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Spray Primering.

 
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count_zero99uk
Lieutenant JG


Joined: 04 Dec 2008
Posts: 79

PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 11:46 am    Post subject: Spray Primering. Reply with quote

Hello, me again Smile

Right I ordered Squadron box 1 yesterday, should be here on thursday.

Thats 5 Federation vessels to paint.

Now im going to use a light grey primer spray to get them preped for painting. Having never used spray. Heres how i think it should be done.

Read can, shake can, put glued but not on stand minis on paper in a spray box. Spray minis left to right starting to spray prior to hitting the minis and stopping after the minis so a good covering is made.

Once dry turn minis over to do underside and repeat.

If i need more than one coat of spray leave it to totaly dry between coats?

and its best for more light coats than one heavy isnt it.

Any comments on my plan, and should i do one at a time for my first attempts.

Thanks
Zero
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Paul B
Lieutenant SG


Joined: 27 Dec 2006
Posts: 189

PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well my spray primering skills are pretty crappy, but yes from what I've heard use multiple thin coats rather than one heavier coat.


Though personally I've abandoned spray primering since I discovered I can just paint a thin coat of whatever on there for the primer. Doesn't need to be room temperature, and doesn't need to cause potential health issues. Usually its best to prime stuff outside (for ventilation), which made winter inconvenient but with paint on primer I can do it any time!
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count_zero99uk
Lieutenant JG


Joined: 04 Dec 2008
Posts: 79

PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ive read too many articles on this now. I am confused, i was originaly under the impression that spray primering was better. I now think this may not be the case.

It may be spray primering is better for lots of minis.

I think ill just get some sloppy grey and an undercoat brush and do it by hand.

No point in rushing and making a mess of it.
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Scoutdad
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Joined: 09 Oct 2006
Posts: 4468
Location: Middle Tennessee

PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd make one change to the process:

I always prime the underside first. That way, when I flip them to spray the top - if anything gets scratched... it's the bottom.

and not to dispute Paul, because I know a lot of people who don't prime their minis first; but I would always use a primer (be it brush on or aerosol). The acrylic paints just will not stick to a smooth metal surface.. .at leasdt not in my experience.

I've been in a hurry to finish a mini for a game or convention before and skipped the primer stage. Always and invariably, the paint begins to rub off the mini from repeated handling during play.
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count_zero99uk
Lieutenant JG


Joined: 04 Dec 2008
Posts: 79

PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think paul uses brush on rather than spray on. Not no primer at all.
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djdood
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Joined: 01 Feb 2007
Posts: 2925
Location: Seattle, WA

PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While many different methods work for different people, I'm with Tony. Spray primer is a must in my process.

It's nasty, smelly, outside-only stuff, but without it I've never had a durable basecoat.

On a molecular-level, primer *wants* to stick to bare metal and plastic (since it's formulated to). Paint is formulated to flow evenly and look good and often isn't so inclined to stick to smooth surfaces - primer gives the surface some "bite" for the paint to cling to.

Despite all that, the main reason I use spray primer is to keep from losing detail. The one time I used brush-on primer, followed by brushed-on basecoat, I felt the mini lost too much definition and some details were simply buried.

One tip I'll reinforce, regardless of which way you go, is to always wash the minis in a good grease-cutting soap and rinse well as your last step before putting anything on them. Any grease or oils from the molding process as well as skin oils from you can ruin the bond of what you are about to apply.
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count_zero99uk
Lieutenant JG


Joined: 04 Dec 2008
Posts: 79

PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

you can get brush on primers though cant you?
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Paul B
Lieutenant SG


Joined: 27 Dec 2006
Posts: 189

PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well #1. I wouldn't listen to me. I don't know much about painting.

But basically, my friend, who has like . . . hundreds of Battletech figs does a thing where he just takes regular paint, thins it, and then paints it on as the primer. As for me, I was sick of inhaling primer fumes, and being restricted in winter time and at my new place not really having any place to spray at all. So I went the regular paint route. I've heard some people say that primer is just paint anyway, though the guy who said it had a tendency to talk out of his hoopamajoop.

So basically, now I just take some black paint, thin it out a bit with water, and then brush it on. I dunno if it's the best method, but it's the most convenient for me.

My friend's Battletech collection never loses their paint, though he's using enamels not acrylics. For my part, I've painted a few trucks for Flames of War (resin models) and the paint is holding fast so far. Oh I also painted some Ninja Magic spaceships and the paint hasn't fallen off either. Though one thing is, after I finish painting it, I'll spray on some Matte Sealer to protect the paint. That's the only spray I still use.

I did "prime" some SFU and Fasa Trek ships using this method, but I haven't finished 'em up (or else I would've posted pics already probably).
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Scoutdad
Commodore


Joined: 09 Oct 2006
Posts: 4468
Location: Middle Tennessee

PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chemically speaking, enamels are considerably different than acrylics. They will actually (to an extent) bond wiht the surface of the item being painted. I've painted many items with enamels that have not been primed first, and they held up relatively well.

Also, the resin pieces are not nearly as "slick" as the bare metal on a SFB/FC miniature. The rough (relatively speaking...) surface of the resin piece provides a texture similar to that of a primer that the acrylic paint will stick to.

Here's an alternative that I used when we were first married and lived in a small apartment.
Since we had 1 and 1/2 bathrooms (the small, 1/2 bath being downstairs and the full-sized bath room being upstair near the bedrooms...), I would prep a few pieces for priming just before bed.
A bit of old newpaper on teh floor of the downstairs bathroom... the pieces on the top of a small box sitting on the paper...
prime away just before bed...
turn on the exhaust fan...
go upstairs nd sleep...
In the morning, the primer is dry, the exhaust fan has sucked the fumes out, and the paper has protected the floor...

Everyone's happy!!!1 Cool
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Steve Cole
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Joined: 11 Oct 2006
Posts: 3071

PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spray paint is my idea of how to paint minis. Tanks, civil war soldiers, spaceships. Two seconds of spray paint and I'm pretty much done.
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junior
Captain


Joined: 08 May 2007
Posts: 803

PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I use spray primers myself, largely because I'm not big on painting minis, so I tend to get a lot of them before I finally push myself to start the painting process. Spray primer means that I can get through this particular step quickly and efficiently.

Now what's of particular interest to me is that I think I saw a post on another forum that mentioned that there's at least one spray paint out there that doesn't fill in all of the little crevices on the miniature, but instead primarily hits only the exposed surfaces. So, for instance, if you were to prime your Gorn battlecruiser in black, and then spray it with the right grey/silver base coat, you would end up with dark rings in the fore and aft bubbles that looked like they were shadowed (as they would on a 400m starship). Unfortunately I don't remember the brand of spray paint (it may have been Tamiya), but something like that would also be of great use when getting a bunch of miniatures painted up all at once.

You'd still need to pull the brush out for highlights, though. There are no shortcuts on those.
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Scoutdad
Commodore


Joined: 09 Oct 2006
Posts: 4468
Location: Middle Tennessee

PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's Testors brand transparent paint.

Aaron Staley used it on several of his Klingon minis and posted some photos over on the BBS. He used Transparent Black spray paint. I don't know if they produce it in any other colors... but it shouldn't be too hard to find out.
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junior
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Joined: 08 May 2007
Posts: 803

PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, I'm pretty sure that's not it. That sounds like something that would be used as a primer (though I could be mistaken). This is something that would be used as a base coat (and not in black - the objects being discussed were some of Battlefront's WW2 miniatures), and is available in a wide range of colors (since German, American, Soviet, Commonwealth, and Italian vehicles all would be using different base coat colors).
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Scoutdad
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Joined: 09 Oct 2006
Posts: 4468
Location: Middle Tennessee

PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 8:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmmm... I must have missed that one then. If you figure out what it was, please be sureto let us know. I'd like to look into it.

I checked out the transparent black that Aaron used, but wasn't happy with the results. It would be good for working with 40K, gothic style scenery, and subterrainian terrain... heck, it might even make a pretty cool looking Black Dragon; but it's not what I'd choose to use on my SFB/FC minis.
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Paul B
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Joined: 27 Dec 2006
Posts: 189

PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2008 12:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eh, I don't honestly see how that's possible. A can of spray paint isn't going to differentiate hills from valleys when the paint falls on the miniatures. It'll just go where it lands.
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