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Question about Laying Webs
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gar1138
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Joined: 10 Jul 2007
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Location: Eugene, OR

PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 11:39 pm    Post subject: Question about Laying Webs Reply with quote

Just got Tholian Attack (what an awesome product!) and have a question about laying webs. When is the actual laying of web (spending 6 energy points) performed? Is is during the movement sub-pulse (when the ship moves to a new hex), or during the Other Functions Phase (when reinforce web occurs)?

If it is the Other Functions Phase, then does this mean that a given ship can only lay 8 hexes of web per turn (assuming enough energy)? Of course, very few ships would actually be able to do this (due to energy limitations).

I guess while I'm on the subject, is there a speed limit for laying web? Meaning does a given ship have to be going under a certain speed in order to lay web?

Thanks a lot,

Garrett
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:27 am    Post subject: Re: Question about Laying Webs Reply with quote

gar1138 wrote:
Just got Tholian Attack (what an awesome product!) and have a question about laying webs. When is the actual laying of web (spending 6 energy points) performed? Is is during the movement sub-pulse (when the ship moves to a new hex), or during the Other Functions Phase (when reinforce web occurs)?

Other Functions Phase is correct.

Quote:
If it is the Other Functions Phase, then does this mean that a given ship can only lay 8 hexes of web per turn (assuming enough energy)? Of course, very few ships would actually be able to do this (due to energy limitations).

Yes, that is completely correct. Laying web is a slow business. And if a single PC is trying to lay a globular web with the aid of a web anchor, it is going to take a really long time.

Quote:
I guess while I'm on the subject, is there a speed limit for laying web? Meaning does a given ship have to be going under a certain speed in order to lay web?

No, there is no stated limit on the speed of a web laying ship. However, there is a practical limitation. Basically, a ship may not move more than one hex an impulse while laying web. Whether that means speed zero with a single acceleration per impulse, speed eight, or speed sixteen with a deceleration per impulse doesn't matter.

However, if (using the last example above), that ship moving speed sixteen doesn't decelerate and moves such that it can't be a web anchor, and there is nothing else that can anchor the web in its place, then the web segment goes away.
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gar1138
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike, thanks as always for the excellent info. I really appreciate it,

Garrett
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Kang
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I note that a given globular Web hex may be adjacent to only two other Web hexes.

Does that mean, then, that I can create a tiny, 'triangular' globular web in, say, hexes 65, 75, 76 [large hex map]? Indeed, if this is the case, this must be the smallest globular web allowed, I would say.
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Kang
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If I have a 6-hex circle-shaped globular web with a web anchor buoy at one point [I have laid it with a single PC using its sole shuttle as anchor and a LOT of time] - can I lay linear web from the anchor, because this will count as a separate strand?

Or does it violate the rule that a given globular Web hex may be adjacent to only two other Web hexes, even though there's an anchor at the juncture? I realise that the example diagrams in the rulebook show a similar layout, but without [necessarily] mentioning anchors.

And if it is legal, can I reinforce/maintain the whole shebang from any point along the web, or just from the specific part of it?
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Kang
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Two more questions - sorry for the heavy barrage Smile

1) If I lay a web anchor buoy, and then say my laying ship has to leave the area temporarily, can it go away and leave it there and it will still work on my return?

2) Can the same Web generator be used to lay more than one hex of web on each turn, and/or provide reinforcement energy to the same or a different web? What I'm really asking is, what constitutes a given generator's use for the turn? - as I realise that the same generator can't be used as a Snare and for web functions in one turn, how far do the rules go with regard to other web functions?
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Scoutdad
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kang wrote:
I note that a given globular Web hex may be adjacent to only two other Web hexes.

Does that mean, then, that I can create a tiny, 'triangular' globular web in, say, hexes 65, 75, 76 [large hex map]? Indeed, if this is the case, this must be the smallest globular web allowed, I would say.

No.
(5M2d)1. The web cannot be bent to touch itself at any point; each hex can only be adjacent to one or two other hexes, and if adjacent to two hexes, those two hexes cannot be adjacent to each other.

Unfortunately, this precludes the "three-hex", triangular web.
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Scoutdad
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kang wrote:
If I have a 6-hex circle-shaped globular web with a web anchor buoy at one point [I have laid it with a single PC using its sole shuttle as anchor and a LOT of time] - can I lay linear web from the anchor, because this will count as a separate strand?

Or does it violate the rule that a given globular Web hex may be adjacent to only two other Web hexes, even though there's an anchor at the juncture? I realise that the example diagrams in the rulebook show a similar layout, but without [necessarily] mentioning anchors.

No.
(5M2b)1. It is impossible for a web hex to be adjacent to more than two other web hexes. A corner anchor cannot be a junction of three seperate web strands.
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Kang
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah - that's all clear. Thanks Tony Smile
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Scoutdad
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kang wrote:
Two more questions - sorry for the heavy barrage Smile

1) If I lay a web anchor buoy, and then say my laying ship has to leave the area temporarily, can it go away and leave it there and it will still work on my return?

While not specifically spelled out in the rules, I would think you could do this since you can't voluntarily convert back into a regular shuttle. in fact, once you spend the six points to convert the shuttle to an anchor bouy, the only thing indicated that can change its status is 16 points of damage - and that destroys it.

kang wrote:
2) Can the same Web generator be used to lay more than one hex of web on each turn, and/or provide reinforcement energy to the same or a different web? What I'm really asking is, what constitutes a given generator's use for the turn? - as I realise that the same generator can't be used as a Snare and for web functions in one turn, how far do the rules go with regard to other web functions?

(5m2a) Laying Web - last sentence of paragraph two:
"A ship can lay several hexes per turn, limited only by power"
(5Mcc)Reinforcing Webs: last sentence:
"A given ship may reinforce the same or different web strands during subsequent impulses of a given turn and may simultaneously reinforce two different strands during the same impulse."

Laying / reinforcing of web is considered one use - but extends throughout the turn, so you could lay / reinforce several hexes of web - subject to the limits of your available power limits. You cannot however, use the web caster to cast web and lay web in the same turn.
I hope this helps.
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Kang
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scoutdad wrote:
Kang wrote:
I note that a given globular Web hex may be adjacent to only two other Web hexes.

Does that mean, then, that I can create a tiny, 'triangular' globular web in, say, hexes 65, 75, 76 [large hex map]? Indeed, if this is the case, this must be the smallest globular web allowed, I would say.

No.
(5M2d)1. The web cannot be bent to touch itself at any point; each hex can only be adjacent to one or two other hexes, and if adjacent to two hexes, those two hexes cannot be adjacent to each other.

Unfortunately, this precludes the "three-hex", triangular web.


Ah - just a minute, though, that paragraph refers to linear web, not globular. What think you?
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Scoutdad
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmmm... in retrospect, you are correct about the reference being for linear web.

After reviewing the Globular Web section, it's becomes confusing.
(5M2g) states that a globular web is laid in a circle, but a triangle is not a circle... but then again, neither is a hexagona circle. The hexagonal shape is an artifact of converting a circular pattern to a hexagon grid and a really small circle overlayed on a hexagonal grid would be a triangle!

I think the trinagular shape defeats the intent of the Globular Web (i.e., having an open interior in which to take refuge, but I'm not certain I can find anything that strictly disallows it. Mike? Steve? anyone???
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Last edited by Scoutdad on Fri Aug 22, 2008 4:11 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Kang
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scoutdad wrote:
I think it refers to ALL web... not just linear or globular.

Yeh. I think we should assume that anyway.

[Edit] Reply added at same time as Scoutdad's newer comment above
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Kang
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scoutdad wrote:
hmmm... in retrospect, you are correct about the reference being for linear web.

After reviewing the Globular Web section, it's becomes confusing.
(5M2g) states that a globular web is laid in a circle, but a triangle is not a circle... but then again, neither is a hexagon a circle. The hexagonal shape is an artifact of converting a circular pattern to a hexagon grid and a really small circle overlaid on a hexagonal grid would be a triangle!

I think the triangular shape defeats the intent of the Globular Web (i.e., having an open interior in which to take refuge, but I'm not certain I can find anything that strictly disallows it. Mike? Steve? anyone???

Well that's what I was thinking, but instead of sitting in the open space inside, sit in whatever hex can't be reached by enemy phaser fire. Does the same thing but with less web.

Remember also that it even says that a globular web can be 'oblong' - it doesn't have to approximate to a circle. I think the shape is more or less immaterial as long as there are no convex angles when viewed from inside, and it's all one strand looped back on itself.

I also wonder what the rules would be if you had two anchor points - can a globular web have more than one anchor point? I assume the concentric webs on the 'wedding cake' map panel are actually separate strands of linear web with corner anchors, not globular webs.
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junior
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kang wrote:
I also wonder what the rules would be if you had two anchor points - can a globular web have more than one anchor point? I assume the concentric webs on the 'wedding cake' map panel are actually separate strands of linear web with corner anchors, not globular webs.


The Wedding Cake/ Three Ring Circus is generally made up of globular webs. The anchors are important because (due to technical details that don't factor into actual gameplay) of the special needs involved in creating a web that can be kept in a low power state for long periods of time. A normal Globular Web will dissolve if not constantly kept powered. The webs around a base are specially set-up so that they can remain intact even when they have only minimal power (although they don't actually stop anything at that level). Otherwise the Tholians would need to re-lay them every time the Klingons launched another base assault (it would be extremely expensive to keep them fully powered all the time).

This is one of those things that's mentioned in SFB, but not really described in detail largely because of the fact that it's more or less irrelevant to actual gameplay.
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