less pressure on the home-system Starbase to provide docking services. The Starbases supporting the border fleets are not usually co-located with major or minor industrial planets and therefore shoulder a much greater burden. This disparity becomes even greater when you consider the vast resources of the capital hex as a whole compared to what you would find in proximity to starbase supporting a border fleet (and Home Fleet has no fewer than SIX starbases at its disposal ).

By MarkSHoyle (Bolo) on Wednesday, September 13, 2023 - 07:23 pm: Edit

Considering the same face of the Moon is toward Earth all the time, putting things on the surface and using Transporter relays to get visitors to and from it, would probably be the easiest.....

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Wednesday, September 13, 2023 - 08:56 pm: Edit

384,400 kilometers.

Earth to the moon.

Divide by 10,000

38.4 SFB tactical hexes.
Round up to 40 hexes, divide by 5.

That would give the number of hexes needed to base a transporter repeater.

I do not know if you can establish a stable orbit for what ever thing you put the repeater on, or if it can maintain the same relative position relative to both the moon and earth, and keep them in. Position 24hours a day/7 days a week for years at a time. (Note:powering a transporter requires 0.2 points of power power turn. Such power must be generated on board what ever thingy you base the transporter repeater on.)

Might be cheaper to use a shuttle or a bus/yacht non starship.

Traffic control might be a problem. Filling up the moon earth orbit with things to base trans porter repeaters on seems too much complexity.