Three Questions

[HappyDaze]

1. If I use an offensive burst from an ESG on a cloaked vessel, this voids the cloak for 4 Impulses. Does this apply to other weapons fire in the same Impulse (which is simultaneous), or does the voiding only take effect on the next Impulse? Simply put, if I ESG-burst a cloaked Orion on Impulse 3, would the cloak still apply against other direct fire weapons in Impulse 3? What about seeking weapons launched during Impulse 3 (which is after all direct fire weapons - including the ESG - have been resolved)?

2. Per 4K1d, up to one in three WYN ships can hold Hellbores in Disruptor capable mounts. Is this accurate? Does this mean that a WYN ABC can mount up to four Hellbores so long as it is accompanied by two or more additional WYN ships?

3. Regarding Orion engine doubling, 5L3 says in one place that, "A given ship must double all of its warp engines or none of them." It then lists ships with a rule that runs contrary. Is this a deliberate exception?

[terryoc]

1. I believe that, because all weapons fire is simultaneous, the cloak is voided AFTER weapons fire is resolved in that case. So you'd fire say, a disruptor and the ESG, and the disruptor would be affected by the cloak. But after that, you could use tractor beams, transporters, or seeking weapons on the ship with the voided cloak in that impulse. I'm pretty sure that weapons fire by other ships in the same impulse would also be affected by the cloak no matter the order of resolution, but will have to wait for Mike West to answer for sure.

2. Yes, that's right. a WYN Auxiliary Cruiser could hold four Hellbores as long as there were two other WYN ships around.

3. Yes, I think that the rules on engine doubling have been changed in the latest version of the rules... I'd have to check.

[mjwest]

Terry got it right, all three times.

1) All direct fire is simultaneous, and the Offensive Mode of the ESG is a direct fire weapon. The cloak is not voided until AFTER that Offensive Fire phase is over.

However, since the Launch Phase is after Offensive Fire phase, the cloak is now voided, allowing seeking weapons to fire at the cloaked ship.

2) Currently, yes, that is the rule. I think we need to tighten it up (a lot), but for now, yes, that is how it works.

3) That sentence was superseded by the rest of the rule. Basically, you only have to double all of the engines if the ship only loses a single box. If a ship loses one box per engine, then it can double engines independently.

[storeylf]

I'd have expected the cloak to void immediately after that ships fire (i.e won't help the ship with the ESG), rather than after the offensive fire phase.

Whilst the cloak isn't destroyed it is a similiar situation to having a sytem destroyed by one ship not being useable against a 2nd ships attack.

[mjwest]

I'd have expected the cloak to void immediately after that ships fire (i.e won't help the ship with the ESG), rather than after the offensive fire phase.

Whilst the cloak isn't destroyed it is a similiar situation to having a sytem destroyed by one ship not being useable against a 2nd ships attack.

No, it is like the situation where a ship has declared fire on one ship, only to get gutted by a different ship that fired first that phase. All that weapons fire still gets resolved. Same for the cloak. It is already in effect, and so lasts for the full phase.

[storeylf]

So is this likely to be a general rule assumption, where it may matter, the voiding of a cloak happens at the end of the phase that it occured?

[mjwest]

I would have to think about any other possibilities where this is an actual concern, but my initial reaction is to say, "Yes."

[storeylf]

I'm not exactly sure whether it might matter elsewhere, but we have been using Roms a lot recently and discussing the implications of voiding cloak seems to crop up at least once a game.