AT19

The turn is over!

In Hydran space, most of the Hydrans stayed on the map in 0117 (a lot of ships) and 0215 (about 20 ships). They have two modest reserves (BT+mostly FFs) off map.

In Kzinti space, the Kzinti have a huge fleet in their capital, about 70 ships at SB 1704, a few ships at planet 1802, and two reasonable reserves (about 10 ships each) off map.

On the Fed/Klingon front, there are about 20 ships at BATS 2603, about 30 ships at BATS 2606, about 140 SEQ at planet 2708, 7 ships at SB 2901, 8 ships each at various BATS to the north of or adjacent to the Capital; and the Capital has about 130 ships, plus 4 reserves totaling about 30 ships (mostly FFs; no single reserve is particularly impressive).

On the Fed/Romulan front, there are about 45 ships at SB 3604.

In Gorn space, there are about 30 ships at SB 4206; a handful of ships at BATS 4203; about 15 ships at BATS 5004; a few ships at planet 4903; about 75 ships at the shipyard (4402) and then also 2 reserves totaling about 15 ships.

I'll post an updated map after I do production for the start of CT20.

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Sunday, October 28, 2018 - 08:18 pm: Edit

y178 SP T20

Lyran Econ:

Command Points: 2

Exploration: 190+5=195 (+8, 220 next)

Treasury: 60.7 (CT19)

On Map (56): 54 (.75)= 40.5
Off Map (24): 40 (.75)= 30
Capital (35): 35 (.75)= 26.25
Captured: 2.6 (NZ)+10=12.6(.75)=9.45
Salvage: 3.875 (AT19)

Total: 170.775

Construction T20:
-9 CC (sub DN)
-10 CV (6FFF)
-6 NCA
-8 CWS
-7 STJ
-6 CWE
-12 3DW
-7.5 3FF (off map, 0404, 0608)
-0 SAP (1PF)

Construction Total: 65.5

Conversions:
-36 BATS>SB (0617)
-6 CL>BC (0408)
-3 FF>DWE (off map)
-3 FF>DWE (0404)
-3 FF>DWE 0608)

Conversion Total: 51

Repairs:
-7.5 (5D5 1407)
-7.5 (CWE, 4DW 0404)
-1.5 (CW 0617)
-1.5 (F5W 1411)

Repair Total: 18

Pay To Supply Ships:

Total Spent: 134.5

Treasury: 36.275

FFF Left: 0

PFs: (PF1):
-2PF 1407
-2PF 0411
-1PF 0617
-1PF 0709

Salvage:

-----------------------------------------------

Klingon Econ:

Command Points: 6

Exploration: 115+10=125 (+5, 130 next)

Treasury: 106.375 (AT19)

On Map (93): 93 (.75)= 69.75
Off Map (0): 10 (.75)= 7.5
Capital (49): 49 (.75)= 36.75
Captured: 8.8 (NZ)+13+6+22=49.8 (.75)=37.35
Salvage: 18.85 (AT19)

Total: 276.575

Construction T20:
-18 C8V (12FFF)
-10 C7
-12 D6S
-6 D5W
-12 2AD5
-7 MD5
-25 5D5
-12 3F5W
-12 3F5E
-7.5 3E4 (sub F5)
-2.5 E4
-15 3E4 (overbuild)
-7 PDU (inactive)

Construction Total: 146

Conversions:
-3 (D5>D5S 1411)
-3 (D5>D5S 0617)
-4 (D5V>D5VH 2509)

Conversion Total: 10

Repairs:
-4 (D6, 2E4 1407)
-1 (E4 1009)
-2 (D6 1813)

Repair Total: 7

Adopting Lyrans: (12 Lyrans adopted CT17)

Adoption Total:

Total Spent: 163

Treasury: 113.575

FFF Left: 0

DBB:

Field Repair:

Salvage:
-----------------------------------------------
Romulan Econ:

Command Points: 2

Spare Parts: 4-1=3

Exploration: 69+15=84 (+4, 100 next)

Treasury: 98.65 (CT19)

On Map (79): 77 (.75)= 57.75
Off Map (0): 8 (.75)= 6
Capitals (34): 34 (.75)= 25.5
Captured: 7.2 (NZ)+22=29.2 (.75)=21.9
Salvage: 7 (AT19)

Total: 216.8

Construction T20:
-12 SUB (12FFF)
-10 FHF
-8 SPC
-12 2SPM
-10 2SP
-10.5 3SK
-7.5 3SEH (sub SK)
-10.5 3SEE
-10 FAL
-2.5 SN
-15 3SEH (overbuild)
-6 Convoy (4705)

Construction Total: 114

Activations:
-2 2SN

Activation Total: 2

Conversions:
-1 SEH>SEE (4015)

Conversion Total: 1

Repairs:
-1 SEH 4015

Repair Total: 1

Total Spent: 118

FFF Left: 0

Treasury: 98.8

By Jason Langdon (Jaspar) on Sunday, October 28, 2018 - 08:23 pm: Edit

Hooray for T20. When PFs and Heavy Fighters start making things INTERESTING.

And the Tholians arent too far away from their 6 turns of fun.

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Sunday, October 28, 2018 - 08:27 pm: Edit

Map at the start of CT20:

http://www.lightlink.com/pdb6/SCD2mapCT20.html

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 09:31 am: Edit

CT20

Raids happened (a couple in the edges of Gorn and Fed space to disrupt provinces; as of press time, I think Military Raids have killed, maybe, 1 small ship all game, and generally continue to just contest provinces--this being the first game I have used raids in significantly ever, it continues to seem that the existence of raids mostly just means that you double up province garrisons in groups of 2 or 3 adjacent provinces, so any single raider will end up facing off against 3 opposing ships, so trying to get them with the Raids becomes pointless; the Alliance have been aggressively raiding Coalition provinces, costing them each 2-3 EPs per turn, but other than that, the existence of Raids just seems to have the main effect of changing up how ships are deployed some).

Movement has started--the Coalition sent 150 SEQ to pin down the 150 SEQ of Hydrans in 0117. The Hydrans might react. In Kzinti space, the Lyrans opened the turn by sending 75 SEQ to the Capital. The Kzinti might react. In Fed space, the Klingons sent a force to go and attack/pin ships at BATS 2603 (possibly opening up the way for an attack on lightly defended SB 2901...). In Gorn space, the Romulans sent a rear area force to pin the Gorn fleet at SB 4206 (39 SEQ vs 37 SEQ).

Meanwhile, the Lyrans are upgrading a BATS to SB over 0617 and setting up another MB in 1216 (i.e. the edge of Hydran space).

Moves continue.

By Chuck Strong (Raider) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 03:05 pm: Edit

What's the story with all the border BTS? Most look wiped-out on both sides.

By Jason Langdon (Jaspar) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 03:40 pm: Edit

The Coalition always get to destroy everything. They have far superior numbers.

But also they cant always defend everything, so I always kill things Peter csnt fully defend.

By Chuck Strong (Raider) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 04:28 pm: Edit

Wow, I can understand the Alliance loses but that was a lot of unguarded Coalition BTSs lost...including the NR and Red Claw SBs (and even the Rom SW SB?)...

By Jason Langdon (Jaspar) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 05:20 pm: Edit

Its heaps of Coalition BATS but only the NR SB so far. Red Claw is still around.

By Chuck Strong (Raider) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 05:30 pm: Edit

Yeah, it's just strange to see all those missing bases along the Klingon northern and eastern border all but gone. That had to take some effort by the Alliance to do so.

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 05:53 pm: Edit

BATS? BATS are easy for the Alliance to kill. If they are in range of large Kzinti fleets, the Coalition can't reasonably defend them all, and if the Kzinti are remotely persistent, those border BATS are likely to die. Especially as it is T20.

The only Coalition SB that has died is the NR SB that was originally in 1509 (Red Claw SB is fine, it is just under a pile of ships in the screen shot posted above; the Romulans haven't lost any SBs and they have only lost a couple of BATS over in the furthest NE corner of Romulan space and maybe one on the Fed border); it died on T9 or T10 or so, 100% as the result of me making a clear and obvious error in counting how many ships could pin how many other ships, which resulted in the NR SB dying easily at the ends of the Kzinti, 'cause, well, I forgot to count correctly. Which happens some times.

But other than that? The Klingons and Lyrans lost a bunch of border BATS to the Kzinti, as, well, I'm hard pressed to see how that could be avoided. The Klingons lost a couple in the south to Feds early on in the fight, as the Feds were in the right place, and the Klingons couldn't defend everything.

By Jason Langdon (Jaspar) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 06:25 pm: Edit

Yeah, the Coalition have the choice of either defending a few places which will never be threatened - but risk losing less important BATS, or spreading resources across the board and risking losing the key BATS/SB.

They cant really ever keep everything safe.

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 06:39 pm: Edit

A better job can sometimes be done, though.

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 06:39 pm: Edit

CT20

This just in! Fog of war!

It turns out that a couple of Fed reserves (1st and 2nd, totaling 15 ships, most of them FFs) were actually on SB 2907 all along!

(Jason was considering putting those there to avoid me obviously killing the SB in 2901 for nothing, but then it got lost in the shuffle as he was trying to get the file done quickly; the SB will still probably die, but he'll make a mess of me now).

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 06:41 pm: Edit

Richard wrote:
>>A better job can sometimes be done, though.>>

In the game you and I were playing (DNS), as the Alliance, I killed just as many border BATS, and also Lyran SB 0608. And in that game I was losing *badly*.

The Coalition can't ever protect everything.

By Jason Langdon (Jaspar) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 06:44 pm: Edit

Stuff gonna die, yo !!

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 06:48 pm: Edit

That was my first serious game as the Coalition. Didn't know what I was doing.

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 07:17 pm: Edit

[Comment deleted in the name of good feelings!]

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 07:44 pm: Edit

I've seen games where the BATS don't die as much is all I was saying.

When I play the Coalition now, I pay a lot more attention to defense than in earlier games.

Anywho, I've been enjoying watching this game and hope y'all have fun.

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 07:49 pm: Edit

Ok, fair enough. It seems likely, though, that if the Alliance is not being completely demolished? They'll be able to kill some BATS. They'll probably be able to kill a bunch of BATS. 'Cause it isn't that hard to kill a BATS.

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 08:53 pm: Edit

The trick is to give the alliance better things to do and to better utilize excess ships when you have them.

What you do strategically affects this too.

Well placed reserves can force fewer attacks or discourage them completely. It's an art, to some extent.

By Dana Madsen (Dfm330) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 08:58 pm: Edit

Looking at the map it is as simple as the Kzinti's have their capital and 1704 so there are a lot of dead klingon border BATS within range. The Hydran's lost their capital so all the Klingon BATS on the Hydran border are fine. With two prongs of potential Kzinti advance and 20 turns it becomes practically impossible for the Klingons to defend each BATS from multiple directions. And one assumes strong reserves were needed on the Fed front.

A different game where the Kzinti's are kicked off map and I imagine the number of destroyed Klingon BATS in the area would look different. They just have more difficulty getting 7 hexes to cause mischief.

By Dana Madsen (Dfm330) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 09:07 pm: Edit

Sorry to sidetrack your game discussion Peter/Jason, maybe this is marginally on topic.

My point would be that the coalition could have well placed reserves many turns. But it only takes a couple of turns (out of the 20 they have played) where you weakened yourself dropping a Fed SB or Major and the new builds or reserves need to be placed in that sector and you lose ship parity for a turn on the Kzinti front. Next thing you know 3 BATS are dead.

Or maybe you say I could send a reserve to protect that BATS but it places them out of position for the attack I want next turn. So you let the BATS die.

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 09:33 pm: Edit

CT20

Moves continue!

In Hydran space, 150 Hydran SEQ are facing 150 Coalition SEQ in 0217; 24 Hydran SEQ are facing 24 Lyran SEQ in 0215. All these ships being pinned allowed the Coalition to move some FFs around to capture more Hydran space. There is very little left to move in Hydran space. The Hydrans have 2 unpinned reserves off map that mostly FFs.

In Kzinti space the Coalition sent 155 SEQ of ships to 1401, to pin 1401 SEQ of Kzinti. This allowed them to attack planet 1202, 1502, and recapture most of Kzinti space. There is very little left to move in Kzinti space; the Kzinti have 2 unpinned reserves that are ok, but not overwhelming.

In Gorn space, the Romulans have attacked capital hex 4403 (about 24 SEQ vs a dozen Gorns and fixed defenses over the major planet); capital hex 4503 (about 16 SEQ vs about 10 Gorns and the fixed defenses over the major planet and the 2PDU on the minor planet), and have sent 85 SEQ towards capital hex 4402. The Gorn have about 75 SEQ in 4402, not counting 20PDU fighters. The Gorn may or may not react out of the capital.

In Fed space, the Klingons pinned some ships in 2603, and then sent two dozen ships to SB 2901. There are now two dozen Klingons moving towards (and possibly over) minor planet 2705, which has 10 SEQ on it.

Moves continue.

By Jon Murdock (Xenocide) on Monday, October 29, 2018 - 10:34 pm: Edit

I have not played much but is the preservation of BATS really important? I mean save them if you can but unless they are critical to your supply line they just seem to be of nominal value.