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Confirmation: ADDs and Suicide Shuttles
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gar1138
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Joined: 10 Jul 2007
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Location: Eugene, OR

PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 5:04 am    Post subject: Confirmation: ADDs and Suicide Shuttles Reply with quote

Just to confirm (assuming the ADD hits the suicide shuttle in both cases):

ADDs fired defensively at an impacted suicide shuttle will destroy the suicide shuttle immediately (no die roll for damage tot he shuttle).

ADDs fired offensively at suicide shuttles within 2 hexes cause 1d6 damage to the suicide shuttle (ie, they are not necessarily immediately destroyed like they are in defensive fire).

Is this correct? Thanks,

Garrett
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Blammo
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You have stated it correctly.
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As Blammo states, yes, that is correct.
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gar1138
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, guys. In a recent game, we were confused by the fact that shuttles are affected differently depending on the mode/phase they are hit by ADDs in. It seemed pretty odd, glad we were doing it correctly. Thanks,

Garrett
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JonPerry
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why the change to ADDs, by the way?

The offensive fire and the firing at SS, I mean.

I thought it was already tough enough to land drone hits on a D5 squadron. Now it is darn near impossible.
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JonPerry wrote:
Why the change to ADDs, by the way?

Because there were multiple independent requests for the change. In summary, ADD racks were of extremely limited utility and were, for the most part, just "padding" for drone hits. With this change, it brings the ADDs more in line with what their utility should be in the broader SFU, and makes them useful systems.
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ericphillips
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

At first I was not a fan of offensive ADDs, until I played against stingers.

However, I have to say, I do not like the fact that a hit by an ADD kills a shuttle if it hits in the defensive fire phase. I think it should still do d6 damage, just as it does at range one in offensive mode. As you can still back it up with phasers after the ADD, that is okay.

It is a matter of fun. Suicide shuttles rarely strike an opponent, and this rule nerfs them even further. A play example:

Last night in Treasure Ship, my opponent had launched and 18-point suicide shuttle at me. I think I can maneuver away, but he grabs me in a tractor. The SS moves into range 1 and I fire an ADD. Miss.

Next impulse it impacts. I have no phasers on that side, and I brace myself for some damage. I fire the ADD and hit. And the shuttle is gone.

Even as being on the receiving end, I would have preferred rolling damage on the hit against the SS.I would have had to roll "6" to kill it, or take damage, which, when you are done with a game, is something to talk about ("I can't believe you rolled a 6 to take out my shuttle!!").

To point out, under Rev. 5 rules, the thing would have automatically hit for damage, as I ha nothing on that side to fire, and ADDs didn't work against shuttles.
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Blammo
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ericphillips wrote:
However, I have to say, I do not like the fact that a hit by an ADD kills a shuttle if it hits in the defensive fire phase. I think it should still do d6 damage, just as it does at range one in offensive mode. As you can still back it up with phasers after the ADD, that is okay.


There is some merit to what you say here because phasers fired defensively have to treat the target as if it were at range 1. Following the logic you would think ADDs would to which would require them to roll a D6 for damage.
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ericphillips
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, and as much as I point out FC is FC and SFB is a different game for making rules, the reason range 1 is used for defensive fire rolls is because in SFB if a seeking weapon gets to range 0, it hits. You need to fire at it at range 1 or longer. At range 1 in SFB, the ADD hit on a shuttle does d6 damage. There is no autokill.
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JonPerry
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I completely agree re:autokill on SS
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ericphillips
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You agree YES to autokill or NO to autokill?
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duxvolantis
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 4:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ericphillips wrote:
You agree YES to autokill or NO to autokill?

No to autokill. Unneeded additional complexity.
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Nerroth
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 5:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree, it should be a d6 for shuttles.

In SFB, the whole reason the FRA converted the anti-drone into the short-range cannon was because ADDs treat tachyon missiles as shuttles, not as drones (while SRCs treat them as drones instead). In FC, ADDs shouldn't be able to effectively autokill a TM, else the defensive niche the SRC is supposed to fill would be made moot.
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JonPerry
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I could have been more clear.

I do not like autokilling shuttles with an ADD.
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JimDauphinais
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I raised a question about the difference regarding ADD Offensive Fire and Defensive Fire versus shuttles when RRB6b was being worked on to make sure the difference was intended. The rule wasn't changed. So, apparently it is intended and there must be a reason why Defensive Fire by an ADD versus shuttles is an auto kill when the ADD roll is successful.
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