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Do the Omni scale Shapeways minis match the Metal ADB Shuttles and Fighters?

By Matthew G Lawson (Mglawson) on Monday, February 19, 2018 - 09:28 pm: Edit

Actually the fighters despite being omni are in scale with each other given official sizing information and in accordance with Will's F18. You can throw out numbers all you like based on line drawings, in the end most likely the fighters we have in posession will just be a simple scale increase like my test prints above not a major overhaul of design. Exception probably the drones since we can make them a little leaner given Shapeways tolerances at this larger size.

By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Tuesday, February 20, 2018 - 12:14 am: Edit

No, Matthew, the Omni scale are not to-scale with each other. William was very specific about that. He and I had a fight over the F-14 & F-15 at the time due to this very point. I wanted them to be scaled together, and he said they could not because they had to fit a particular size. They had to all be 5/8s of an inch, I believe, so all the Omnis are that size, disregarding a sense of scale.
SVC NOTES THAT THIS IS ALL JUST WRONG.

Garth L. Getgen

By Will McCammon (Djdood) on Tuesday, February 20, 2018 - 01:44 am: Edit

Garth -

Show me a quote where I said that. I recall no fight about the F-14 and F-15. You're quoting me incorrectly and using that to push *your* version of a point. Bad form and frankly, ticking me off since I just had to spend half an hour to pull up the data below, rather than work on the Klingon tug like I'm supposed to be doing.

The 5/8 inch (0.625) bounding box was discussed for *PF gunboats* and is how long the Klingon G-1 was set at.

The F-18 was the yardstick for fighters. There was much discussion of how big the bounding box around it should be. In the end, it was put as close to the Todd Boyce metal mini as possible (0.595 inch long).

The other fighters are scaled relative to it, with any existing metal mini as a primary guide. Some were adjusted for printing realities (both the Klingon Z-Y [0.508 inch] and Kzinti TAAS [.4600 inch] got marginally larger).

Matt's fighters were scaled relative to the 3 I did first. The shuttles were set where SVC said to put them, relative to the F-18.

If you want to challenge that sizing, you will be arguing with SVC. Good luck with that.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Tuesday, February 20, 2018 - 04:55 am: Edit

The Omni fighters are scaled to each other and 285 is gonna be notably bigger than the omnis.

The next person who stops Will McC from working on the T7 is going to be out of this topic for a week.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Tuesday, February 20, 2018 - 01:59 pm: Edit

Will sent this to help explain things.

By Andrew Schwenzer (Andrew_Cluetain) on Thursday, April 01, 2021 - 10:21 pm: Edit

First off, if I'm beating a dead horse, I don't realise it and apologize. Was there any interest or progress with the 285 Gunboats?

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Thursday, April 01, 2021 - 11:37 pm: Edit

Ya know, I don't know. If you're asking, maybe not, but there should be.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Friday, April 02, 2021 - 01:56 am: Edit

Will: gunboats?

By Steven Zamboni (Szamboni) on Friday, April 02, 2021 - 10:55 am: Edit

285 gunboats are 4 1/4 inches long. ($$$) I vaguely remember talking about commando versions in this scale for Marines.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Friday, April 02, 2021 - 11:29 am: Edit

Did we do gunboats in Omni?

By Steven Zamboni (Szamboni) on Friday, April 02, 2021 - 12:37 pm: Edit

Gunboats are in Omni, set at 5/8" so the minis are bigger than fighters. (Approx 1/1950 scale if my early-morning math is reliable.)

By Zac Belado (Pixelgeek) on Friday, April 02, 2021 - 12:46 pm: Edit

Which metal figs did Todd Boyce do?

By Will McCammon (Djdood) on Friday, April 02, 2021 - 09:17 pm: Edit

Gunboats were all done in Omni, to-scale only with each other (different, a bit larger, than the fighters)

Mr. Zamboni's summary is correct. The Klingon G-1 is the only one with firm "real world" size data behind it. A 1/285-scale G-1 would be 4.42 inches long. The cost would be more than double that of a 1/3125-scale Klingon B10 battleship, unless the bottom was made hollow to remove material or large drain holes to allow a hollow shell (it would still be spendy, even if that is done).

The actual scale for the Omni-scale Shapeways gunboats is 1/2005 scale by my math (Zamboni's early-morning math was plenty close enough).

Scale value for Omni-Scale fighter minis is impossible to nail-down, as there is no hard number for a "real world" example.

Todd Boyce did all the metal Starline fighters, drones, and plasma torpedos. He might have done some ships, but I have no firm knowledge there.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Friday, April 02, 2021 - 11:18 pm: Edit

No ships, just drones plasmas fighters

By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Saturday, April 03, 2021 - 01:50 am: Edit

Anyone happen to know the "real world" length of the G-1??


Garth L. Getgen

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Saturday, April 03, 2021 - 09:56 am: Edit

It is in the book, GK, but I don’t have a copy at home. I have a very awful cold and am not going in today.

By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Saturday, April 03, 2021 - 11:10 am: Edit

Thanks. Found it. Per GURPS -- Klingons page 119: "The G1 was 32 meters long (about 106 feet) and 24 meters wide."

I put a ruler to the screen (after adjusting zoom level to 1cm=1m) and confirmed 32 meter length, but I measured it at 25 meters wide.

Measuring the above (approximates), the Fed saucer appears to be 20 meters diameter, and the boat is 39 meter long overall. The Skiff is 31 meters long (30 meter body) by 24 meters wide. The courier is 29 meters long by 15 meters wide. Personally, I wish the Skiff and Courier were about 25%-33% bigger.


Garth L. Getgen

By Steven Zamboni (Szamboni) on Saturday, April 03, 2021 - 12:34 pm: Edit

I was using a 31-meter length from somewhere, so I'm off by a tad.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Saturday, April 03, 2021 - 03:48 pm: Edit

Here is the question. Given that we did 1/2000 PFs and that 1/285 PFs would be impossibly expensive, is there anything (1/500?) worth doing? If not, we can move on.

By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Saturday, April 03, 2021 - 04:31 pm: Edit

At 1:500, the Klingon G-1 would be 64mm x 50mm, or a hair over 2.5" long and a hair under 2.0" wide.

The Fed Mustang would be 3.07 inch long by 1.57 inch wide (saucer diameter) .... basically, the same size as the 3788 CA. So, my guess, they'd probably in the same price range.


Garth L. Getgen

By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Saturday, April 03, 2021 - 04:38 pm: Edit

Will, what if the 1:285 G-1 was made as a kit instead of a single solid piece? You could do the aft/main hull as a box with a separate flat panel for the bottom, and then the boom as another hollow piece. Would that work???


Garth L. Getgen

By Will McCammon (Djdood) on Saturday, April 03, 2021 - 05:48 pm: Edit

Not really, no.

That's what was done for the "kit" B10. It took many hours of work to turn the ship into separate parts with alignment features and then tree them, all for very little gain. It only ended up being marginally cheaper than the one-piece, as the increased footprint of the "kit" wiped out most of the savings. Not treeing them would only increase the price even more.

By Andrew Schwenzer (Andrew_Cluetain) on Saturday, April 03, 2021 - 10:38 pm: Edit

Okay, so Gunboats that size are too big/Expensive for even shapeways. I hoped new materials would change that. Ok thanks for letting me know.

By Steven Zamboni (Szamboni) on Sunday, April 04, 2021 - 10:45 pm: Edit

We could do 3D landing pads and a ramp with a 2D gunboat glued across the top in the meantime. (Random thoughts...)

By Will McCammon (Djdood) on Monday, April 05, 2021 - 12:19 pm: Edit

Too big/expensive is relative. Some folks are buying the B-10 starship mini in 1/3125-scale despite the cost, so some folks would maybe buy a G-1 gunboat in 1/285. Reading the market is a Jean and SVC role; I just put the data on the table.

By Andrew Schwenzer (Andrew_Cluetain) on Monday, April 05, 2021 - 03:32 pm: Edit

I hear you, I'd buy a Kizinti Needle at those prices. But the concern is I'd be the only one. Which would hurt ADBs bottom line. So if it happens, great but not holding my breath.

By Jack Bohn (Jackbohn) on Tuesday, April 06, 2021 - 11:26 am: Edit

The 1:258 landing legs and ramp, would they be separate pieces, or with a frame to hold them in their relative position? Even framed, it would have a smaller footprint than the whole gunboat. As a kit, all the long pieces for the frame could be printed in the same orientation to decrease the area.

Hmm... a landed Snipe would have its leg/ramps some 10 cm apart at the front and 19 cm from the rear leg, if I've done my math correctly. I'm just sayin'