Warbook Update – Fighter Operations (FO)

Star Fleet Universe Discussion Board: Federation & Empire: F&E PRODUCTS: F&E Future Products (Near Term): F&E WARBOOK: Warbook Update – Fighter Operations (FO)
  Subtopic Posts   Updated
FO - Section 100 Reports – Introduction and Table of Contents  1   06/29 08:59pm
FO – Section 300 Reports – Combat Rules  5   01/02 11:51pm
FO - Section 400 Reports – Economic Rules  12   09/18 03:44pm
FO - Section 500 Reports – Special Rules  18   09/18 06:55pm
FO - Section 600 Reports – Scenarios and Options  656   03/13 07:04pm
FO - Section 700 Reports – Orders of Battle and Annexes  17   01/12 09:54pm
Archive through September 21, 2013  25   09/21 09:32pm
Archive through September 25, 2013  25   09/25 08:09pm
Archive through January 04, 2014  25   01/05 12:00am

By Ryan Opel (Ryan) on Saturday, January 04, 2014 - 08:03 pm: Edit

You can't do a conversion during rapid combat repair. If you RCR a ship and then convert the next turn you'd pay the full conversion cost since you aren't repairing and converting.

Conversions are step 2B3. RCR is step 5-6XB

By Chuck Strong (Raider) on Saturday, January 04, 2014 - 08:51 pm: Edit

Conversion During Repair

and

Rapid Combat Repair


…two different things…

By Chuck Strong (Raider) on Saturday, January 04, 2014 - 08:59 pm: Edit

D6 to D6Y is a two point conversion (see SIT) so a SB can only do one per turn; a major conversion SB could do two max.

By Lawrence Bergen (Lar) on Saturday, January 04, 2014 - 09:21 pm: Edit

Richard means conversion during repair where 18 crip D6 are stationed deliberately across the 6 Klingon SB.

"It is possible, however unlikely, that a weakness can be found."

Viola you have spent 18 EP on converison (using 18 points of conversion capacity), 36 EPs for 72 points of repair, and spent 90 EP in the purchase of extra fightercraft and in return have 18 shiny new carriers that did not count against your limit.

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Sunday, January 05, 2014 - 12:00 am: Edit

Chuck, the literal reading of the repair rule (433.19) says to use the total cost of multiple conversions. The cost of each conversion is 1, so three crippled D6Y using CDR cost a total of 3.

I hate this btw, but when my opponent used it, I could not see anything saying he was wrong.

Now if you want to make a Q&A ruling that it IS, that would be very cool with me. Sorry for being such a pain in this, especially when I don't even like the side I'm arguing for.

By Chuck Strong (Raider) on Sunday, January 05, 2014 - 12:34 am: Edit

REB:

The effect of CDR is to reduce the COST of the conversion; the conversion itself still uses the same amount of conversion CAPACITY. That means that a standard SB can only convert one unit that uses two or three points of conversion CAPACITY per turn because standard SBs can only have three points of conversion CAPACITY.


Quote:

(425.21) EFFECT: If a ship under repair is converted to a variant at the same time, the cost of the conversion is reduced by one point (but never below a cost of 1 point) but still uses normal repair capacity.


By Chuck Strong (Raider) on Sunday, January 05, 2014 - 12:55 am: Edit

I have no issue with (440.7) as written; if the Klingon wants to waste two (or one if CDR) points to convert a D6 to D6Y plus 5 EP for the fighters to create a cruiser-based, poor excuse for an FCR with 2.5 fighters instead of building D6D/D6M/D6S/D6P then that means he has to pull other cruisers off the line to convert them to useful variants. It also means he is wasting two points per ship of valuable conversion capacity to do so. At least the D6Ys will have enough hangar space to host a decent Klingon surrender ceremony…

As to (433.19), I have no clue as to what you may be reading into it but it sure doesn't look correct...

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Sunday, January 05, 2014 - 12:57 am: Edit

Unfortunately 425.21 is unclear on this point, as it refers to normal repair capacity instead of conversion capacity.

FEDS: (425.21) was addressed and fixed in Q&A.

425.21 does not say to use 'normal' conversion capacity, though I think it should.

It says the cost is reduced, and as 433.19 says to total the costs it creates this problem that I am bringing to your attention.

By Chuck Strong (Raider) on Sunday, January 05, 2014 - 01:33 am: Edit

(433.19) FEDS Clarification: While Conversion During Repair (425.21) reduces the cost of such conversions, players must still use the un-discounted cost when calculating the use of SB conversion capacity.

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Sunday, January 05, 2014 - 01:39 am: Edit

Thank you Chuck.

By Lawrence Bergen (Lar) on Sunday, January 05, 2014 - 10:22 am: Edit

I am not sure the way it was written was wrong because it made distinction between repair and conversion costs were being discounted. I do agree that a clarification was necessary because it was not plainly stated in the writing here.

A player had to go to Planetary Ops to find clarification checking in on rule(450.53) where it states:
"Conversion during repair (425.2) uses full conversion capacity."

While we are here in PO maybe 450.51 and 450.52 should have a slight change(?) where they both refer to 'cost' as defined. (There is a difference between cost and capacity.)
Another slight change would be to Rapid Combat Repair rule (425.32) the word "capability" should be replaced with 'capacity' to remain consistent.
At least a note over in the PO area because this will get lost so that we don't forget when that rule update rolls around.

By Chuck Strong (Raider) on Sunday, January 05, 2014 - 12:30 pm: Edit

Lar:

Please post these then as formal PO line items to be addressed.

Thanks

By Lawrence Bergen (Lar) on Sunday, January 05, 2014 - 06:28 pm: Edit

Chuck: Posted, then re-posted in the right format.
Thanks Jean.

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Wednesday, January 15, 2014 - 11:18 pm: Edit

A thought about the upcoming FO update (I think there is one?).

439.16 Should be changed (ruling indicated salvage does not go to the winner of ssc).


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