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Gary. By the last "they", he means the natives. The Feds fighting directly with the Klingons doesn't accomplish anything, especially not friendship with the natives (better the devil I know than the devil I don't); having the natives kick out the Klingons would.

By Richard Wells (Rwwells) on Saturday, December 10, 2005 - 10:15 pm: Edit

But without Fed support (or at least the promise of Fed support), the natives will know that the Klingons will can return and eliminate the resistance movement. Difficult to get support for a short lived pointless uprising when the Klingons have gotten a sizable following already.

At best, the natives will be facing a civil war. At worst, the Klingons very messily put down opposition. This will most likely prove unsatisfying to the PCs.

By Andy Palmer (Andypalmer) on Saturday, December 10, 2005 - 11:20 pm: Edit

Richard. I can see that somewhat. However, my interpretation of the Prime Directive would be "you kick them out and we'll keep them out." So yes, there would be the Fed commitment, but it would be dependent upon native commitment and action to kick them out in the first place.

By Gary Plana (Garyplana) on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 12:41 am: Edit

What I was trying to get across was that there are other things you can tell the native government that are more useful and/or appropiate. For example:

"The Klingons are our enemies, and we came here to try to figure out the best way to keep them from conquering you. Would you like me to tell you what we've learned?"

You get the idea?

By Andy Palmer (Andypalmer) on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 08:54 am: Edit

Gary. I would disagree. In this case, you have given the natives no reason to trust you more than the Klingons - you would come across as jealouse enemies of the Klingons, fearful of them adding the natives to their side. It also crosses the line a bit more because you are giving direct aid to the natives (in the form of information).

I think "We would like to someday, welcome you as equals in the galactic community. We prefer to wait to let cultures develop on their own and welcome them once they advance to the point of developing space travel themselves. The Klingons, on the other hand, prefer to interact with people with lower technology levels so that they can marvel them with their wonders while robbing them of valuable resources. The technology that both we and the Klingons have can be very devasting - we would not want to put your people at risk by fighting on or near your world. What we will commit to do is to keep the Klingons, and ourselves, away until you are ready to meet with us as equals. All that you need to do is to kick those Klingons already here off your planet."

By F. Douglas Wall (Knarf) on Sunday, January 01, 2006 - 11:04 pm: Edit

That's very much what I was thinking, Andy. Of course, it's a last resort, since it does stretch the Prime Directive.

The preferred tactics are to a) sabotage the Klingon's dilithium mining operation on the planet or b) Have the Klingons fall out of favor in the King's court. Although this planet is nowhere near a planetary government, it does have cultural leader nations, such as the modern USA and Rennaissance France and Italy. If the Klingons fall out of fashion there, the rest of the world will likely follow suit.

My ideas for the culture of the planet are very close to Rennaissance France. (Thank you GURPS Swashbucklers)

By F. Douglas Wall (Knarf) on Friday, January 13, 2006 - 06:04 pm: Edit

Question: What kind of security would a Klingon mining operation have? Especially with a fairly recently contacted primitive culture that they are allowing to work it.

By Andy Palmer (Andypalmer) on Friday, January 13, 2006 - 11:21 pm: Edit

FDW. That would depend upon who owned the mine, how profitable it was, what the threats to the mine were, etc. i.e., the GM can use deux ex machina to create security equal to the PC challenge he desires.

By Gary Plana (Garyplana) on Friday, January 13, 2006 - 11:21 pm: Edit

I would expect a "fairly recently contacted primitive culture" to be at least one notch lower on the totem pole than any of the top-tier subject races like the Dunkars or Slirdarians. Maybe two notches, as they are primitive, which I assume means low TL.

Maybe one or two Klingons on the whole planet -- a Governor and an ESS guy to keep everyone in line. The rest of the staff and bosses would probably be Dunkars and Slirdarians and so forth. Techicians to keep the mines running would all be subject races with MAYBE a Klingon geologist, depending if they needed one.

Guard troops would be plentiful and either Slidarians or Hilidarians, depending on the climate. How many depends on how big the mine is, and how many mines there are. Assuming that the planet is otherwise worthless to the Empire, they probably wouldn't bother policing the rest of the planet, except an occasional raid for more slaves.

Keep in mind that be TL11, most mining is done in asteroid belts, so whatever is being mined on the planet would have to be very rare in order to be worth the trouble, even when using slave labor.

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Saturday, January 14, 2006 - 12:53 am: Edit

I did some studies recently and found that while asteroids on an individual basis can be rich in useful material the total material in an asteroid belt (our main belt as an example) is 1/1000th the mass of a class M planet (IIRC).

Mining on planets is certainly worth the effort since the material can be REFINED easilly on the surface. But with asteroid mining the material must be refined in space. The one thing going for it is the original material can be quite pure.

Still, it isn't that hard to tractor a cargo pod up from the planet surface and a cargo pod hold a heck of a lot of raw material. But even better the mine's product is sent to refining and manufacturing facilities a few miles away and the cargo pod goes up full of parts and finished products.

Some materials would be mined and sent out raw such as dilithium. To take refined dilitium from a backwater planet would be to invite trouble. Movign it raw and in a less valuable state draws less chance of difficulties showing up. You then refine it where security is already tight.

Besides that I agree with Gary's assesment and would add the majority of mine workers would be natives. I expect that in time a great deal of security would also be recruited from the native population. They would be armed enough to handle security but not enough to over throw the Klingon security forces.

It is not good for moral of the people to have aliens repressing the people (which is how it would be percieved in time). It is better to move to a firmly guided native security force which is less expensive and frees up valuable and expensively trained marine/army forces for other duties.

By Richard Wells (Rwwells) on Saturday, January 14, 2006 - 02:19 am: Edit

I have doubts about the wisdom of the Klingons using the more visually distinct races as guards. A medieval equivalent planet is more likely to be riled up at the prospect of the king working with those that consort with "demons". Becomes easier if the mine is far from any major habitation and uses prison labor, but then the need for a hefty security detail is reduced.

The mine itself might be minimally guarded by troops from the planetary regional government with perhaps a sprinkling of Klingons or others that can pass as not too oddball. The Klingons are trying to be respectful of the planet's population which limits how forceful they can be. If the Klingon forces protecting the mine are too heavy, the Klingons can deal with any political problems in very direct ways. Convincing the disaffected lords to support the Federation will have little benefit if the Klingons destroy all the castles and households.

If the Klingons have any support ship or base, that might have more typical Slidarian/Hilidarian forces who could interfere thanks to delayed transport. (Hiding a ground base in a desert has certain virtues. Close enough to be a bolt hole for the Klingon embassy staff but sufficiently distant not to attract notice. Extra "moons" could be problematic.)

By Gary Plana (Garyplana) on Saturday, January 14, 2006 - 11:46 am: Edit

Loren, who said you can't do refining in space?

Tow your 20Kton chunk of ore conveniently near the sun, use several square miles of mirrors to focus the sun's rays on the asteroid, and when it melts use tractor beams to remove slag and clinkers.

I mean, you don't have to do refining in a crucible in Pittsburg ... if you've got the TL to do it in space.

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Saturday, January 14, 2006 - 12:58 pm: Edit

Gary, I've got a full answer for you but I'm off to see Kong with my son. I'll get back to this tonight (I've got quite a bit to say).

But for this moment I'll point out that I didn't say you can't do your refining in space.

By F. Douglas Wall (Knarf) on Thursday, January 19, 2006 - 04:41 pm: Edit

The planet I'm thinking of will be GURPS TL4-5. Natives are employed to be miners. Whether or not the ore is refined there is pretty much based on availability of equipment. If it's fairly simple to refine the stuff with native technology or more advanced stuff that's easy to install and use, it will likely be done on planet. I'm not sure yet.

I'm thinking the Klingons would be helping to advance the local technology, potentially creating a sort of "steampunk" technology just starting up. It might be possible for PCs to muck up the works by using a phaser on stun to overheat the boiler on some steam contraption.

By Gary Plana (Garyplana) on Thursday, January 19, 2006 - 05:27 pm: Edit

While it might not be possible to totally refine the ore at TL5, it could at least be pre-processed to some extent.

For example, gold ore is typically 99% worthless rock and less than 1% gold (remainder silver and other noble metals). Pre-processing could bring the gold up to maybe 2-3%, other noble metals 8-10%, and that would be doable at high TL5 or low TL6.

Just a thought.

By F. Douglas Wall (Knarf) on Thursday, January 26, 2006 - 05:22 pm: Edit

Also, it's likely that they will be mining for advanced materials (you know, all the fun stuff that you guys make up named for). How stable is any of that in it's raw form? What are the radiaton hazards? Perhaps that could be a story point, with Klingons hiring the local miners so that they don't have to shield more valuable personnel. Now the locals are all getting a slow form of radiation poisoning. That could be one more reason for the nobility to kick the Klingons off the planet.

By F. Douglas Wall (Knarf) on Friday, February 03, 2006 - 06:18 pm: Edit

My basic plan so far is thus:

Once the PCs beam down, they quickly wind up interfering in a duel. Since the culture is very much based on the integrity of the duel, the PCs must fight. This is a fight of honor, not to the death. Since the duel involves one or more of a local duke's men, the duke has a chance to assess their skills. Finding such skilled agents of value (especially since they have no known connection to him), he asks for their help in infiltrating the Klingon mine, since he has never before been able to get anything out of it. That's the way the mine operates. Lots goes in (workers, supplies, etc) but only ore comes out.

Getting a job is easy enough (The Klingons are always hiring). Security is fairly lax (They're not looking for technology, just making sure noone gets out). Once inside, they find that the radiation from the ore is interacting with the regenerative abilities of the natives (These are people who fight duels all the time, right?) causing them to grow extra bits, as well as all the regular ills of radiation sickness.

The PCs mount a daring escape, bringing at least one of the afflicted miners with them.

Once they return, the duke presents them and their evidence to the king. The king is offended that the Klingons could do something like this to his people. The king calls out the Klingon governor for a duel, selecting the PCs as proxies. Since the traditional duel is an honor battle, the king is further offended when the Klingon party doesn't play by any of their rules.

Thus the Klingons are kicked off the planet (The Federation can enforce that from space as needed).

By Gary Plana (Garyplana) on Saturday, February 04, 2006 - 12:04 am: Edit

You cannot asssume that the players are going to do the things you need to have happen in order to advance the adventure. This is one problem that always happens in strictly linear adventures -- I know because I've done it enough myself.

What if the PCs do not interfere in the duel? You need a backup plan for getting the PCs involved.

Once they get challenged, what if the PCs refuse to fight?

What if there are no Marines in the party, all the PCs are useless at swordplay, and get beaten in a most embarrassing fashion? (This one I can answer, see the movie WHO SHOT LIBERTY VALANCE ... you might even make this a permanant part of the script, just to annoy the players. )

Why would the Duke trust these people he's never met before? They ARE complete unknowns. The party is going to have to convince him they are enemies of the Klingons, somehow.

And what if the Klingon governor (ambassador?) happens to be a Bat'leth Master, or has one on his staff (which is likely), and appoints HIM as HIS proxy? Oh, wait ... you control that ... well, add that item to the scenario, too. (insert Very Evil Grin)

By F. Douglas Wall (Knarf) on Thursday, February 23, 2006 - 06:40 pm: Edit

Just got back from the convention where I was playtesting the adventure. The biggest hole I found was that I need more detail on the mine. Just pulling details out of the air, the players managed to drop an overloaded phaser-1 into some of the mining machinery and caused the whole place to cave in (massive damage + highly energetic ores = KA-BOOOOM!!!!). Thankfully, the native miners panicked and there was a massive charge out of the mine, so that the majority survived the incident. (I probably should have let them die, just to give the party a bad mission review, but one of my failings is that I'm too nice of a GM.)

By Gary Plana (Garyplana) on Thursday, February 23, 2006 - 08:49 pm: Edit

I would have told the party that the miners were trapped, dying, and asked what they were going to do about it. But then I'm an evil SOB of a GM ...

Glad it went well, though.

By michael john campbell (Michaelcampbell) on Friday, February 24, 2006 - 01:24 am: Edit

Sorry guys.

Miners are blown out of the mouth of the mine; Wylie Cyote Style.

By F. Douglas Wall (Knarf) on Friday, February 24, 2006 - 05:16 am: Edit

As I said, I'm a very nice GM. I've actually never lost a character through hit poiont attrition. I've come close only once or twice out of 4 years of GMing.

I was disappointed that the players didn't make it to the showdown with the Klingon governor and his two handed sword.

When I get this together for publication, I'm going to need more details on the mine, either opening it up or tightening it down story-wise.

By Ken Humpherys (Pmthecat) on Friday, February 24, 2006 - 04:23 pm: Edit

[deleted by author]

By George M. Ebersole (George) on Thursday, February 07, 2008 - 06:39 pm: Edit

SVC; do you have a preferred adventure format you'd like to use for GURPS?

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Friday, February 08, 2008 - 12:11 am: Edit

I don't grasp the question, but I don't think there is any specific format.

By George M. Ebersole (George) on Friday, February 08, 2008 - 12:53 am: Edit

I guess I'm wondering if there's a graphical template to follow that you've used in the past for Prime Directive, or if SJ Games uses a speciic layout that you prefer; i.e. a bit of fiction followed by an equipment list, setting, or event listing. Something like that.

By Liam Reid (Blackclaw) on Monday, June 09, 2008 - 06:29 pm: Edit

I don't have PD, but I had a great idea for a scenario. It would take place on a Kzinti ship at the start of the WYN War of Return. The players would be the ship's officers, and one person (player or GM) would be a WYN spy/saboteur trying to disable/capture the ship to use in the upcoming assault. Email me if you're interested in getting more information on this.

By Jean Sexton (Jsexton) on Wednesday, March 23, 2011 - 03:31 pm: Edit

Even as we work on the next item for Free RPG day, "Dread Pirate Aldo" has surfaced on e23. Check it out!
http://e23.sjgames.com/item.html?id=ADB8996

This sixteen-page adventure (including both GURPS and PD20M stats) includes a complete fiction story about a team of Federation planetary surveyors who are checking out a new planet for colonization. They are, instead, kidnapped by Dread Pirate Aldo, who forces them to work for him, creating new weapons.

By Xander Fulton (Dderidex) on Tuesday, November 20, 2012 - 07:21 pm: Edit

Soooo...this thread started with a discussion of the PD1 'adventure modules' being updated for GPD...

Since the PD1 'adventure modules' look like they are making their way to e23 ('Uprising' already available), I assume that means that whatever manhandling was needed to get them into a digital format usable by ADB's current computers has occurred. How much more would be needed for the necessary conversions from PD1 tech/rules/character stats to GPD tech/rules/character stats to make these into a series of GPD modules?

(FWIW, I've only really played with groups doing 'adventure models' as opposed to 'worldbooks' - the latter are just too...meh. So this idea is of PARTICULAR interest to me. Of course, my group also hates 'BPV pickup games' in SFB, too, and prefers to play only published scenarios, so...I guess we just like experiencing a story told by someone in 'historical context'... )