Loren: interesting. Not sure SJhisownself would go for it, but it's possible.

By Steven E. Ehrbar (See) on Wednesday, November 24, 2004 - 02:15 pm: Edit

I'd suggest a title low on the "Prime" and high on the "Star Fleet Universe". So GURPS players who haven't picked up GPD see it and go, "Oooh, Star Trek stuff for GURPS" instead of "Prime what?" "Prime" is an SFB-persepctive name, not a GURPS-perspective name.

Obviously, give it a GURPS 4th Edition header. But then under that, something that screams SFU and periodical. Say, "Star Fleet Reporter #x", "Klingon Imperial News and Galactic Report #x", "Vulcan Science Journal #x", "Romulan Intelligence Dispatch #x", "Federation Chronicle #x", or the like.

GPD players will recognize this as stuff for them. Non-GPD GURPS players who have SF campaigns or are interested in Trek will recognize it as stuff they might be interested in.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Wednesday, November 24, 2004 - 03:02 pm: Edit

SEE has a point. Vulcan Chronicles has a ring to it.

I mentioned it to Leanna at lunch and she just about exploded. She really hated GMPA and GMPB because of their lousy sales and fears that the magazine does the one REALLY BAD thing that a module does not do, that being imply that it's going to have something approaching a regular schedule. Even a quarterly magazine would be far too much workload.

She did see a point in having a "general gurps" magazine that GPD was just a part of and thinks it would be really really good if somebody other than ADB published it.

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Wednesday, November 24, 2004 - 03:44 pm: Edit

I like SEE's ideas as well.

What about a SFU Profile series. Not a race book but would be full of stuff about the SFU in general. Don't try to sell it as a magazine at all.

OH dang. I know...And Expansion series to the GPD core rules. No scedule, no specific lay out needed. Perfect bound Cap Log size.

GPD Core Rules Supplement A (B,C,D etc.)

GURPS sort of works like this already. Each Supplement can be adding to the SF Universe like Ulrta Tech does or GV. Those build on the core rules.

By Mark Faust (Mark_Faust) on Wednesday, November 24, 2004 - 06:07 pm: Edit

SVC: Have you given any thought to something like SJ Games online Journal of the Traveller's Aid Society? People pay $20 for 2 years worth of access to the current issues (usually 4 or so small articles) and the archives. There's also a printed "Best of the JTAS" with articles from the year 2000 to reach people offline. I assume that publishing electronically would be cheaper than printing a book, and you could occasionally cherry pick the best stuff for a regular book. On the downside, I have no idea if SJ Games makes any money on it, and the smaller PD audience probably wouldn't generate as much material as the Traveller fans do, so you might not be able to charge as much. My apologies if I missed a similar comment somewhere else in this thread.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Wednesday, November 24, 2004 - 06:57 pm: Edit

I haven't really thought about it because I just don't care for electronic subscription publishing.

Beyond that, the point of doing is two fold, one to promote and support the game and the other to make money, and we'd actually make money on a printed book but I'm doubtful that we will on an email subscription.

But beyond that....

1. I'm really busy finishing a book right now and don't have time to think about it.

2. We don't HAVE to decide anything soon. Might be nice to mention it in one of the January products but even that gives us six weeks to decide on something, and if we don't, we could do it in August. Can't really commit to publishing an issue before September anyway. Too many things on the schedule.

By Jeff Johnson (Jeffro) on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 02:00 pm: Edit

I suggest

1) Going with a print magazine.

2) Require all RPG articles to work with GURPS Space, too, instead of just GPD. GPD is your first priority, but expand the material to be useable with other GURPS games. (Uplift, Space, Traveller, etc.) Occasionally include notes on using stuff in a fantasy campaign or something outlandish just for the fun of it. Conversely, include articles that draw in the outlandish concepts back into the Trek universe. (TOS had some really weird stuff in it after all.)

3) Also have reviews of other space products-- things like Ken Burnside's 3D game.

4) A complete sci-fi game in every issue emphasizing speed of play, accessibility, and playability. We need something that can be used to introduce new players to the game(s) and also we need something that helps us to compete with with the clicky base genre. Counters and maps can be on the back cover or on inserts. A Ranger should be able to walk into the store with no game materials, buy the latest issue, and start demoing! Many of these games could be demo versions of your other products-- simplified "jump start" versions of Federation Commander and so forth with hooks into the RPG materials. (The jump start games mean the new players won't have to see the size of your rule books too early...! And when they buy the real games, they'll have some extra nice counters and game aids to go with them already.)

By F. Douglas Wall (Knarf) on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 - 03:26 am: Edit

Jeff:

Some very good ideas, but I'm not sure about how practical some of it is.

Ideally, GPD is compatible with all GURPS elements, Space included. The only changes that have been made were the ones that were required to keep it SFU.

One of the features included in MPA was an article on GURPS Traveller and making that material useful in a GPD campaign. If the concept continues, we'll see other GURPS books given the same treatment, possibly even the more incongruous ones like Fantasy.

I don't know if anyone would be interested in promoting non-GURPS or non-SFU material in this publication. Everyone involved in this has interests in promoting those two elements over any other, and I don't think they're accepting advertising.

While the "minigames" are a neat idea, they'd be the trickiest to pull off. Most of the people picking this up would be getting it to support their GPD game, so they are probably primarily interested in RP material, not some neat little board game or what have you. Plus, one page of cardboard counters and whatnot takes away a good bit more than that in normal pages full of cool RP info.

Keeping SFB competitive with clickies and such is a topic for another forum.

By Gary Plana (Garyplana) on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 - 01:29 pm: Edit

Considering the hoops that have to be jumped through to get counters printed for SFB -- which includes planning a year in advance -- I really Really REALLY doubt that you will ever see counters in the eventual GPD magazine.

Something printed on the heavy stock similar to what SJ Games uses for Cardboard Heroes, maybe.

Counters would be a neat idea, but IMHO are not economical OR worth the trouble.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 - 01:46 pm: Edit

I really cannot see the point in including a "mini game with counters" in an RPG magazine, except maybe as a promotion to sell the board game (which 98% of RPGers wouldn't buy no matter what).

I can see a crossword puzzle, or a word game, or something like that taking up a page per issue, and I can see an "advertisement with examples of play" but I can't really see a "minigame".

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 - 02:06 pm: Edit

What if the "minigame" was to be used in GPD play such as something to play out the over all situation of a ground assault.

P6 had the start of that and I really would like to see that finished and presented for GPD players.

It could be played on it's own but would be intended to be used as a role playing aid.

By Ken Burnside (Ken_Burnside) on Wednesday, December 01, 2004 - 01:49 pm: Edit

You guys are thinking like gamers, not Trek fans.

Jeff Johnson put up the perfect title for this product.

"To Boldly Go...." volume N
"A Powered By GURPS Supplement."

It captures the good part of the Trek feel. It implies that it's an ongoing periodical without setting a production schedule, and is an excuse to write nearly anything that's fun and exciting in the Trek universe.

You might want to open the negotiations with Paramount to see if you can write reviews of the assorted Pocket Books paperbacks as adventure seeds. No, they're not entirely SFU -- however, the VAST majority of non-SFU knowledgeable Trek fans know them well.

I'd structure a review as this:

Title of the novel, ISBN, cover image if possible. Author's name. Reviewers name. Publication date.

Overview of the action of the book, including an honest grade.

Description of how suitable it is (or isn't) to roleplaying. Suggestions for plot seeds from it for roleplaying.

Changes you'd want to consider to make it mesh with the SFU. ("This is an alternate explanation of event XYZ in the timeline...")

Budget a two page spread to each review, and you've more material that people will WANT than you'll ever use. Establish a formal template and submission guideline for it...

I'm willing to bet that Paramount, and especially Pocket Books, in the right mood, would say "You don't want us to do any work, and you're promoting our backlist? If we send you free copies of new books, will you send them out to your reviewers?"

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Wednesday, December 01, 2004 - 05:41 pm: Edit

The problem is that this IS a gurps product and if the title doesn't include "gurps" the stores won't order it.

By Gary Plana (Garyplana) on Wednesday, December 01, 2004 - 05:54 pm: Edit

"To Boldly GURPS ..." ?

Naah. Never mind.

By Ken Burnside (Ken_Burnside) on Wednesday, December 01, 2004 - 05:57 pm: Edit

Steve, I think that Star Trek might trump GURPS for awareness, especially if it's more obviously Star Trek than Star Fleet Universe.

SJ does do GURPS products that don't contain the word GURPS in them (such as Hellboy, and Transhuman Space.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Wednesday, December 01, 2004 - 06:06 pm: Edit

Ken: Since we can't use the word "trek" your first sentence is meaningless.

And since we're not steve jackson games the second is equally meaningless.

By michael john campbell (Michaelcampbell) on Wednesday, December 01, 2004 - 10:25 pm: Edit

GURPS: TO BOLDLY GO...

Apart from the split infinative ( whatever that means ) is there anything wrong with it as a supplimental issue for GPD???

By Gary Plana (Garyplana) on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 01:10 am: Edit

That's not bad at all ... better than my idea, anyhow.

I still prefer STAR FLEET TIMES, though.

By F. Douglas Wall (Knarf) on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 01:52 am: Edit

Or maybe just "GURPS Prime Directive: Supplemental"

By Gary Plana (Garyplana) on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 03:05 am: Edit

We need something that sounds like a magazine title. MP didn't have that and look what happened.

By Jeff Johnson (Jeffro) on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 08:24 am: Edit

Do it like the Empire Strikes Back did:

small font: |----Star---------------|
large font: |THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK|
small font: |-----------Wars--------|

small font: |----GURPS-------------------------|
large font: |```````TO BOLDLY GO...```````|
small font: |-----------Prime Directive--------|

By Patrick H. Dillman (Patrick) on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 06:47 pm: Edit

To boldly go...

TBG:GRUPS Prime Directive. I like Mr. Johnsons' idea. Split the title on the graphics for the cover.

Just my 2 cents

PHD

By Ken Burnside (Ken_Burnside) on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 06:54 pm: Edit

Star Fleet Adventure Journal.

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 06:58 pm: Edit

How about a Warp factor.

Each issue is a new Factor.

Make volumes of 10 issues. So:

GURPS Warp 1.1 Magazine (volume one, issue #1).

Your set for 100 issues. Pleanty, I'd say.

And it doesn't need to be 96 or 112 pages. 64 pages would be enough, IMO.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 07:00 pm: Edit

I haven't heard anything yet that grabs me. Leanna and I went around and around for two years before she stumbled on the title FEDERATION COMMANDER for the new tactical game so it's just a matter of time before we stumble into something.

A greater question is the overall mission, goal, and structure. Which comes into three questions.

First, who's going to publish it. I'd rather not, but if SJG was willing to they would have.

Second, who's going to be the editor. Frankly, I have a job and I don't want this one. Gary would be first in line to offer but Jackson won't have it. It would have to be someone who could edit and recruit articles.

Third, it is going to be something for all gurps space stuff, or just for GPD? Or for GPD with data to allow transhuman, space, traveller, and other such space things to use it?