| By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Sunday, July 17, 2022 - 10:03 am: Edit |
Answering a question posted in another topic regarding the Siren shown in the preview of Deck Three in CL-47:
The siren was dropped, turned into the Primary Sensor dish. Yes, the idea was that it was unique to the POL, with background stating it adapted the larger antennae from a comms-relay station. I had four smaller dishes (two forward / two aft) for sub-space radio. SVC said that no other ship had such antennae, so I changed them all.
I also had four flat-panel Targeting Sensors, again two for and two aft. I kept the forward ones and renamed them as Scanners. That gave me two rooms forward and four after to re-purpose. Four of these became Maneuvering Thrusters, and two of the aft were connected to the HVAC system,
And then there was the PALS (Phased Array Lateral Sensors) system, a set of flat-panel sensors in a row along either side lower forward deck (Deck Six), that looked really cool but once again got nixed after a SVC review. I simply put the label for Secondary Sensors in their place. Those were on Decks Three & Four, and I filled that space with more AIR tanks.
Garth L. Getgen
| By Joseph Jackson (Bonneville) on Sunday, July 17, 2022 - 12:16 pm: Edit |
You have more talent in you little finger than I have in my whole body. Thanks for all the great info!
| By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Saturday, September 10, 2022 - 08:04 pm: Edit |
Here's an idea I had a while back, before the advent of Shapeways, to print my own "3d" models.
Print this image out making sure to keep the proportions intact, cut along the outside lines (don't cut the tabs off!!), carefully fold along the edge lines, tape or glue the tabs. Ta-Da! There you go, a Poor Man's 3d mini.
Here's a colorized version as it would come out of the factory, waiting for the name, registry, and pennant to be painted on.
Garth L. Getgen
| By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Saturday, September 10, 2022 - 09:45 pm: Edit |
Nice!
And its big enough to put a stick of gum inside! 
| By Joseph Jackson (Bonneville) on Sunday, September 11, 2022 - 12:49 pm: Edit |
You've got more talent in your little finger than I have in my whole body.
"Here's a colorized version. . ."
You had me at: "Print this image out."
| By Mike Erickson (Mike_Erickson) on Sunday, September 11, 2022 - 01:10 pm: Edit |
I think these papers minis would make great Christmas cards. Print them on the somewhat thicker cardstock of the card itself. Consider "standard" ship pictures, or Christmas themed ones with mistletoe or whatever. Open card, read greeting, cut out ship, fold into a box and hang on tree.
--Mike
| By Jeff Wile (Jswile) on Sunday, September 11, 2022 - 03:04 pm: Edit |
Just might replace minatures!
| By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Sunday, September 11, 2022 - 06:29 pm: Edit |
Mike, that would be up to SVC / ADB. And you'd have to sweat-talk the Shapeways designers into making the six-image displays.
But funny ... as I said, this idea actually predated Shapeways. When ADB released the coloring books, I emailed SVC with the previous version of the posted image. I also had the Romulan Snipe / Snipe-B done, and was working on the Free Trader. SVC liked the idea and asked how fast could I pump out more ships starting with the Fed CA and FFG. Too long, I'm afraid. Before I made any headway on them, Shapeways happened, so this whole idea got shelved.
So, again, if you want it, you'll need to talk to SVC, not me. And if it does happen, I will not be the one to create the six-image sets for each ship. The artists who made the Shapeways 3d models should, in theory, be able to create the images. I would hope that they set them to a common scale (doesn't have to be 3125).
Jeff, I doubt that cardboard printouts will ever replace metal/plastic minis. But cardboard box ships would work nicely for Ken Burnside's 3d space combat game.
Joseph, thanks, but I'm sure you can do things that would run circles around me if I tried.
Garth L. Getgen
| By Kosta Michalopoulos (Kosmic) on Sunday, September 11, 2022 - 07:27 pm: Edit |
I can see the potential for a product like Steve Jackson Games' old "Cardboard Heroes." It would meet the demand for 3D ships without the cost (in money and time) of minis. Perhaps it could be done as a PDF that allows the buyer to print, cut and paste the ships.
| By Dal Downing (Rambler) on Saturday, September 17, 2022 - 10:09 pm: Edit |
You know a couple of these offered with First Mission, Module W and of quick start Klingon Armada or ACTASF would be really cool.
| By Jeff Guthridge (Jeff_Guthridge) on Saturday, September 17, 2022 - 10:27 pm: Edit |
You could simplify the design to have only one printed facet and then folding wings that could be tucked into an extruded base (think original BattleTech and your close). Would end up being less paper per piece too.
| By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Sunday, September 18, 2022 - 09:11 am: Edit |
I don't think that would work well, Jeff. I had to Google them to see what you meant; the Battletech paper-counters (and SJG Cardboard Heroes) show the front-&- back of mechs / people. I don't see how that can work with a starship whose main view is the top. If they only had one facet printed, how is that any different from the one-inch megehex counters already available???
What am I missing???
By the way, I did notice (not that ANYONE else would ever notice) that I missed coloring in one item: the belly 360 Phaser on the front view peeks out from behind the deflector dish and should have been filled with red.
On the side / bottom views, that Phaser should have been moved back to just ahead (give or take) of the Warp nacelle cap. As shown, it's under the Cargo bay. I'll have to fix that "someday".
I did make the box it sits on taller (ditto the Ph-3s on the top) and changed the deflector from a 7.5-meter circle to a 7.5x6.0-meter oval to allow it to peek out the front. Before I did that, the ship would have had to lift the nose by 2 degrees for it to fire straight forward. I thought that was "close enough", but I have been informed that all 360 Phasers MUST be visible on all front/back/side views. Minor detail, but it's fixed now. Same with being able to see the top Ph-3s on the aft view (but those are colored in).
Garth L. Getgen
| By Jeff Guthridge (Jeff_Guthridge) on Sunday, September 18, 2022 - 11:10 am: Edit |
Garth, short of modeling an example from the art you already used as and example, let me try to explain.
The one printed facet would be the top facet of your design. Larger than the mega hex counters, scaled congruent to the miniature set they are stand ins for.
The cardstock piece would be narrow, only as wide as the printed facet. However it would be long with two fold creases on top and two more on bottom of the printed portion. The inside crease is a obtuse 180 degree fold, and the outside crease need only be an acute 90 degree fold.
Fold both inside folds to put the ‘wings’ under the printed side, then fold both outer folds the other way to meet in the middle where you tuck the two tabs together into an extruded plastic clip with a flat bottom, similar to the ones BattleTech used. If you image folding a strip of paper into a “T” shape so that the center of the strip faces upwards, your in the ballpark, the base of the “T” being what you tuck into the plastic piece which holds the ends together.
This makes for a cardboard miniature analog, possibly printable at home. While allowing for more than one or two minis per page printed. Also, this should not be difficult to setup for a die process either as the cards will be aligned so that the fold creasing is uniform as well as lengths and widths.
The length between the folds (top & bottom) is dependent on the length of the printed portion of the card, while the length of the top and bottom outside the first and last fold is dependent on how much elevation above the map is desired.
If that doesn’t help you visualize I’ll see if I can’t illustrate something to further help.
| By Dal Downing (Rambler) on Sunday, September 18, 2022 - 11:13 am: Edit |
I am with Garth here. A Battletech Standee is missing the mark.
Just wish full thinking who remembers those wooden dinosaur bone model kits. That would be cool.
| By Jeff Guthridge (Jeff_Guthridge) on Sunday, September 18, 2022 - 11:14 am: Edit |
As for why it would be better than the Megahex counters? Well, aside from elevating the ‘ship’ off the map surface and or putting it on a base that allows for hexless play, there may not be one other than the potential (provided the rights can be worked out) for printing them from home.
It is a simplification of the paper-cube design, requires less user construction precision and would be hardy-enough for the purpose.
It was proposed mostly as an exercise in simplifying the design to put more than one or two ships per page to be printed.
| By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Tuesday, September 20, 2022 - 12:22 pm: Edit |
My Windows-7 computer is not cooperating with me. It boots up in safe mode, but that doesn't allow me to use the virtual printer to export to PDF & TIFF. This afternoon, I'm going to try to fire up my old Windows-XP computer and try to install the PDF-print program. If that works, I'll be able to post the few ships I have in paper "3d" box. I do want to see how many I can get on one sheet at 1/3125 scale.
Garth L. Getgen
| By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Sunday, September 25, 2022 - 09:11 pm: Edit |
Well, the good news is my XP computer still fires up. First time it's been on in ten years. Bad news is I cannot install the virtual PDF printer, so I can't use it to export images to PDF or TIFF. This also tells me that if I set up on a VM on my Win-10 box, I need Win-7 not XP for the VM.
Garth L. Getgen
| By Jeff Guthridge (Jeff_Guthridge) on Wednesday, September 28, 2022 - 01:05 pm: Edit |
Garth: I have a rude prototype built. Granted its very rough, (and I had to order the bases because, of course when I need something the blessed thing is buried in who knows what tote in the storage unit).
Two images linked (apologies to the mods if this isn't okay) below.
Top down look, simple paper mini.
Dissembled view showing fold pattern.
I'll leave these images in my Google Drive for a while yet, but they may disappear anytime after the end of 2022.
| By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Wednesday, September 28, 2022 - 02:25 pm: Edit |
Jeff, okay, now I see what you meant. Personally, I'm not sure how many players would use something like that. Then again, not sure if players would want my box design, either.
For the prototype, you could have used binder clips for the base.
Garth L. Getgen
| By Jeff Guthridge (Jeff_Guthridge) on Wednesday, September 28, 2022 - 06:02 pm: Edit |
There’s a D’oh! Moment….. yeah, a cheap $3.99 Walmart container of binder clips better than the $9.99 online order….
You could use that double fold technique I used and put art on the front and back flap, box it around, and then add wings for the sides……
Apologies, I’m chasing my tail at this point.
| By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Monday, October 10, 2022 - 05:45 pm: Edit |
Jeff, You said you worried about the amount of paper these "print-&-fold" ship would use. Well, I just tried something and was able to get six ships plus some fighters, drones, and a shuttle, all at 1cm=31.25m scale on a single sheet of letter-size paper, with room left over. Granted, these are small ships, but I think you could fit at least three, probably four or five, heavy cruisers on one page. Admittedly, these are kind small and hard to color by hand with pencils.
Garth L. Getgen
| By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Wednesday, June 21, 2023 - 06:34 pm: Edit |
No significant updates to report. I've been lazy and haven't tried to figure out how to get a Win-7 VM set up yet. I do have a Win-XP VM running, so the other night I tested my program on that. I can't print-to-PDF / print-to-TIFF in this VM, but I was able to do a screen-grab of a minor edit I made to the brig (old on left / new on right). I figured that forcing the prisoners to sleep with their head next to the "head" might be considered cruel and unusual punishment, so I flipped the beds end-to-end.
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Garth L. Getgen
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