Federation Commander

terryoc · Captain Joined: 07 Oct 2006 Posts: 1384

When considering the effect of scouts on seeking weapons, the Aegis rules must also be considered, because a force may have both a scout and an Aegis ship under BoM rules. If you have a DB ship that has drone racks & special sensors (e.g. E7D), and an Aegis equipped ship (e.g. E5E), then you will be able to stop a LOT of drones.

Also, if the proposal to enable ADDs to fire offensively goes through, you'll see Klingon, Federation, and war-class Kzinti ships getting better at drone defense. (IIRC the proposal is that ADDs can fire at drones during the Offensive Fire Phase with a Range of 3 and a to-hit of 1-3)
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"Captain" Terry O'Carroll, fourteen papers published including six best of issue
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storeylf · Fleet Captain Joined: 24 Jul 2008 Posts: 1887

What? Never heard of the ADD thing. I can't see why that is needed.

I'm not sure the aegis and scout thing is an issue per se, if you have spent points on both aegis and scouts I'd certainly expect you to be able to drop a lot of drones.

terryoc · Captain Joined: 07 Oct 2006 Posts: 1384

It's needed because ADDs are pretty useless right now, they typically get one or two shots off and then are disabled.
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"Captain" Terry O'Carroll, fourteen papers published including six best of issue
"Man, Terry, you are like a loophole seeking missle!" - Mike West

storeylf · Fleet Captain Joined: 24 Jul 2008 Posts: 1887

Not sure I agree with the ADD thing (i've been playing with them long enough and not felt them useless), but again that is not really relevant. If the game allows 3 anti drone mechanisms and someone turn up with all 3 then they are going to be tough as nails vs drones.

If there is a balance issue there I'd say it was with the propsed ADD change, scouts and aegis are generic and available (once the ship cards are out) to everyone. Not everyone has ADDs, and that should be borne in mind when altering them, if it is felt that Add/Scout/aegis is too potent then hold back on the ADD change rather than nobble every one else.

terryoc · Captain Joined: 07 Oct 2006 Posts: 1384

Scouts and Aegis will be Borders of Madness. A change to ADDs would not be. The empires without ADDs don't face drone-armed opponents historically, or have their own ways of dealing with them (ESGs, Gatlings).

I think a change to ADDs is relevant, because we don't want drones to be nerfed too badly. Just enough that they are not overwhelming in fleet battles (which I think they can be now).
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"Captain" Terry O'Carroll, fourteen papers published including six best of issue
"Man, Terry, you are like a loophole seeking missle!" - Mike West

storeylf · Fleet Captain Joined: 24 Jul 2008 Posts: 1887

Sneaky Scot · Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 9:03 pm Post subject:

The ADD thing is new to me too. Is there a thread or proposal to look at?
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mjwest · Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 9:41 pm Post subject:

I had thought the ADD proposal was discussed before, but I don't remember where.

In summary, the change is this:
- ADD retains existing function as is.
- ADD can be used in Offensive Fire phase to fire at drones and shuttles. Range 0-2, To Hit 1-3, kills drone, does 1-6 to shuttle.
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Sneaky Scot · Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 9:43 pm Post subject:

Thanks Mike!
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Nerroth · Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:05 pm Post subject:

So, to be clear, it'll only be able to do that shuttle damage via offensive direct-fire, or will it be able to do the same (to suicide shuttles) via defensive fire?

(ADDs treat Tachyon Missiles as shuttles, so I'd need to clarify this aspect of the change.)
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mjwest · Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:16 pm Post subject:

gar1138 · Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2011 12:05 am Post subject:

What about adding the ability for ADDs to engage previously impacted drones that are held in a tractor beam? I always thought it seemed odd that you could only use ADDs on the impulse of impact, but phasers could be used on future impulses. Thanks,

Garrett

storeylf · Fleet Captain Joined: 24 Jul 2008 Posts: 1887

mjwest · Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2011 5:42 am Post subject:

Getting back to the main topic for a moment, a quick update ...

The "6" for a drone miss couldn't be added to jamming because of how it works in the HA rules. Remember, when jamming with the HA rules, it only affects weapons for that impulse, not the rest of the turn. As such, there is no real way to get the affect for seeking weapons.

On the plus side, the (5S4) Direct-Fire Defense rule can be used for to help a friendly ship, to self-protect, or for offensive jamming of an enemy ship. All three modes provide the same +1 shift. (This makes the jamming more versatile.)
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Nerroth · Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2011 6:34 am Post subject:

Thanks for the clarification on the ADD.

(Sigh, I had a feeling I'd have less of an excuse to skip trying to take another look at that SRC translation...)
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