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Stinger Fighters
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Steve Cole
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Something about this is nagging my memory. I'll talk to Mike West about it.
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asguard101
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 4:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Asteriods? Reply with quote

Goonius wrote:
Does this mean that stingers must always take asteriod damage at speed 16? That does not make sense to me, they should be able to go speed 8 in order to reduce the damage from terrain.


They can use Decel anytime they want, no energy cost, so they can go speed Zero or 8 at their choice.
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Damage is based on base speed, not the number of hexes moved this impulse.

As the rules sit right now, yes, Stingers take damage as a speed 16 unit (which it is).

Since Stingers (and any fighter) is an intelligently controlled, highly maneuverable unit, it would be quite reasonable to add a special case for them. (For example, saying that fighters are treated as having a base speed of 8 like normal shuttles for the purposes of asteroid damage.) But such a special case does not currently exist.
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Davec_24
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it would be good to make them a special case, because they could move at an effective speed of 8 if they chose to, but because their "baseline" speed is 16, they currently take damage as if they were always moving at speed 16 even if they are going more slowly. Also, Stingers are much smaller and more agile than a starship, and may be better able to avoid damage from debris in asteroid fields. Perhaps making them a "special case" and treating them as having a baseline speed of 8 just for the purposes of determining asteroid damage and keep them speed 16 as they are at the moment for everything else would be reasonable.
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gar1138
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 7:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wouldn't Stingers take half asteroid damage (since they are a "shuttle"), just like regular shuttles and drones?

Garrett
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sure, but that is besides the point. I thnk asguard and Davec are asking for the reduced speed (or recognition of a reduced speed) in addition to any halving of damage.
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Mike
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, those Stingers and fighters are pretty nimble...
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Kang
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can the pilots really react that fast to invisible dust particles and small pebbles? These babies don't have a navigational deflector like a starship has, do they?

I'd think that if a starship takes damage in asteroids, then a shuttle/fighter should too; I agree with the idea that shuttles/fighters can take only half damage, but only on the basis that they have a smaller 'target' area.....
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Davec_24
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 8:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The fighters might have TFR though (or the FC equivalent of it) so that it's an automatic dodge so the pilot doesn't have to do the reacting. Anyway, that's only half of the point in that the fighters are currently not able to be counted as moving slower than baseline speed 16 for asteroid damage purposes, even if they are actually moving slower than this due to deceleration.
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Sneaky Scot
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting point - but would TFR work with a series of constantly moving objects (which as asteroid field would be - it's just moving too slowly for us to "see" in the game)?
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Davec_24
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd imagine that a TFR equivalent would work, in that the asteroids would be moving so slowly in relation to the speed of the fighters that they're almost stationary in these terms. Also they have some pretty awesome computer technology in FC, so I'd have thought it would be possible to have a computer co-ordinated TFR so that it can fly you over or around moving terrain, especially since the terrain's movement is pretty constant and shouldn't be too hard to predict in order to do that. I think fighters should have something like that, just because it's cool, even if it doesn't affect the way they play in the game. Smile
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Hod K'el
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 10:52 pm    Post subject: Stingers Reply with quote

Guys, I am having a hard time with this. I would really like to build two fleets with fighters; One Kzinti and one Orion. The Mercenary fleet (Orion obviously) would use F18C's, but if I can go a base speed of 16, which the F18C's can, it does not mean that I will go speed 16 in an asteroid field, so I would announce at the beginning of the turn that I am slowing to a base speed of 8 and pay for acceleration until I hit the edge of the asteroid field. I should then take damage as speed 8 since that is my new base speed.

My thinking is that I can accelerate from 0 to 16, which includes 8; therefore, I can decelerate from 16 to 8. Like a TIE fighter, I have no shield, but I am very maneuverable. Since I am hunting, and not chasing, an individual ship, shuttle, or fighter, I do not need the speed of which I am capable.

Now the question: where am I incorrect in my thinking?
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Kang
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 29, 2009 7:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gar1138 wrote:
Wouldn't Stingers take half asteroid damage (since they are a "shuttle"), just like regular shuttles and drones?

Does someone have a rulebook chapter/verse for this, please?

Thanks, from the Rules Lawyer Wink
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 29, 2009 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kang wrote:
gar1138 wrote:
Wouldn't Stingers take half asteroid damage (since they are a "shuttle"), just like regular shuttles and drones?

Does someone have a rulebook chapter/verse for this, please?

(6B2d) is the rule. The CRUL adds a reference that asteroids do half damage at fleet scale, too.
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terryoc
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 1:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the standard asteroid maps, there are corridors between the clumps of asteroids, so it's never really necessary that a shuttle or fighter fly through an asteroid hex, because of their excellent turn mode and ability to decel at will. I personally think that the rules as written are fine, adding a bit of a tactical wrinkle to flying fighters in asteroids. I admit that the RAW are counterintuitive on this point, but I don't mind that.
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