Federation Commander

(8C22) Die BEM, Die!
Question

The Hydran LN sets up in the middle of the map, facing B, with the Fed CL 20 hexes away in direction B, facing E (they are pointing at each other).

I quote from the Victory conditions “The Fed Player loses if the ‘Prayer for Salvation’ warns the expedition, or it survives until turn 11.� And the description of warning reads like this “Once fired upon, as long as at least 20 hexes away from the Fed, the Hydran player can Warn the Expedition and is successful as long as the Fed ship does not move in direction D/E from the Hydran ship within 8 impulses�

If I am the Hydran player, why wouldn’t I HET on impulse one and fly in direction D/E/F at 24+1 for the 10 turns and win the scenario? The Fed CL will never get within 20 hexes of the Hydran LN, on turn 11, the Hydran is going to win. If the Fed fires, the Hydran ship can “Warn�, the Fed will never be able get into the Hydran D/E cone within 8 impulses.
This seems like an easy Hydran win, are we missing something?

Does anyone have an answer to this question? I've been going through the senarios and it seems like a few of them suffer from a similar flaw (assuming that I'm not missing some obvious restriction).

I haven't seen the scenario, isn't the map either a location or fixed map, which would prevent just running directly away for 10+ turns at speed 32.

“Once fired upon, as long as at least 20 hexes away from the Fed, the Hydran player can Warn the Expedition and is successful as long as the Fed ship does not move in direction D/E from the Hydran ship within 8 impulses�

Emphasis mine...
There's the rub. If you HET on Impulse 1, you've not been "fired upon" and can't win.
This scenario recreates a portion of the Federation and Empire game. In F&E, the Federation doesn't enter the war until the Klingons attack them on Turn 7, or Turn 10 if they are not attacked by anyone else. Unless...
Historically speaking, the survival of the Hydran expeditionary fleet until it encountered the Federation forces was the event that brought the Federation into the war immedaitely (even if it occured on Turn 4).

You have to play this without hte meta-game knowledge the Hydran "player" has. His intention is to make contact withthe Federation player to enlist their assistance in the glorious War of Return. As such, he can not arbitarily turn and flee until the Federation exposes himself as a violent xenophobe.

The goal of the Federaiton player should be to approach close enough before firing to insure that he'll damage the Hydran to the point where he can not simpy HET and flee. As long as he keeps the Hydran within 20 hexes, he can not warn the rest of the Hydrans and the Federation player can continue to fire on him.

Storyelf wrote:I haven't seen the scenario, isn't the map either a location or fixed map, which would prevent just running directly away for 10+ turns at speed 32.

The map floats on the Hydran if I recall, so flying away at 24+1 is valid, and would force the Fed to do the same, or be disengaged.

Scoutdad wrote:Emphasis mine...
There's the rub. If you HET on Impulse 1, you've not been "fired upon" and can't win.

Hydran wins automatic on turn 11 regardless of whether he's able to warn or not. So HET on impulse 1, and keeping a range of 20 hexes for the duration of the scenario IS a viable winning tactic, regardless of if he's fired upon or not.

Scoutdad wrote:This scenario recreates a portion of the Federation and Empire game. In F&E, the Federation doesn't enter the war until the Klingons attack them on Turn 7, or Turn 10 if they are not attacked by anyone else. Unless...
Historically speaking, the survival of the Hydran expeditionary fleet until it encountered the Federation forces was the event that brought the Federation into the war immedaitely (even if it occured on Turn 4).

You have to play this without hte meta-game knowledge the Hydran "player" has. His intention is to make contact withthe Federation player to enlist their assistance in the glorious War of Return. As such, he can not arbitarily turn and flee until the Federation exposes himself as a violent xenophobe.

The F&E tie in is nice. I like having backstory and purpose to the battles (general meeting engagements get boring?), but the VC's are pretty directive for the Hydran and the Fed. As the scenario is set up, what about any of that would entice the Hydran to approach the Fed, who is in a larger ship. And if you go inside the initial 20 hex zone, why would the fed ever leave it (more enticement for the Hydran to never let him inside in the first place).

If the scenario reversed the ship set ups, it would require the desired activity (force the hydan to close/bypass/warn on the far side of the fed), but it doesn't. And nothing would stop the Fed from a HET after the fly by and keeping at close range in the Hydran's 6 (assuming energy allowances).

Generally speaking RP is nice, but when you sit down to play, you're kinda playing to win too. Not seeing why the Hydran would do anything but exactly what was described in the OP.

I just looked it up, it is a fixed map so running away is not possible. If you go off the edge of the map you lose. So no turning and running away, stand on your 3 stubby legs and fight like a real Hydran!

m1a1dat wrote:I just looked it up, it is a fixed map so running away is not possible. If you go off the edge of the map you lose. So no turning and running away, stand on your 3 stubby legs and fight like a real Hydran!

Yep, shame on me. I missed that one and that explains it.

Just thinking outloud, but if the Hydran closes with no weapons hot, why would the Fed fire on him? Additionally, if the Hydran is attempting contact by communications, why would the Fed fire on him? Is the Fed not following his general orders? On top of all that, the Fed could tell the Hydran ship to take a given position, direction, and distance; if the Hydran conformed to request, why would the Fed fire?

Under the premise of the scenario, the Fed captain has apparently lost his mind. However, do note that this is another one of those "trivideo" conspiracy theory scenarios.

Oh! A Michael Moore Special! Well, in that case, frakaschisiel...and the horse he rode in on...but at least in makes sense...sort of...maybe...well, not really.

As a side note, Joe and I played this one a couple of days ago and it was quite good.

I lost as the Fed CL, but I think its still fairly well balanced and would happily play either side again.

Hi guys,

Just a reminder that what Olivette Roche created as a trivideo is not necessarily historically accurate.

When I discover an Olivette trivideo that has a space battle in it, especially one that has an atypical match-up, I do try to get a scenario done for it. I work with the fact that Olivette has "interesting" notions about what should happen in her trivids and hope they will translate to a playable scenario.

Indeed, the Federation captain in this scenario is not quite "right" as he strives to protect the Federation from the Bug-Eyed Monsters that are invading it. But I thought it would be grand fun for you guys to have a reason for the Feds and Hydrans to meet in battle, so I wrote up her story. I think from the interior evidence, that her source for this documentary was perhaps a person with inside knowledge from the Klingon Empire.

I believe another of her revelations will appear in CL#41 and it will explain a great many things about the view the Federation had of the Klingon Empire. It is amazing the impact that social statements/entertainment may have upon the military's actions.

Jean
Keeper of "The Roche Files"