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Federation Commander A NEW fast paced board game of starship combat!
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Kang Fleet Captain
Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 1976 Location: Devon, UK
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:04 am Post subject: Power absorber questions |
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Ok, I've got my copy of W&P. Most impressive....
Of course I have some questions; these on Power Absorbers:
1) If a PA Panel is hit during damage allocation, does the disabled panel have to be in the facing bank or can it be anywhere on the ship?
2) (3G7b) says that H/R raids attack '..a bank (not panel)', but also says '....only one raid (per opposing side) can attack each panel'.
Is that a misprint, as H/R attacks raid a bank, not a panel?
3) In (3G2b), every tenth damage point scored, when Disruptors are included in a volley, is scored as a burnthrough. We have never before had the situation where more than one burnthrough is scored in a single volley, so this has never cropped up before - but is all the burnthrough scored on the same row of the damage table? Normally, all burnthrough is scored on the first row of the table, because there's only ever been a maximum of one point.
I'm thinking a Command Note here: If you are up against an Andromedan ship and have Disruptors, always aim to score at least 30 points and always target his weapons. That way, you may score three burnthrough which could knock out a PA panel. But that's one for another board, and even then only if all the burnthrough is scored as a single volley. _________________
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terryoc Captain
Joined: 07 Oct 2006 Posts: 1386
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:50 am Post subject: |
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1. I think it can be anywhere. Didn't see anything saying it had to be the facing panel bank.
2. yep, mjwest clarified this, it's one raid per bank.
3. yes, I think it's all as a single volley. As for the disruptor tactic, if you can score 30 points in a single volley without overloading disruptors, well done to you. Note also that Satellite Ships don't have some things like shuttle bays, labs, or tractor beams and this can cause damage to be lost to skips if you do this against sat ships. Personally I think it's more important to kill the Andro's batteries. _________________ "Captain" Terry O'Carroll, fourteen papers published including six best of issue
"Man, Terry, you are like a loophole seeking missle!" - Mike West
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mjwest Commodore
Joined: 08 Oct 2006 Posts: 4075 Location: Dallas, Texas
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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Terry got them right. _________________
Federation Commander Answer Guy |
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Kang Fleet Captain
Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 1976 Location: Devon, UK
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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Gentlemen, thank you both for the clarifications - and the tactical advice Terry. _________________
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Tiigo Lieutenant JG
Joined: 20 Sep 2009 Posts: 36 Location: Indianapolis, IN
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:32 pm Post subject: |
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I think I am still a little confused on the every 10th point of disruptor damage is a burn through idea. Lets say I have a volley that does 60 points of damage. That would be 6 points of burn through, correct? Now lets say I have a volley that does 60 points of damage, but 30 of that comes from disruptors. Is this cumulative? Would it be 6 points of burn through for the total volley + 3 more points for burn through from the disruptor damage? I guess I am confused by the additional mention of disruptor damage.
Thanks! |
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DirkSJ Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 08 Jun 2010 Posts: 239
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 11:06 pm Post subject: |
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Tiigo wrote: | I think I am still a little confused on the every 10th point of disruptor damage is a burn through idea. Lets say I have a volley that does 60 points of damage. That would be 6 points of burn through, correct? Now lets say I have a volley that does 60 points of damage, but 30 of that comes from disruptors. Is this cumulative? Would it be 6 points of burn through for the total volley + 3 more points for burn through from the disruptor damage? I guess I am confused by the additional mention of disruptor damage.
Thanks! |
One disruptor in the volley makes the entire volley use disruptor rules. What comes from what is not relevant. |
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Tiigo Lieutenant JG
Joined: 20 Sep 2009 Posts: 36 Location: Indianapolis, IN
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 11:24 pm Post subject: |
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DirkSJ wrote: | Tiigo wrote: | I think I am still a little confused on the every 10th point of disruptor damage is a burn through idea. Lets say I have a volley that does 60 points of damage. That would be 6 points of burn through, correct? Now lets say I have a volley that does 60 points of damage, but 30 of that comes from disruptors. Is this cumulative? Would it be 6 points of burn through for the total volley + 3 more points for burn through from the disruptor damage? I guess I am confused by the additional mention of disruptor damage.
Thanks! |
One disruptor in the volley makes the entire volley use disruptor rules. What comes from what is not relevant. |
Thank you |
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Kang Fleet Captain
Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 1976 Location: Devon, UK
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Posted: Fri Jul 23, 2010 5:28 am Post subject: |
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Yes, which is why my original tactical note would be valid. Yes it appears that "if you can score 30 points in a single volley without overloading disruptors, well done to you", but in reality when you throw in one disruptor into a salvo of, say, phasers, then you do stand a chance of getting those three burnthroughs. _________________
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terryoc Captain
Joined: 07 Oct 2006 Posts: 1386
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Posted: Fri Jul 23, 2010 6:02 am Post subject: |
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[response moved to Tactics section] _________________ "Captain" Terry O'Carroll, fourteen papers published including six best of issue
"Man, Terry, you are like a loophole seeking missle!" - Mike West
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Tiigo Lieutenant JG
Joined: 20 Sep 2009 Posts: 36 Location: Indianapolis, IN
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Posted: Fri Jul 23, 2010 6:55 am Post subject: |
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So, upon reflection on this, I think we have been playing this incorrectly (and therefore my confusion regarding the distinction of whether disruptors are included here or not against Andros). Our reading of 3C8 was that for every 10 points in a volley that did not burn through a shield 1 point would be scored as an internal. Against non-Andros or if there aren't disruptors used against and Andro, is there only a max of 1 point of burn through ever recorded per volley?
You'd think after having playing this for about year we'd know this one way or another. |
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DirkSJ Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 08 Jun 2010 Posts: 239
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Posted: Fri Jul 23, 2010 6:55 am Post subject: |
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Kang wrote: | Yes, which is why my original tactical note would be valid. Yes it appears that "if you can score 30 points in a single volley without overloading disruptors, well done to you", but in reality when you throw in one disruptor into a salvo of, say, phasers, then you do stand a chance of getting those three burnthroughs. |
It's a good tactic. If you can manage 30 without overloads with at least 1 disruptor you have a great chance to hit a panel.
Next impulse you are probably throwing everything else in with whatever overloads you can afford as two 30 point hits without overloads is a tall order for most ships in one turn. Especially after the Andro's return fire on the first shot. |
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DirkSJ Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 08 Jun 2010 Posts: 239
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Posted: Fri Jul 23, 2010 7:15 am Post subject: |
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Tiigo wrote: | So, upon reflection on this, I think we have been playing this incorrectly (and therefore my confusion regarding the distinction of whether disruptors are included here or not against Andros). Our reading of 3C8 was that for every 10 points in a volley that did not burn through a shield 1 point would be scored as an internal. Against non-Andros or if there aren't disruptors used against and Andro, is there only a max of 1 point of burn through ever recorded per volley?
You'd think after having playing this for about year we'd know this one way or another. |
If the target is not an Andro the steps are thus:
- Both sides decide who is firing what at whom and note it down, once this step is passed you don't get to add or change firing decisions. All fire on this list will occur regardless of any damage inflicted.
- From this list, pick a ship, pick a target it is firing at, roll it's damage for all weapons fired at that target. This constitutes one volley (or more than one if it contains fire from a weapon such as a PPD)
- If there are more than one volley created (as above with PPD), attacker chooses one to resolve
- Defender may spend energy up to their battery count to reinforce for the volley currently being resolved (you will get to do this again as you resolve each volley). Subtract any reinforcement from the damage dealt for this volley.
- If the total damage from this volley is not enough to drop the shield and is at least 10 points of damage (including any absorbed by reinforcement) then 1 of the damage is scored internally (roll this immediately, separate from anything else). The rest is applied to the shield.
- If the total damage is enough to drop the shield, drop the shield and roll the remainder of the damage from this volley as internals per normal DAC rules.
- If this was a multi-volley fire, restart from step 3
- If this ship had more than one target, restart from step 2, but choose the same ship and another target it fired at.
- Else, restart from above step 2 with a new ship.
The Andro rule changed Step 5 to this for absorbers only:
- If the total damage from this volley is not enough to fill the absorber to capacity and is at least 10 points of damage then 1 of the damage is scored internally (roll this immediately, separate from anything else). If any disruptors hit in this volley this changes to 1 point per 10 full points. The rest is applied to the absorber.
There is a fun edge case that I have yet to see in play that perhaps MJW can comment on. The base burn through rule uses the words "does not penetrate the shield". So if someone has a 20 point shield and you deal exactly 20 to it...is there burn through? You could read that one both ways. You've penetrated the shield. You just didn't score damage.
Last edited by DirkSJ on Fri Jul 23, 2010 7:51 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Tiigo Lieutenant JG
Joined: 20 Sep 2009 Posts: 36 Location: Indianapolis, IN
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Posted: Fri Jul 23, 2010 7:17 am Post subject: |
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Ok, its crystal now, thanks! |
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terryoc Captain
Joined: 07 Oct 2006 Posts: 1386
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Posted: Fri Jul 23, 2010 7:27 am Post subject: |
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Dirk, you don't total up the damage THEN resolve the volley, you decide which volley to resolve THEN roll the damage. All the weapons fired from one ship at one target in one impulse is one volley. The damage is also consequently one volley, but you don't get to roll damage then figure out which one to resolve first. Rolling the damage is part of the resolution of each volley, and once you start resolving one volley you can't begin resolving another. _________________ "Captain" Terry O'Carroll, fourteen papers published including six best of issue
"Man, Terry, you are like a loophole seeking missle!" - Mike West
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DirkSJ Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 08 Jun 2010 Posts: 239
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Posted: Fri Jul 23, 2010 7:40 am Post subject: |
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terryoc wrote: | Dirk, you don't total up the damage THEN resolve the volley, you decide which volley to resolve THEN roll the damage. All the weapons fired from one ship at one target in one impulse is one volley. The damage is also consequently one volley, but you don't get to roll damage then figure out which one to resolve first. Rolling the damage is part of the resolution of each volley, and once you start resolving one volley you can't begin resolving another. |
You are correct. I reworded that part 10 times and when I started referencing PPDs it ended up wrong (since with PPDs you do get three volleys of damage, numbers already totaled, and you pick the order you resolve). I will reword again. |
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