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borders of madness
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markgeorgetwo
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Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 334
Location: london england

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 9:58 pm    Post subject: borders of madness Reply with quote

Just one question when will it be availble in the uk
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djdood
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Joined: 01 Feb 2007
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Location: Seattle, WA

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Borders of Madness is not even an announced product.

Right now it is just a series of articles in Captains Log and other places.
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 12:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, Steve has said that there will be a Borders of Madness product that will include things from the SFU/SFB that will be modified to work in Federation Commander. The intent is to allow for a wider range of possible battles. Items to be included are: scouts, maulers, and carriers/fighters. It will be done in the Briefing format.

Note that there is no release date associated with this. Until it gets a release date, it is just an idea that will likely get done eventually. However, there is currently no definition for "eventually". When its release date is set, you will see it here and in the legacy BBS. And probably in Communique and the Newletter, too.

But 'dood's broader point is completely correct. Until a release date is announced, asking for such is a pointless exercise.
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Steve Cole
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 2:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, it was announced last January for release in April. Then Middle Years happened, which used up all the time assigned for Borders of Madness #1, and convinced me I did not want to do another book with 72 ship cards in it, not for a long time.
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Mike
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Joined: 07 May 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm wondering if BoM #1 is going to contain anything more than scouts, maulers, and carriers/fighters?

If not, will these rules/systems have been changed since they were published in Communique and Captain's Log?
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USS Enterprise
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Joined: 27 Feb 2009
Posts: 376
Location: Vulcan

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What is Borders of Madness Precisely? Is it a FC product which includes rules for more of the things in SFB incorporated for FC? Or is it simpler SFB made for massive fleet battles?
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drwibble
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Joined: 06 Sep 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It has been described previously as containing the things which it would be madness to incorporate into mainstream FC. Partly because some of those things would seriously impact on the fast play that is the reason most of us like FC in the first place.

SVC has also said in the past that at least some of the purpose of BOM is to provide additional rules to entice SFB players to use FC to resolve some of their battles.

If you search through the previous forum discussions you will find several threads describing BOM. And see plenty of discussions showing that there is a wide range of opinion about the inclusion of some things within mainstream FC.

At the end of the day it is ADB's product, and they have to and will do what makes commercial sense for them. Some of us would hate to see stuff like fighters in the main FC game, while others would like everything that was in SFB to turn up in FC. BOM is.... in-between.
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, forgot about that announcement.

Anyway, "Borders of Madness" is an umbrella concept that covers several things. The two main things that currently use the term are a series of articles in Captain's Log, and a potential series of products.

The series of articles in Captain's Log covers items from SFB that will not be added to Federation Commander, but can be made to work within the Federation Commander system. An example is scout channels from scout ships. Scout Channels will not be added to Federation Commander proper, but a set of rules was developed that allows for their use within the Federation Commander rules system. Other such items that have appeared are maulers and non-Hydran fighters.

Borders of Madness #1 will be (assuming the experience with Briefing #2 doesn't permanently kill it) a Briefing style product with 60+ B&W paper ship cards. This will provide (at the least) carriers/fighters, maulers, and scouts for all of the empires. Since all of the published empires have to be covered, this means each empire will likely get but a single example of each. This then provides plenty of opportunity for eventually producing a BoM #2, #3, and so on.

The rules in the articles for Captain's Log (which are then sometimes reprinted in Communique after a suitable period of time) can be thought of a "playtest" rules. They should the form and scope and operation of how the rules are to work in conjunction with Federation Commander, but are still subject to change depending on playtest and actual use. Even so, they should still be substantially unchanged unless the original rules are just flat out broken.

The hang up to producing the Borders of Madness #1 product is Briefing #2. Briefing #2 covered an entirely different subject (the Middle Years), but was similarly constructed and included 72 ship cards. It was way more time intensive to create than was expected, and the "time cost" outstripped what it is expected to earn the company. Because of that, the experience of Briefing #2 has made ADB a lot more gun-shy about any type of product that includes a massive number of ship cards.

I hope that covers the situation clearly (and correctly).
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markgeorgetwo
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Joined: 21 Nov 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 10:38 pm    Post subject: post subject Reply with quote

Ok i think that explains it but i suppose it might be done in the near future. or has previously stated using captains log for the ship cards and the core rules perhaps has a separate issue.

But one idea i have just thought of i noticed that sfb in captains log has i load of scenarios is there any way to convert these over to federation commander.
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Bolo_MK_XL
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
But one idea i have just thought of i noticed that sfb in captains log has i load of scenarios is there any way to convert these over to federation commander.


There are ongoing attempts to do that by many different players, on the Legacy board they post which ones they are working on, so duplication won't happen (also to verify they haven't already been done) ---

This normally jumps into a higher gear when a product is nearing its release date, so if a scenario is needed there is more chance one is available ---
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Scoutdad
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 2:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you're interestedin converting an SFB scenario (either from CL, one of the R-Mods, or froma core rulebook), this is the Leagcy BBS thread with the sceanrios to date.

Check it out and if you want to bag one for yourself, post it there and no one else will duplicate it.

If you need the Federation Commander, Scenario Writing Guide, it can be found here!
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atomic
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Joined: 31 Oct 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are these converted scnarios posted someplace, or are they "on deck" and waiting to be published. To be honest, since I just read this thread, I have not checked in the CLs that I own or in the Communiques files for them. Embarassed
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Scoutdad
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

atomic wrote:
Are these converted scnarios posted someplace, or are they "on deck" and waiting to be published. To be honest, since I just read this thread, I have not checked in the CLs that I own or in the Communiques files for them. Embarassed

They are either already printed in some FC product, or "on deck" awaiting the next publication.
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Steve Cole
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem with converting all of those hundreds of SFB scenarios into FC is that 70% of them won't work with FC rules, but only with BoM rules.

Really, there are three separate games:

FC: the fast game.

SFB: the detailed game.

BoM: A package of SFB rules added to FC, but considered a separate entity.
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Sgt_G
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SVC's going to tell me this is in the wrong topic because it'll just get lost, but here's a scenario I proposed for SFB a long time ago. It showcases all the special crew & officer rules that "might" end up in BoM.

Background: The Federation Bureau of Ships was having a fly-off between the two best contenders for the next generation of Heavy Cruisers. They brought in the most combat-experienced ship / crew to act as observers / judges. A squadron of Klingon ships stumbles upon the test site and attack, not knowing what they're getting into.

Federation ships (all late-war refits and options):

One Command Cruiser with Outstanding Crew and one-each of all Legendary Officers.
One computer-controlled Heavy Cruiser.
One first-generation X-tech Heavy Cruiser.

Klingon ships:

A squadron of five to seven ships, one of which MUST be a D6J Penal Cruiser (with Poor crew, of course), with point totals about the same as the Federatrion ships above.

Additional ideas to spice it up: add one to three target drone ships (perhaps small frieghters), have the battle near a planet or a Base Station, turn the scenario around and have the Feds attack a Klingon squadron undergoing refueling / repair.
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