Federation Commander

[Steve Cole]

I mentioned in the TalkShoe meeting that if we ever did Omega Commander, we wouldn't sell enough to make laminated cards, but we might sell it as a PDF. Now, given the hell that was Briefing #2 with 72 cards, I think you'd be looking at a more realistic number (24 maybe) and if that one sold well enough to pay for the time spent creating and checking it (and checking-fixing is 2/3 of the work) then we might do a second one. If that sold, we might do a third. And so on.

You might do well to figure out a ship list based on a 3 or 4 empires and a 24 ships and let's see what happens.
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The Guy Who Designed Fed Commander

[Nerroth]

I just typed up a reply to that effect over in the project eleven thread - but I can repeat the gist of what I had in mind here.


The first module I'd recommend could look something like this:


Auroran - CLA, CL, FF, CR
Mæsron - CA, CL, DD, FF
Trobrin - CA, FFL, FF
Iridani - GL, BQ, CR, YW
Bolosco - MC

Bonus ships - Mæsron DN, Trobrin CC and DSN, Iridani CP and BG, Bolosco MD

Battleship-sized units (if there's room for them) - Mæsron BB, Iridani MW

If the battleships aren't viable (or there was room for 24 standard ship cards even if they are) I'd also add the Auroran PBT, plus a dedicated card set up for Bolosco pods and Iridani modules.


If that module worked, an 'attack' module could flesh out the empires above, giving more ships and bases, along with a couple of the civilian ships from Captain's Log #20.


I'd keep the later Auroran ships to one side, and suggest they be offered alongside ships from four other empires (Probr, Koligahr, Vari, trading-Qixa) at some later point... if the first and second module worked, that is.
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FC Omega Discussion (v3)
FC LMC Discussion

[mjwest]

Gary,

Please try this again.

There will not be an Attack-style module for Omega. There *may* be a PDF-only Briefing-style module for Omega. Don't worry about ship cards. Don't worry about finishing the deal (e.g. Battleships, unless are truly intrinsic to the fleets). Don't worry about complete fleets. Do worry about playable fleets.

Instead, look at it this way: There are 24 ship cards to give an overview of Omega. Remember that for there to be any more, this has to sell well enough. That means they need to be 24 ships that will do the best to draw people in. Bonus points if they have miniatures.

So, ignore you prior post and give three or four empires, with 6-8 ships each. What empires will have the broadest appeal? What empires will have the best impact? What empires' rules will translate best into FC? What empires are the most fun to play?

Now, with that all in mind, what do you suggest?
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Federation Commander Answer Guy

[Scoutdad]

FRA of course, because they have minis available already...
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Commander, Battlegroup Murfreesboro
Department Head, ACTASF

[Nerroth]

The 'bonus' ships could be folded into the main list with no problems:

------

Auroran - CLA, CL, FF, CR, PBT
Mæsron - DN, CA, CL, DD, FF
Trobrin - DSN, CC, CA, FFL, FF
Iridani - MW, GL, CP, BQ, CR, YW
Bolosco - MD, MC
Support - card with Iridani module and Bolosco pod info

Battleships (if possible) - Mæsron BB, Iridani MW

------

Also, I didn't pick this choice of empires for nothing.

*The Aurorans are front and centre, as they have Alpha Octant species in there (initially from the Federation, but with Klingon, Lyran and ISC add-ons later on) - and as Scoutdad mentions, they have minis.

*The Mæsrons are at the very heart of Omega history. Centrally located in Omega the way the Federation are in Alpha, their rise, fall and renaissance help define the entire Octant. Plus, with the Civil War, you can fly both alongside and against Auroran ships. (There are some variants and modified ships the Vulpa used, which I'd hope to see in a follow-on module if things get that far.)

*The Trobrin are, arguably, the best choice as the first major adversary empire. Their ships are big and tough, they are long-standing rivals of the Alliance, and they are the first empire to take a pop at the Aurora system itself.

*The Bolosco have a wide-ranging remit, travelling far and wide across Omega. The ships in the list, the Merchant Cruiser and Mercenary Dreadnought, are their two most powerful units - and are among the most dangerous ships in Omega space (especially with the right choice of pods).

*The Iridani, knightly space-otters on far-reaching Quests, can be called upon to serve the terms of their honour-bound tasks in as many ways as you like. Plus, when the Andromedans came calling, the Iridani fleet managed not only to liberate their home space, but to launch Crusades back into the embattled Omega Octant... not least in a battle in 2600 which saved the Federal Republic's bacon.

*And I want the battleships in there because they are ideal flagships for their respective fleets (not least for the Iridani, who historically built several Man-O-War BBs in their home Cluster, at least two of which survived the Grand Quest to retake the Throne Planet of Iridia). Indeed, these ships can help take the fight to an Andromedan player looking to set the ships from War and Peace loose against them - not least in 2604's Operation Concerted Strike, when a united Omegan fleet defeated the last major Andro foothold in our side of the Milky Way galaxy.


I stand by my argument that with the list of ships above, FC Omega would have as good a chance to get off the ground as any.


*fingers crossed*
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FC Omega Discussion (v3)
FC LMC Discussion

[Nerroth]

Sorry for the double post, but I figured I'd try to count out the new rules which these ships might need.


*The Aurorans are more or less good to go. The only new weapon rules needed are those for the altered-scale photon torpedoes*.

(The Throne eventually gets refitted with a tachyon missile rack, but that would be covered further down. There are other systems they have in SFB - shuttle bombs and short-range cannons - but I'd argue neither are all that necessary in FC. Standard suicide shuttles will do fine, and the only ships with SRCs can replace them with TMs or ESGs anyway.)


*The Mæsrons need three new rules - tachyon guns*, tachyon missiles* and wide-angle phasers*.

Of those, the TGs are Alliance-only, but the Phaser-Ws and missiles overlap with other fleets.


*The Trobrin need three new rules, too - radiation phasers*, implosion bolts* and implosion torpedoes.

The bolts and torps are Trobrin only, but the Phaser-Rs are handy for the Bolosco.


*The Iridani use the same phasers as the Mæsrons, so only need new rules for the focused energy beam* and target illuminator* - as well as notes about module* use.


*The Bolosco can pick and choose their phasers, but can get by with the wide-angle and radiation phasers for now. (Other phasers can wait for later modules.) Plus, they can use the same TMs as the Mæsrons.

They would need rules for their focused tractor beam and integrated warp tractor, as well as notes on how to use their pods.


So that's a total of thirteen new rules - nine of which (the ones marked with an asterisk) have draft versions here in the thread already.
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FC Omega Discussion (v3)
FC LMC Discussion

[wedge_hammersteel]

EDIT: Nevermind about the frax, I read the entire post, sorry

[Nerroth]

EDIT: That's okay.


Kind of ironic how the FRA and Frax can both more or less get by with pre-existing rules, though.

It might get confusing in SFB if anyone asks for FRA X-ships, though!
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FC Omega Discussion (v3)
FC LMC Discussion

[Barry Kirk]

I can't believe I missed this topic for so long. Just read the whole thing... all five pages of it.

I would certainly buy an Omega module for FC.

As for your choice of empires, they are certainly acceptable.

Can I ask that all these ships be play tested before being released since, for much of Omega the BPV values are way off and need to be adjusted.

After reading this post, I saw several references to the Singers. They are an intriguing race, but their tachyosonic beams are broken. Currently they are so feeble as to not even be worth arming.

However they can be fixed relatively easily. In a couple of days, I'll look up an old e-mail and post my suggestions as to how to fix the Tachyosonic beams.
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Kiera is my top winning show puppy.

After the show bath and before the show, she went digging in the mud.

[Nerroth]

Welcome to the thread!

Glad to see another Omega fan pop in.
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FC Omega Discussion (v3)
FC LMC Discussion

[Steve Cole]

I dunno, Gary, that looks like a LOT of rules for one book, but try this...

Go convert the rules you think you need into FC and email them to me AFTER ORIGINS and I'll put them into a book and see how many pages it is. Then we can run it up the flagpole and see if anybody salutes.
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The Guy Who Designed Fed Commander

[Nerroth]

If the amount of rules offered at once would be an issue, I'd be worried about another project I was hoping to get back into after Origins... but I'll leave that one aside for now.


For anyone so interested, I will try to post up draft rules for the last four systems here - though I should note that while I have my copy of the OMRB to hand, my Reference Rulebook is still either in one of the post-move boxes here in the new place, or in one of the post-move boxes down in storage.

Plus, I'm still a little bit unsure how to handle the Trobrin torpedoes, among other things.

So, basically, if anyone wants to pop in (or pop back in) with any ideas, comments or feedback, please do.
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FC Omega Discussion (v3)
FC LMC Discussion

[Barry Kirk]

I'll volunteer to do the singers...

As for the Tachyosonic beams... I'd like to get my hands on War & Peace first and see how the PPD rules are written before I start converting the Tachyosonic beams.

Having said that, here are some comments I made about Tachyosonic beams with regards to good old SFB.


Note that this is from an e-mail I was writing about Tournament Singers...

[Nerroth]

A couple of things I wanted to mention.


*The issue you present over the TSB is really something that needs to be debated in SFB first. To do that, you'd need to take it up in the SFB Omega section of the legacy BBS (not least since, as far as I'm aware, SPP uses that one exclusively).

Plus, if you post there about it now, you may not hear much back about it until after Origins. (I'm not one to talk, though!)

This thread is focussed on trying to make whichever weapons and systems that currently exist in SFB that are needed to make FC Omega work ported over.

If SPP signs off on any changes or revisions for SFB, then we can start talking about how best to bring them over to FC.


*An idea I had was that eventually, the Singers could be matched up in a product with the Loriyill and Souldra - I was even thinking you could call it "Songs of Fire and Darkness", to hint at the three fleets' various traits. (It could be called something else entirely, though.)

Still, that kind of trio might be a way off, compared to other groups of empires in the queue. (Not least if you think of the headaches that converting the Souldra to FC might bring...)

Having Singer rules (and those for the Loriyill) would be handy to have on the shelf, of course - but there are other empires that might need to get hammered out first. But then, the quantum phasers on later Singer ships are the same as in certain other fleets, not least the Probr. So, if the salamanders get done early on, it'll make work on the Singers (and other Phaser-Q users) that bit easier.



*I was looking back over the Bolosco rules in the OMRB, as well as the SSDs for the MC and MD in Omega 4.

On the one hand, there are a number of tricks and quirks the SFB Bolosco have, even aside from the pods, FTBs and IWTs. Ship stabilisers, different suicide shuttles, rules on locking the cargo bulkheads, and so forth.

On the other hand, in FC terms, I'm not sure they need them all. (Or the various tricks the IWT offers, either.)

So, my plan is to try and work their conversion one step at a time. I want to start with one or two systems (the FTB and the issue of pod usage) and see how the ships look with those. If they look good, I'd move on to the IWT. If the ships are enough at that stage, I'd leave it at that - but if not, I'd try to work out the funkier stuff. (Though to be honest, I not convinced they'd suffer terribly sticking with regular shuttles and doing without the cargo lockdown trick...)


So, once I find my FC books again, I'll see what I can do.
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FC Omega Discussion (v3)
FC LMC Discussion

[Steve Cole]

The PPD rules are in the reference rulebook (I think, I cannot find my copy, my desk is a mess) so they're already available.
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The Guy Who Designed Fed Commander