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Compilation of names in fiction  36   08/31 05:57pm
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By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Wednesday, January 11, 2023 - 07:06 pm: Edit

For background purposes the d20 and gurps books are the same.

By Mike Erickson (Mike_Erickson) on Wednesday, January 11, 2023 - 09:54 pm: Edit

One other issue I've read about is the question of if WOTC actually "owned" whatever IP it purported to license, and if such material was actually "ownable" and thus licensable.

Given the big dollars on the table from multiple parties, I imagine that some top flight IP law firms will be engaged and the process will grind itself out. Who knows how it will all end up? Cases can often hinge on some non-obvious legal detail that the public knows nothing about.

--Mike

By Eric Silverman (Ericsilverman) on Thursday, January 12, 2023 - 07:00 am: Edit

Whatever happens with the proposed OGL 1.1 itself, the leaked document has already had dramatic consequences. Major 3rd-party publishers like Kobold Press have already announced plans to initiate their own OGL-alike system, others have announced plans to reformulate their existing products to purge all OGL material, etc. Regardless of the actual outcome, the relationship between D&D and its third party publishers has been severely damaged.

Speaking for myself, I'm concerned about the fates of the Old School Renaissance (OSR) systems that I play which are based on older editions of D&D, which are dependent on the OGL for their existence. These games have revitalised the old-school style of dungeoneering for a modern era, and a vibrant community has sprung up around them.

If anyone else here is a fan of OSR/NSR games, I strongly recommend that you download and archive any such products from DTRPG immediately, and order any hard copies you want straight away too. Already some prominent systems have been removed from sale (such as Whitehack).

By Mike West (Mjwest) on Thursday, January 12, 2023 - 08:43 am: Edit

Yeah, OSR is gonna get crushed.

However, anyone that is able to differentiate fairly easily will just be fine. They will be changed, but they will be fine. The main OSR I use, Basic Fantasy RPG (BFRPG) is already excising the SRD and will likely be fine. Others? Depends on how important it was for them to be as close as possible to that which they were cloning. For example, if you want a copy of OSRIC or For Glory & Gold, I'd strongly suggest downloading them now.

But, yes, it is likely a good idea to make sure you order anything you like that uses the OGL as soon as possible, or you might not get the chance later.

By Mike Erickson (Mike_Erickson) on Thursday, January 12, 2023 - 01:10 pm: Edit

It is a good point that what might happen is this matter may lead to the creation and use of "free as in freedom" core RPG materials that anyone can use to base an RPG on. It might mirror the free software movement in that way. So we move away from endlessly "owning" and reinventing what amount to RPG basics, and move to differentiation and innovation based upon the higher level content.

Although based upon what I have read I do believe there may be is a thread of belief within WOTC that they "own" D&D and therefore "own" all RPGs everywhere.

--Mike

By Eric Silverman (Ericsilverman) on Thursday, January 12, 2023 - 03:49 pm: Edit

Quote:

Yeah, OSR is gonna get crushed.



Over the medium- to long-term, I doubt that. But in the short term, a lot of creators will be panicking, and confusion and chaos will go on for some time.

The Electronic Frontier Foundation has put up an informative post about the OGL, which points out that the original OGL is actually more restrictive than simply following proper fair use and copyright law. If WOTC revokes 1.0a, then creators could well decide to ignore WOTC's approval entirely and keep doing what they've been doing. So long as they followed fair use and copyright, which is more permissive than the OGL, a mass movement in that direction would be extremely difficult for WOTC to stop. The OGL mainly served as a guarantee that WOTC wouldn't sue creators like TSR did; third parties could already use DnD mechanics without the OGL.

As the days go by and legal advice accumulates, we're seeing OSR creators getting more bullish about their prospects; Goodman Games (Dungeon Crawl Classics), for example, said earlier today that nothing of consequence will change for any of their lines. The creator of Dark Dungeons has pointed out that when Paizo makes a new OGL for Pathfinder stuff, it'd be easy to shift OSR over to that instead:

Quote:

Speaking personally, I could probably take Dark Dungeons, yeet the OGL and put whatever the new Paizo license will be. Because almost all the things in Dark Dungeons that were taken from D&D via the OGL - class names, levels, saving throws, specific spell and monster names - can be taken from Pathfinder using their license instead. It wouldn't take a lot of work, and I think most of the OSR crowd could do the same.



Having said that, I stand by the advice to download/purchase things now, because this is a huge mess and will take time to shake out, and nobody wants to be stuck without their games during that time. But I think there's reason to be confident that once the dust settles, the OSR and DnD derivatives in general will continue.

By Mike West (Mjwest) on Thursday, January 12, 2023 - 04:33 pm: Edit

You are correct: I was too flippant. OSR will get crushed *for now*. Over time, people will adapt and likely get stronger. They will just have to have a looser link to DnD over time and, to be honest, will likely be better for it.

It will be interesting to see how Paizo eventually responds. Their 2e was intentionally designed to move past needing the OGL and simply use it to keep things simpler for themselves and everyone else. It should be pretty easy for them to move to a new license and, as you say, once they do that it could potentially give others a chance to use theirs. But, even then, after being burned so badly by WOTC, a lot will refuse to even do that and will each do their own thing so they aren't reliant on any other company to perpetually play fair.

By Eric Silverman (Ericsilverman) on Friday, January 13, 2023 - 05:52 am: Edit

Quote:

It will be interesting to see how Paizo eventually responds.



Well, Paizo's site has been down since the announcement of the ORC licence yesterday, which I take as a strong sign of community interest!

I think Paizo's made very good choices with ORC, by entrusting a specialist law firm with the development and stewardship of the licence, getting a bunch of other major RPG publishers on board, and the long-term plan to give an open-source foundation ownership of the licence. These moves ensure that even if Paizo went evil, the licence stays. The ORC licence will be perpetual *and* irrevocable, and not owned by anyone making money on RPGs, avoiding the debacle the OGL has become.

WOTC, meanwhile, still has yet to say anything. This could well be the second time a poor licensing decision has handed a huge win to Paizo -- first 4th Edition and the GSL, and now this.

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