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Question about Romulan Falcon
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mjwest
Commodore


Joined: 08 Oct 2006
Posts: 3498
Location: Dallas, Texas

PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scoutdad wrote:
The SFU flavor text for this ship describes the R launcher as being so largethe ship was effectively built around it.
Even with standardized parts and miniaturization - you're not going to get three R launchers inside a hull that size.

It has been (fairly well) established that the color text is at least partly, if not entirely, hyperbole. A Pl-R launcher system just isn't that big. If it was, you could not fit it on the center engine of a K9R (or any of the other engine mounts it ends up on). It almost certainly did get reduced in size over time, though I doubt it was ever big enough that the ship was effectively "wrapped around" the weapon.

That said, no, you are not going to get multiple Pl-R torpedoes on a ship the size of the Falcon or War Eagle.

And didn't a non-mauler version of the Falcon get done in the intervening 18+ months? I thought one was done, but I could be mistakenly remembering ideas for it, rather than an actual it.
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djdood
Fleet Captain


Joined: 01 Feb 2007
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Location: Seattle, WA

PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 6:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hyperbole? Perhaps.

However, I think a plasma-R launcher is still a quite massive installation.

I've been pondering on this quite a bit in the last week, as I prepared my inputs for the King Condor BB (and it's two type R mounts, located almost coaxially).

What is rarely accounted for is that the "firing tube" and the generating equipment don't necessarily need to be right next to each other.

The example of the KC9R is perfect.

Only the firing tube is on the center engine (where the disruptors would be on a C-8/9). The much larger generating equipment for the plasma weapon is probably up in the boom or even in the command "bulb". The older Romulan "Eagle" ships have them directly connected, end-to-end, so the backshop "guts" of the weapon are right behind the firing port.

Some clever (probably Klingon) engineer must have pointed out to the Romulans that the type of shielded conduits used to move the output from the warp drive matter/anti-matter reactor to the warp coils in the engine nacelles could also be used to channel the output from a plasma-weapon's generating equipment to a the firing port. In the case of a type-R, I'm sure that's a mighty large and heavily reinforced conduit, but it frees up the naval architects to optimally place things.

I think this is also possible for the engine-mounted S/G-type ports on the Romulan ships. Some (if not most) of the weapon's equipment is in the "strut" and only the swivel-mounted firing port is on the engine itself.
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Rosencrantz
Ensign


Joined: 10 Apr 2012
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scoutdad wrote:
Wont work.
The SFU flavor text for this ship describes the R launcher as being so largethe ship was effectively built around it.
Even with standardized parts and miniaturization - you're not going to get three R launchers inside a hull that size.


First off, I am extremely new to the game. I've maybe played 6-8 games and started about 3-4 months ago. So my knowledge of all this is limited at best, and please excuse me for rambling.

Is there even any ship in Federation Commander that has three R-torp launchers? The most I've seen is two.

How many Phasers could fit on a Falcon if the Mauler was removed? It would be interesting to have a very fast ship with a rows upon rows of Phaser III's. I'm just guessing that phaser III's would take up less space than phaser I's, at least as far as game balance mechanics goes.

I'm also guessing Romulan's do not like or have access to missiles, otherwise the Falcon could replace all of those battery spaces with launchers.

I haven't figured out the overall ship cost in relation to the ship build (weapons, power, shields, etc.) so I'm unsure of how many "anythings" is allowed on a ship and what they would end up doing to the final point cost of a ship.

Oh, and is there a Fleet scale version of the Falcon Mauler? I've had no luck locating one.
Thanks
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aramis
Lieutenant JG


Joined: 25 Jul 2011
Posts: 60

PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rosencrantz wrote:

Is there even any ship in Federation Commander that has three R-torp launchers? The most I've seen is two.


Same, here, though I've been out of the game for years. And those dual R's were on the DN's.

The source deckplans SVC drew from for the WB show it as a spinal weapon; he's stated this, and I've seen what I believe to be those same plans... It's big. Runs almost the full length of the hull.

As for the FAL pre-mauler - that would be well back into the Early Years... YR4.6 is the Early Falcon (YFA).
Looking at the YFA, why not make it two lasers/phasers FH, and 4 Plas-G, 2 LF, 2 RF, with lots of batteries. Call it a "pocket DN"... The warp version would suffer for the lack of phasers...
(Batt Bank 1 & 8 become 2xLas/Ph-1 FH; Banks 2 & 7 become Pl-G; Banks 3 & 6 go away to make room for the Pl-G)
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Scoutdad
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Joined: 09 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 2:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rosencrantz wrote:
First off, I am extremely new to the game. I've maybe played 6-8 games and started about 3-4 months ago. So my knowledge of all this is limited at best, and please excuse me for rambling.

Welcome to our world...

Quote:
Is there even any ship in Federation Commander that has three R-torp launchers? The most I've seen is two.

No. Even the King Condor battleship only has two R-type launchers.

Quote:
How many Phasers could fit on a Falcon if the Mauler was removed? It would be interesting to have a very fast ship with a rows upon rows of Phaser III's. I'm just guessing that phaser III's would take up less space than phaser I's, at least as far as game balance mechanics goes.

You're really not going to like this answer. Since the external port of a R-type torpedo is all that could be replaced by phasers... you're only going to get two of them on there. And a phaser III emitter is the same size as a phaser I emitter.

Quote:
I'm also guessing Romulan's do not like or have access to missiles, otherwise the Falcon could replace all of those battery spaces with launchers.

Romulan tactical strategies are based around the plasma weapon. They could be a ship with drone launchers, but it would not fit in with their fleet tactics. And replacing the entire fleet with drones would be prohibitively expensive and would require completely retraining the entire fleet.

Quote:
I haven't figured out the overall ship cost in relation to the ship build (weapons, power, shields, etc.) so I'm unsure of how many "anythings" is allowed on a ship and what they would end up doing to the final point cost of a ship.

I've been playing SFB for 30+ years and I haven't figured that out.

Quote:
Oh, and is there a Fleet scale version of the Falcon Mauler? I've had no luck locating one.
Thanks

I don't think there is. The Falcon was a play test ship card released as a peek at the future BoM rules for maulers and as such, I don't think a fleet version was made.
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Rosencrantz
Ensign


Joined: 10 Apr 2012
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks ScoutDad. That all makes sense. I was hoping for a fleet sized Falcon since that's the scale my next scheduled game is in.
As far as not liking the phaser answer I actually don't mind. I figured there was some combination of game balance and following the Trek universe rules that prevented any ship from being like that. And the missile thing also seemed to make sense in that each race is going to need variety and restrictions to keep the game fun.
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