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Tactics thread: Klingon

 
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Nerroth
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Joined: 08 Oct 2006
Posts: 1556
Location: Ontario, Canada

PostPosted: Fri May 28, 2010 9:09 pm    Post subject: Tactics thread: Klingon Reply with quote

In keeping with the Gorn, Kzinti and Federation threads already up, this thread is intended to look at how best to handle the Deep Space Fleet.

A fleet admiral commanding a Klingon Armada has the Kzinti and Federation threats on their borders, as well as more distant potential opponents from the Gorn Confederation and Romulan Star Empire. (The Orions and Tholians aren't quite up to fleet level just yet, but that will change in time.)

Regardless of where your foes hail from, however, the Empire demands you do your best.

How would you lead the fleet to victory?
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vejlin
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Joined: 24 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So does anyone have insight into how best to stay out of short range of photons torpedos with the klingons?

I've just played a few games so I'm still very green, but so far it seems difficult to win with the klingons against feds. So far we've had an initial wave of drones while the feds close as fast as they can. The drones usually do a lot less damage than one would have hoped due to the initially strong federation shields, and once the feds are within medium or short range with their photons and phasers they really start tearing apart the klingons.

Trying to keep your distance to maintain the advantage of disruptors seems like it might be a good idea. While it's possible to keep distance it typically means the disruptors are pointing in the wrong direction though.

I've only played battles with few ships on each side so that may make a difference too I suppose since concentrated disruptor fire is likely to soften up shields and making the initial drone wave more effective. Alternatively I've considered hanging on to the drones till later in the battle when shields are weaker, unlike other weapon systems you don't lose drone racks when damaged, so the only risk is hanging on to the drones until the ship is completely destroyed (so far total destruction of ships has not come rapidly enough to really make me concerned about this though).

So what are people's experiences?
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Savedfromwhat
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Joined: 23 Aug 2007
Posts: 639

PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saber dancing is the tactic of choice for the klingons (just do a search for a great explanation of the tactic). But I personally prefer to lower the odds of a fed hitting me by coming into range 8 and annoncing evasive and firing. At this point the fed is forced to take the 50/50 shot with photons, or be forced to wait for what will probably be a worse firing solution later. The +2 shift really takes a bite out of the photon.
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vejlin
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Joined: 24 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for the tip. I'm still not really sure how this is supposed to work. When I search for "saber dance" I get a lot of superficial references and a few SFB/FC details. I don't know SFB/FC at all, so that may be part of the problem. I guess what I need is an overview description of what the saber dance is and some kind of explanation of how it would work in starmada. My impression so far is that the "saber dance" is to fire at long range, then turn around and build distance to your opponent, turn around and fire again. Repeat a number of times till the opponent is sufficiently weakened to be finished off or makes a mistake. Is that correct?

This seems to rely rather heavily on the energy management aspects of SFB/FC and the fact that there's a maximum speed. Since starmada has neither energy management nor a max speed cap I'm not sure it'll work. It also seems you need a lot of playing space to be able to do this. Getting off that first round of shots at long range is not too difficult to pull off, but even if you're standing still the turn you fire a D7 will not be able to go faster than 6 hexes in the opposite direction the next turn, while the federation player will (if he knows what's going on) be going faster than that. I'm just not seeing what I think is the saber dance working in starmada.
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Savedfromwhat
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Joined: 23 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Heh maybe I should have noticed that this was the starmada forum. Sorry.
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madpax
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Joined: 31 May 2009
Posts: 49
Location: France

PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 1:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is a possibility, though I didn't try it.
Using the pivot rule (in the starmada rulebook), you can outdistance the fed ships, whilst pivoting toward it, shoot and continue this way. It works better if the ship is equipped with wide arcs disruptors.

Marc
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vejlin
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Joined: 24 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 12:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

today I played a short CA vs. D7 duel, with the D7 winning convincingly. My tactic was rather boring though. Basically I just sat still doing evasive maneuvers letting the CA come to me. I only moved a tiny bit forward with P+S and S+P orders to avoid giving my opponent a chance to bring all 6 phaser-1's to bear at the same time (avoiding being in that arc A+B overlap).

I got extremely lucky with overloaded disruptors at range 12 (firing through 1 hex of asteroids too) stripping all of his front shields. That won me the game. I'm starting to think that an early drone launch while shields are strong is perhaps an error, and that it's a better idea to hang on to them until you get maximum payoff.

I'm curious how this will all work when using more ships per side (so far my biggest game has been CA+FFG vs. D7+F5)
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mj12games
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Joined: 13 Aug 2009
Posts: 60
Location: Milwaukee, WI

PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vejlin wrote:
I'm starting to think that an early drone launch while shields are strong is perhaps an error, and that it's a better idea to hang on to them until you get maximum payoff.

I'm not sure it's an "error" -- but the benefits of an early drone launch are mostly of the psychological variety, and thus subject to your opponent's whim.

Any Starmada player who has faced fighters/seekers en masse will no doubt shudder at a massive drone launch, even at range -- and may be coaxed into making a tactical error as a result.

Players who manage to swallow their fears and stay on mission may avoid tactical blunders -- but are risking serious damage if the drones roll well.
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madpax
Lieutenant JG


Joined: 31 May 2009
Posts: 49
Location: France

PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The drone-shooting ships can move with the drones, accompagnying them toward the target, forcing the latter to chose between them. A kind of 'mobile' shield.

Marc
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Dan Ibekwe
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Joined: 08 Mar 2007
Posts: 452
Location: Manchester UK

PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 2:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Had my first games tonight; a Fed vs Klink cruiser duel and a small fleet action, with a DN and two CAs per side. I played Klinks and lost both games.

Positive - my opponent hadn't played Starmada before, and isn't into the SFU, but picked it up very rapidly. Both games played to a decisive conclusion, and were dynamic and fun.

OTOH - Some of the ship stats seem odd. I know there has been some discussion of this on the Starmada forum. The Fed DN has both a stronger forward shield than the Klingon C8, and is also faster - WTH?

New tactics are clearly required for the Klingons. Staying at range proved impossible, protecting the D7's weak flank shields was problematic, and even flank shots into the Feds didn't seem very impressive. One D7 put a full alpha strike into the DN's RP shield at range 4, the DN just shrugged it off.

If I was playing this again, I'd consider a C7 with tw D5s, for the wider disruptor arcs and the D5's better shielding. Slightly sad, as I like using the iconic D7 from TOS, but just one extra thrust compared to the Fed CA doesn't really reflect the D7s agility in SFB/FC.

Not to decry the hard work put in by Daniel Kast producing KA, and I've certainly had my appetite whetted to try the Kzinti and the Orions, but we aren't in Kansas any more - this is a different ball game.
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gambler1650
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Joined: 30 Mar 2009
Posts: 71

PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My "Not in Kansas" moment came in a solitaire test game of Klingon Armada. Picked a few ship classes for Fed and Klingon..

As pointed out, Klingon Agility doesn't really show up very well, so my Klingons floated into overload range.

The Feds put most of their torpedoes on closer targets, but on a whim, one of the ships put an overloaded torpedo on the trailing F5.

One overloaded photon blew up the completely unscratched F5. It required perfect die rolls, but it happened.

For the Klingons, I almost wonder if the plan shouldn't be to end outside overload range on Turn N, moving at least somewhat towards the Feds, fire disruptors, and then on the next turn speed up and turn directly in to try to escape the photon arcs and be to the side or even behind the Feds and just use their phasers and drones. It goes against instincts to get CLOSER to the Feds, but because they can't fire until all movement is done, they might miss an opportunity to fire in such a case.
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