Do you think that when the Selts have come and gone the Tholians still get the paranoid itches?

By Alan Trevor (Thyrm) on Tuesday, September 28, 2004 - 08:57 am: Edit

Daniel;

My objection to an X-ship based on the D-hull isn't that it's too powerful, per se. The D-hull is defined as being SC2 and SVC has said no SC2 X-ships.

Loren has pointed out that we don't know for certain that that prohibition also applies to X2-ships. X2 is still almost entirely undefined except for the requirement that the BPVs of X2 ships "play nice" with X1 and GW BPVs. But until I hear otherwise, I tend to assume that X2 ships will also be restricted to SC3 and SC4.

Finally, if you look at my post addressed to Tos on 3:03 pm, 27 September, you'll see I'm still not convinced it's appropriate for the Tholians to have real XBC. There's a part of me that would like to see the top-of-the-line Tholian, even in the Xork era, continue as a 2/3 MC ship but with very advanced phasers and web caster technology.

Loren;

Even if you're right and the Seltorian incursion we know about is the only one into this galaxy, the fact remains that the Tholians don't know that. They have to be prepared for the possibility that the Seltorians will return, and with greater force.

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Tuesday, September 28, 2004 - 08:59 am: Edit

That, and the fact that the Romulans and Klingons beat the absolute hell out of them in the GW, devestating their home planet in the process.

By Tos Crawford (Tos) on Tuesday, September 28, 2004 - 09:02 am: Edit

While it has been categorically stated that there be no SC2 X-ships (except for the Jindarian) is the limitation really on SC2 or is SC2 shorthand for saying no X-ships with a MC>1? And did the Tholians know it was impossible?

By Tos Crawford (Tos) on Tuesday, September 28, 2004 - 09:10 am: Edit

Did the Tholians make a SC2 D or did they assemble 3 SC4 X-ships? Could the Feds field a SC2 X-Tug with an X-BP? If no then could the Hydrans assemble an X-Tug with an X-BP SC3 MC=1.5?

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Tuesday, September 28, 2004 - 09:43 am: Edit

I'll add my two cents, but may I suggest we move the Tholian discussion to the Tholian thread?

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Tuesday, September 28, 2004 - 10:54 am: Edit

Yes, more Selts would be on their minds. As such they might also build a base oposite the Sphere on the galactic rim.

By John Erwin Hacker (Godzillaking) on Tuesday, September 28, 2004 - 11:34 am: Edit

To All:
If you want to see some (possible) 2X Technology starships, check out my GORN BB variants in the SCARY SHIPS thread. My heartfelt thanks to Mike Raper for posting them for me.
Thanks, John.

By Joseph R Carlson (Jrc) on Saturday, October 02, 2004 - 08:17 pm: Edit

I have been working on some X2 designs. Many idead have already been posted and I have incorporated some these into the XCA.

First I have no firm conviction that phasers have to be PH-5s or Ph-6s. I hace used them in this ship. My though on what the XCA should be is an X2 version of the orginal CA. A ship set up for a number of missions that has a flexible desigh that can be adapted into an XCC and XCVS.

Original items for me . The Heavy TRAC: can operate 2 beams to range 1 (for 2 points of power) and a single beam to range 3 (3 points). A T-T box can be either a tractor or transporter. Lab box with a letter in it (A). It is a poer lab box that can perform scout functions 27 and 29. I used Loren's special brige and Mikes advance AWR.

It has 7XPH-5s, 2X Ph-6s, and 4 advanced photons (3xFA and 1XRA. The G2X racks (3) propose can fire 2xI/2 half space drones per tutn or 1X 1 or 2 space drone per turn. Comments are welcome.

http://www.vorlonagent.com/sfb/x2/joecarlson/Fed_XCA%20_v4.GIF

By Kenneth Jones (Kludge) on Wednesday, January 12, 2005 - 09:23 am: Edit

Here's my second take on a Fed XCC

It's built around my P5.

It has 3x Phaser Capacitor and can fast load 16poit torps.

By John Trauger (Vorlonagent) on Wednesday, January 12, 2005 - 06:44 pm: Edit

*3x???*

Yikes!

I often find myself thinking that 2x caps was excessive once the overload function was removed.

By Tos Crawford (Tos) on Wednesday, January 12, 2005 - 10:08 pm: Edit

Do we need a 2x vs. 3x poll? This may be a non-issue.

By michael john campbell (Michaelcampbell) on Wednesday, January 12, 2005 - 11:15 pm: Edit

If I'm Mr Uberschiff and I'm willing to drop the Ph-5 down to having 2 points in the Cap' IF it goes to a firing cost of one point ( and thus using X1Ph-1s as the X2Ph-1 for the Ph-2 analog vessels ) then I don't think it'll be an issue.
If the arming cost is 1.5 then whether or not the X2Ph-1 has a three point cap might be an issue but we need to know the answer to the IF question before we bother worrying about that.

By Tos Crawford (Tos) on Thursday, January 13, 2005 - 12:38 am: Edit

MJC, the proposals are:
PH5=1 Cap=2 (double)
PH5=1.5 Cap=3 (double)

No one has proposed:
PH5=1.5 Cap=2 (less then double)

By michael john campbell (Michaelcampbell) on Thursday, January 13, 2005 - 01:44 am: Edit

Didn't Kludge just propose :-
PH5=1 Cap=3 (Tripple)

Or am I mis-reading things?

By Kenneth Jones (Kludge) on Thursday, January 13, 2005 - 06:33 am: Edit

I did propose a tripple Cap. But but since it seems to be considered a bit much for a Y205 ship I'm willing to forgo the 3x Phaser Capacitor,

But it could be held in reserve if needed for the Xorks.

By Roger Dupuy (Rogerdupuy) on Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - 07:28 pm: Edit

Here's a Trade War Era Klingon cruiser obviously going for the 'Lean and Mean' approach.

http://www.angelfire.com/folk/sfb/ssdlib/

Note, the LMs take 1 point to fire. Overload is 2 points and just double the damage.

By R. Brodie Nyboer (Radiocyborg) on Wednesday, March 30, 2005 - 09:13 pm: Edit

Kenneth, I think the double cap should be fine for Y205 then upgrade over the years. That's the basic idea (dissent notwithstanding) for much of X2.

By John Trauger (Vorlonagent) on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 12:32 pm: Edit

Coming by way of Tos Crawford, MJC's Klingon XCA.

You can view it at:

http://www.vorlonagent.com/sfb/x2/mjc/kli-xd7.gif

MJC's Fed XCA and XFF can be found at:

http://www.vorlonagent.com/sfb/x2/mjc/mjc-x2-ships.htm

By Tos Crawford (Tos) on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 12:49 pm: Edit

Klingon MJC:XD7
Warp: 52
APR: 4
IMP: 5
Total: 61

This is a good example of too much warp power. The ship would be more viable if it were MC=1.25.

By Richard Wells (Rwwells) on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:40 pm: Edit

Of course, it is a very expenditure heavy design. 10 power going into ASIF bleeds off much of the excess power. (Of course, this example shows up reasons to be wary of high power ASIF style functions. Once the power gets placed into more useful functions, the ship might prove too effective. Shades of the revolution that occurred once Lyrans stopped recharging ESGs as often.)

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Saturday, December 24, 2005 - 12:20 am: Edit

Indeed. I had my working somewhat based on size class but for a cruiser it was 2 + 2 or so. Not a negligable amount but not a lot either. I did it just for that reason.

Also, the benfit needs to out weight shield reinforcement in the right circomstance. 10 point to power the ASIF would have to be very beneficial to be better that 10 points of specific shield reinforcement.

By Tos Crawford (Tos) on Saturday, December 24, 2005 - 02:00 am: Edit

I always liked the elegance of tying the max ASIF power to DAMCON. Now what it does is another matter.

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Saturday, December 24, 2005 - 02:34 am: Edit

I like that too.

By michael john campbell (Michaelcampbell) on Saturday, December 24, 2005 - 04:32 am: Edit

R.W.:

Yeah, negative tractor and the like can be super-effective places to put power, but there is also the BPV aspect to consider.

If an X2 vessel forgoes the ASIF it can race around or do a bunch of stuff, but then it's internals are a heck of a lot like an X1 vessel but an X1 vessel of the same BPV is monsterous.
So it's a trade off.


L.K.:

Well with; 11 hull and double hull, the 10 power would be better spent on ASIF even without the other systems...but you also need to compensate for the fact that reinforcement does protect A & B collum weapon hits whilst the (my) ASIF does not.
Again it's something of a trade off.

The term RIGHT CIRCUMSTANCES becomes important here. Some situations will require reinforcement others ASIF; and the choice between them is a new skill for the X2 captains to learn, outside of the GW/X1 sphere of opperations.