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Web Breakers Against Globular Web
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junior
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 8:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bolo_MK_XL wrote:
You have to anchor a globular while your creating it (You can use shuttle to anchor) ---
Once your done it becomes a singular web, anchoring itself ---


Yeah, but you don't need SIX anchors to lay it, no matter how big it is.
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kang wrote:
If I have a giant hexagonal web of 30 hexes, anchored at all six corners with asteroids, can not a Tholian ship at any point around that hexagonal web reinforce the whole thing? So it's one web strand but with six segments - I think I'm getting it?


In the case you describe, you have one big web with six segments. It has a single total web strength. It is one web strand. A single ship reinforces the entire web.

So, whether a web is truly globular (with no anchor points other than itself) or it is a linear web with anchor points and arranged in the shape of a hexagon*, it is still a single web with a single total web strength. Both are limited to a total length of 30 hexes.

The primary difference is that a globular web is indivisible. It either is entirely present, or it is entirely gone. You cannot lose a piece of it. A linear web arranged into a hexagon, on the other hand, can lose individual segments, but have the other segments survive.

Also, a globular web must be laid all at once, and cannot be stopped unless done or the whole web goes away. A hexagonal linear web can be laid from anchor to anchor, and only the current segment would be at risk.

The main rules in question are (5M2d), particularly the second point, which describes how a linear web can be built into a hexagon. (5M2f-3) explains how joining two strands results in a single strand.

mjwest wrote:
In the case of a set of six linear webs arranged in a circle, each segment is independent. Therefore, a web breaker will only attack the strength of that particular linear web and, once reduced to nothing, only that segment will disappear. The other five linear web segments will remain.


As a result, the above quote is completely and totally wrong. Please ignore my incorrectness. Smile
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 10:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bolo_MK_XL wrote:
You have to anchor a globular while your creating it (You can use shuttle to anchor) ---
Once your done it becomes a singular web, anchoring itself ---


While I have the book open, I want to point out that a shuttle, as a shuttle, cannot serve as an anchor. It must first be converted into a web anchor buoy (5M2j). Note that this change is permanent, and, even if recovered, the buoy may never again operate as a shuttle.

And, yes, a web anchor buoy may be used by a single ship to lay a globular web, though it would take quite a while, as it would take 42 points of power to create just a six hex long globular web. (6 points of power for the buoy, then another 6 points of power per hex of web.) To reinforce the resultant web into a strength of two requires another 12 points of power.

And the ship's movement is proscribed, so it is really, really hard to do while being shot at.
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Bolo_MK_XL
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have a question about phaser damage ---
In SFB, Tholian Phasers lose a point of damage for each hex between ship and the web its firing through ---
Didn't find the reference in the FC rulebook so can only assume it doesn't apply ---
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 12:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Correct. That was not included in FC.
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Bolo_MK_XL
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whoa, that will really make Tholian base defense a lot easier ----

One way to make web a bit stronger ---
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Kang
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mjwest wrote:
And, yes, a web anchor buoy may be used by a single ship to lay a globular web, though it would take quite a while....


That's just like in the TOS episode where we see the Web system in use - 'The Tholian Web' - it took 'em ages to make the web.
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pinecone
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the Episodes, they could fight on different levels from their opponent. In that case, they'd have to build it around, above, below, and every other direction. In FC they only need to build it around.
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Kang
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pinecone wrote:
In the Episodes, they could fight on different levels from their opponent. In that case, they'd have to build it around, above, below, and every other direction.

And that was what indeed they did. They knit it in three dimensions, all around the ship, and took a looooong while about it. They also knit it in several directions too; the web looked as if it was complete if you didn't know what it would look like in the end - and of course the Feds got out just before the web was complete.

Oops, spoiler for a 40-yr old TV episode - sorry Embarassed
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silent bob
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

didnt the webs in that also crush people too?
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bolo_MK_XL wrote:
Whoa, that will really make Tholian base defense a lot easier ----

One way to make web a bit stronger ---


You would think so.

But not really.

The key difference between SFB web and FC web is the maximum strength. In SFB the maximum strength was 35. This means that the Tholians could reinforce web to the point where a ship could not pass through it. As long as they can keep reinforcing the web, the enemy was kept at bay.

However, in FC, the maximum strength is 32. This means that a ship moving 24+1 is guaranteed to pass through even a maximum strength web. This puts a threshold on how long the Tholians can hold out. It also makes the required force size for the attackers much more deterministic. (At least for a "brute force" assault.)
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Bolo_MK_XL
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mjwest,

Where it will have the biggest affect is in the outer web ring (continuing for the inner rings) ---
Instead of subtracting 5 points from each Phaser 4, Tholians will get the full effect of what they roll ---
With 20+ extra damage, ships will have a harder time pushing through, because of power loss (this doesn't even include damage added by Tholian ships) --

I guess it is one respite for losing Mines ----
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Kang
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

silent bob wrote:
didnt the webs in that also crush people too?


Not that I remember. They were just trying to trap the ship.
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pinecone
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spock did say that the Web would contract and crush the Famous Constitution Class after it was finished.
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silent bob
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thats what i thought.
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