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Fading at turn start

 
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storeylf
Fleet Captain


Joined: 24 Jul 2008
Posts: 1879

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:52 pm    Post subject: Fading at turn start Reply with quote

If a ship starts a turn fading in can it declare a base speed of 24?

A cloaked ship cannot declare a speed greater than 16, but does a faded ship count as 'cloaked'.

Can it declare speed 24 and void the fade that would otherwise affect it for the first impulse, so that it can go fast for the turn?
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duxvolantis
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Joined: 16 Nov 2010
Posts: 185

PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2011 2:07 am    Post subject: Re: Fading at turn start Reply with quote

storeylf wrote:
If a ship starts a turn fading in can it declare a base speed of 24?

A cloaked ship cannot declare a speed greater than 16, but does a faded ship count as 'cloaked'.

Can it declare speed 24 and void the fade that would otherwise affect it for the first impulse, so that it can go fast for the turn?

The rules do seem unclear and this should be clarified by mjwest.

I think you could argue it either way.
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Sneaky Scot
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Joined: 11 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2011 11:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd probably say no, as fading in/out is part of the cloaking precedure, but I guess our guru will let us know!
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wedge_hammersteel
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2011 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought you could set your speed to what ever you want as long as you do not move more that twice during an impulse.
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JimDauphinais
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Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Posts: 766
Location: Chesterfield, MO

PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2011 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can't select above Baseline 16 during fade-out, while fully cloaked or during fade-in. Per 5P3f 1.:

Quote:
At the instant the cloaking device is activated, a ship with a Baseline Speed of 24 is reduced to a Baseline Speed of 16 for the rest of the turn; the lost energy is simply lost. A cloaked ship cannot select a Baseline Speed above 16. The Baseline Speed is limited to 16 for the remainder of the turn, even if the ship uncloaks. This Baseline Speed (not the higher speed of 24) is used for all subsequent calculations, including tractor beams, towing, etc.



I would in particular note the language about "at the instant the cloaking device is activated" and the language "even if the ship uncloaks".

Voiding cloak due to moving more than twice during an impulse pertains to the use of acceleration. If you select Baseline 16, you can use acceleration on an impulse and then use deceleration on a subsequent subpulse of that impulse to cancel one of your three moves to avoid voiding your cloaked status. It is a subtle tactic that is occasionally useful.
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storeylf
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Joined: 24 Jul 2008
Posts: 1879

PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2011 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Certainly as the rules are written I think you can only declare speed 16. And as it is not me that is affected by this rule I am not to bothered.

However, for a ship that has started to uncloak at the back end of the turn that appears quite harsh, that they are limited to 16 next turn because the fade lasts into impulse 1.

Anyway I said I'd post for a clarification and check if that was the intent.


Last edited by storeylf on Mon Dec 26, 2011 11:06 am; edited 1 time in total
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wedge_hammersteel
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Joined: 27 Sep 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2011 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see my confusion. Base of 24 is out but 16 +1 is OK as long as movement is 2 per impulse. Thats what I was thinking about.
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JimDauphinais
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Joined: 22 Nov 2009
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Location: Chesterfield, MO

PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2011 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Certainly as the rules are written I think you can only declare speed 16. And as it is not me that is affected this rule and I am not to bothered.

However, for a ship that has started to uncloak at the back end of the turn that appears quite harsh, that they are limited to 16 next turn because the fade lasts into impulse 1.

Anyway I said I'd post for a clarification and check if that was the intent.



Yes, it doesn't hurt to check sometimes to make sure that what is written is what was meant. Let's see if Mike West answers differently once he has had an opportunity to see your post.
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Capt Jack
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Joined: 12 Mar 2011
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Location: England U.K

PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2011 1:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with Mr hammersteel. Very Happy
(but I would, as I am the one attacking the Fade in cloaked ship!) Shocked
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mjwest
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Joined: 08 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2011 2:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have actually been following this, but have decided to escalate prior to answering. Really, I can go either way on this, so I figure I might as well get the word of G.O.D.
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Targ
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Joined: 02 Nov 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any thing yet ? We had to do the rule ' roll the the die, higher decides'. Confused
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thought I should give the update on this.

If you cancel your cloak on Impulse #8, you may declare a baseline speed of 24 on the turn break, even though you are still technically under cloak and under the speed limit restriction of 16. This is a special case exception.

Even though one might (and I am not including Lee in this) argue that you could cancel a move to not void the cloak, the cloak is automatically voided by the declaration of baseline speed of 24. So, until the Other Functions phase of Impulse #1, the ship is under the restrictions of a voided cloak during fade-in.

Note that this is an exception to this specific situation. If you were to choose a baseline speed of 24, then activate cloak (dropping your baseline speed to 16), then deactivate cloak all in the same turn, you are still stuck at the baseline speed of 16 for the rest of the turn. This only applies when deactivating a cloak on Impulse #8 and going through the start of turn procedure while in the fade-in period.
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