This would violate normal SFB rules...but I offer this proposal for discussion and consideration in Steller Shadows.

Big GUN Steller Shadows Federation Dreadnoughtby Jeff Wile.

Starships for the various races have some significant similarities...Warp power for movement, a heavy weapons suite (for dreadnoughts often 4 or 6) a secondary battery consisting of (very often) phasers (again, most often Phaser 1's but occasionally phaser 2's) and tertiary battery (phaser 3's, drone racks, ADD etc...

There is again, an indirect defense that includes transporters, tractors, shuttles, fighters and other things.

In the Case of the Federation the main heavy weapon is the Photon torpedo...a system that does not lose potency with range. (accuracy, is a different question!)

Simply put, the proposal is to mount in a Standard Federation Dreadnought additional Photon torpedos in place of the Phaser 1's in the Saucer section. (leave the Phaser 1's in the secondary hull inplace.

This would increase the Photons from 4 to 10. it would reduce the Phaser 1's by 6.

No change to any other systems in the ship.

The inspiration for this is the HMS Dreadnought built by the Royal Navy in 1906. Like that ship, it has significant challenges.

#1. the entire battery of photons may not all be fired at the same time. All photons are to be numbered 1 to 10. Even number photons may not be fired within 1/2 turn (16 impulses) of any odd number photon. the result is 2 salvos per turn at max rate of fire every other turn. if a slower rate of fire is chosen, the SSFDN may fire 5 photons every turn but never within 16 impulses of firing the other battery.
#2 Only the original Photons may be overloaded. Photons located in the Phaser 1 positions may only use standard or proximity war heads.

Discussion:

In fleet actions, the Dreadnought tends to be both the flagship of the force as well as occupant of the best protected position in the force...this tends to have smaller ships in the battleforce closer to the enemy ships than the dreadnought. as a result over time the 2ndary battery of phaser 1's are fired at ranges that are not optimum fire constrol solutions.

By changing the weapons mix of the DN to mostly Photons, it is hoped that total damage inflicted on enemy ships per successful hit will increase.

One benefit to this hypothesis, is that all other heavy weapons utilized by races bordering the Federation DO lose warhead strength with range so the chances that other races would follow with competitive designs to the SSFDN will be minimal as the strength of the proposal is the characteristics of the Photon Torpedo...not the number of system boxes devoted to the heavy weapons.

Under normal operations, the ship does not use overloaded photons. the weapons (10 photons) require 2 points of warp energy per turn to operate, thus 20 points in total warp energy. the stnadard DN would require 8 points of warpenergy for the photons and 6 points from any source to power the phasers. this totals 8+6 = 14 points compared to 20 for the SSFDN. if all other factors remain equal (speed, housekeeping, firecontrol etc) the SSFDN would be tactically slower unless some of the photons are left unpowered...such considerations will need to be evaluated in combat.

The role of this ship is to remain out of direct combat inflicting photon damage on the approaching enemy forces beyond the effective range of those enemy forces to respond.

By John Trauger (Vorlonagent) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 05:14 pm: Edit

Can you say "shock and lots of it?"

Sure.

I knew you could.

By Scott Tenhoff (Scottt) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 05:22 pm: Edit

Shock wouldn't matter, you just plan to pump out 4 Prox Photon's a turn, forever.

By Robert Cole (Zathras) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 05:23 pm: Edit

Ick. Why not propose the Bombardment Cruiser that's been mentioned for years. SFC had one with 8 side-firing torps on a CA.

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 05:30 pm: Edit

Use the DN+. Total of 12 Photons for six each turn. Five is...odd. (pun intended)

Shock? Not with just six each turn. Could say that to fit all that stuff each pair of photons share the same tube. Each tube fires once per turn max. On the SSD draw an arrow through each pair. For fun make a rule that if all twelve are fire at once six make it out towards their target the other six explode in the tube for full damage (proxs considered 8) internally.

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 05:37 pm: Edit

Sounds like the DNJ. Eight photons, mounted on a modified DNH hull.

Federation DNJ

Or, as Rob suggests, a CBB. This was a stab I took at such a design, though it isn't much like the one in SFC (which was an X ship, as I recall.)

Federation Bombardment Cruiser

By Robert Cole (Zathras) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 05:42 pm: Edit

Actually, this is the SFC design - the Fire Support Cruiser.

My F&E Stats are 10+\5 with the mauler bonus limited to bases (like the Hydran FSP).

⁴²

By John Trauger (Vorlonagent) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 07:26 pm: Edit

Another visit from shockville.

My gosh, 4 drones AND 8 photons?

The poster-bi for the Fed Slowdown.

Couldn't you at least give the guy some extra AWR?

By Robert Cole (Zathras) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 08:50 pm: Edit

Well, in the CFS's case, I just made the SSD as presented by Taldren in SFC.

In fact, I have an entire project dedicated to converting SFC ships into SFB SSDs.

⁴²

By John Trauger (Vorlonagent) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 09:21 pm: Edit

Did all those photons ever load at once? You'd have to be about stationary to do it.

By Jeremy Gray (Gray) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 09:40 pm: Edit

With the + refit, I could run the thing at moderate speeds and get all the tubes to reload as standards. However, if I ever got cute and started firing phasers - or so much as looked at the overload button - the thing either had to slow way down or it just became a big lumbering target with no punch.

By John Trauger (Vorlonagent) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 10:00 pm: Edit

That's why I like seeking weapons in SFC

By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 10:07 pm: Edit

I chose the regular dreadnought for sentimental reasons...10 photons were reminiscent of the 10 twelve inch main guns mounted on HMS Dreadnought.

Yes the various refits would improve the design effectiveness.

I havent even looked at what this kind of theme would do to the Federation Battleship...(U.S.S. Mars iirc...Oh My...)

By David Slatter (Davidas) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 04:31 am: Edit

Hey, why not put a "big gun" proper on the ship. Like a mauler, only a proper weapon system, with longer range than the mauler. Damage roughly equal to double a P-4, but shorter range than a P-4 (equiv to photon say) and a restricted arc (but not as bad as a mauler - *maybe* FA).
It would take three or four turns to charge, maybe 6-10 power per turn. You could perhaps stipulate that the ship has to tractor another ship (or asteroid) to fire it, to provide extra stability against the recoil. If tractoring an asteroid, the weapon gets more powerful depending on the amount of power spent on tractor (note that the ship will be stationary at this point, so this is a significant penalty). In effect, the ship is using ad-hoc positional stabilisers.

If I see the words "big gun" on a Fed DN, that's the kind of thing I envisage, not just more photons.

By David Lang (Dlang) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 04:53 am: Edit

for a 'big gun' DN, take the FRAX DN take the P-1 and replace about half of them with heavy weapons and the other half with P-G

By David Slatter (Davidas) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 04:58 am: Edit

That isn't a big gun. That's just lots of normal heavy weapons. But maybe I see things differently.

By David Lang (Dlang) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 05:41 am: Edit

well, the real big gun would be to put P-4 on it instead of the HW, but that's not allowed
much better power/damage ratio as well

By Martin Read (Amethyst_Cat) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 06:05 am: Edit

Three/four-turn arming weapon... sounds like the Wave Motion Cannon

By Kenneth Jones (Kludge) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 07:56 am: Edit

Yep it sure does sound Like a Wave Motion Gun.

But if you guys want to put something with more punch. Why not mount Ph-M's in turrents

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 08:14 am: Edit

Don't joke about it. I made a Frax DN that replaces the disruptors with Ph-M turrets. Talk about ugly.

By Jeremy Gray (Gray) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 08:38 am: Edit

I designed an entire race that used Ph-Ms in turrets as their heavy weapons (of course their ships tended to be sort of small to compensate for the rediculous power - damage ratio).

By Tim Longacre (Timl) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 10:24 am: Edit

If you want big guns on ships, why not replace all of the heavy weapons on any particular ship with TRHs? Those are about as big as a ship-mounted DF weapons get.

By Robert Cole (Zathras) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 10:31 am: Edit

Wave Motion Gun = PPD which fires all 4 (or 6) pulses in a single impulse. =)

⁴²

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 10:46 am: Edit

Well, if you REALLY wanna get big about it, take a Frax BB. Replace the disruptors with mega photons, and the phasers with Ph-M's. Ditch the lab for AWR, convert existing APR to AWR, and watch the show.

By Kenneth Jones (Kludge) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 01:54 pm: Edit

Ok Give a Mauler 5 pt Bats. 36*5+30 regular power=210*2 (For point Blank)=420.

SB what SB? Oh you mean that hunk of junk thats been half vaporized