Archive through June 29, 2009
Star Fleet Universe Discussion Board: Star Fleet Battles: SFB Proposals Board:
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Y3 Proposal: The Tellarites:
Archive through June 29, 2009
One of the things I wish could have been in Y1 or Y2 is the Tellarites. They are one of the Original Trek species, and it seems pretty weird that they wouldn't have built a fleet, fought with their neighbors, etc.
I propose that Tellarite warp-refit ships (W-era) had fairly ineffective shields (basically, the Tellarites only put shields on their ships to block transporters) but had directional armor, ala the Jindarians. This would reflect the Tellarites preference for armor as a major defense system, given that Tellarites are pretty slow to throw away tried-and-true tech in favor of something relatively new.
Tellarite ships would have horrible turn modes, of course (think Gorn...) and might have worse maneuver restrictions that most EY ships. Say, they are unable to warp tac (sub tac's only), or have no HET bonus. Or maybe unable to HET, period.
As for the Tellarite heavy weapon, here are some ideas.
A) Use the photon torpedo. Simple, easy, boring.
B) Use something new. Tellarites strike me as the types that would use a heavy weapon that does Big Damage (for EY, anyway) and costs Big Power to arm.
like a 3+3 arming weapon?
Better:
A 2+2 arming weapon with the only overload ability in EY.
2+2 std
2+4 overload.
How about some sort of heavy phaser. Maybe the Tellarites had phaser-1's but could not get much arc and had no capacitor for them. So a cruiser might have four Ph-1 FA up front, and then a few Ph-2's like everyone else. Each Ph-1 also has a box of armor associated with it because this early phaser caused a lot of radiation. If the armor is destroyed the phaser leaks radiation when fired. For each time the phaser leaks mark off one crew unit with a dot (not dead but inactive)down to the minimum crew. Each Ph-1 on the SSD is a pair of boxes. One box phasers leak radiation when fired. Or, each firing adds d6 points to a total. When the total reaches a certain point the crew is considered poor. Phaser boxes can be repaired at normal phaser repair costs.
I like the directional armor idea.
I think all their ships should have cargo too.
Vulcans already claimed P-1s.
Loren...nah, the Rigellians are the ones that have cargo. Goes with the 'fighting traders' thing.
Any type of overload function is a non-starter, John. No overloads in EY.
Here's my wild and wacky idea.
Nucleonic Blast Cannon (Heavy, Medium, Light).
Arming 2+3+4 (3 turns, no holding, no rolling delay). Discharge if not fired.
Medium Cannons can only arm for 2 turns, Lights arm for 1 turn.
Hit on 'torp', cost to repair 15/10/5.
Heavy Blast Cannons can only be on SC2/SC3 ships (DN,CA). Medium Blast Cannons are on SC3/SC4 ships (CL,DD). Light Blast Cannons are only on SC4 ships (FF).
Max range 15 for Heavies, 10 for Mediums, 5 for Lights. CAN fire at rage zero, with feedback/splash damage to firer.
Firing arcs are 60 degrees for Heavies, 120 degrees for Mediums, and 180 degrees for Lights.
Envision weapon is 'hit-or miss', ala photon/disruptor, with accuracy sharply dropping off after range 5. Right now, say 1-6 at zero, 1-5 at 1-2, 1-4 at 3, 1-2 at 4-10, 1 at 11-15.
Damage at range 3 would be double the arming cost, increasing at range 0-1-2 (tripling at zero), fading at 4+.
Gimmick: If weapon hits target, does HALF damage to all other units in hex. 'Splash' damage. Splash damage hits random shield.
Concept: Cannon launching 'nucleonic' shells, bigger the cannon, larger the shell.
Downfire Mode: Heavies can 'downfire as Mediums/Lights, Mediums can 'downfire' as Lights.
Envision YDN's carrying 2 HBC's in non-overlapping arcs (ie,RF/LF). CA has HBC(F), MBC(RF+R), MBC(LF+L). CL has 2 MBC's(RF+L/LF+L). DD has MBC(FA), 2 LBC's(RF+L/LF+L). FF has 3 LBC's (FH/RS/LS).
Phaser loadout would be typical for EY (ie, 8-10 phaser-2's on YDN, 6-7 phaser-2's on CA, 5-6 phaser-2's on CL, etc.) Don't see Tellarites using phaser-3's.
Can see them having a slightly larger shuttle bay than normal, while not having as many transporters as normal.
Directional Armor:
Each 'shield facing' is an 'armor belt'. IE, instead of Shield #1, it's Armor Belt #1.
Can be repaired using the shield repair procedure, except each point of energy allocated repairs one box of armor.
Can only repair one 'armor belt' per turn.
Maximum repair limit dictated by SC (say, can repair a total of 30 boxes at SC2, 20 at SC3, 10 at SC4).
Cannot use EDR or CDR to repair armor.
Obviously, Armor Belts cannot be reinforced, either by specific or general reinforcement.
Tellarite ships can repair shields and armor belts at the same time.
EXAMPLE:
The Tellarite YDN Porkulus Prime has damage on 3 armor belts (#1,#3 and #5). The YDN allocates 6 energy to armor repairs, and notes they are for Armor Belt#1. At the end of the turn, AB#1 gets 6 armor boxes back, and the YDN can only repair 24 more armor boxes until it's exhausted its armor repair ability.
CONCEPT:
The Tellarites used 'energized nanogoop' to repair their armor belts during combat, rather than relying on shields, during the EY era.
The blast cannon splash will have to go. It's a fantastic anti-fighter and anti-drone weapon, so there's no way it would have been abandoned.
Jim, in the EY, fighters and drones are no big deal.
Area effect weapons always raise a huge CAUTION! flag.
Jim Davies is right. The problem isn't that fighters and drones are no big deal in the EY. The problem is that, decades later when they become a big deal, the Federation would resurrect this technology and in the process trash the established continuity.
Suggest: Heavies arming at medium or light have same firing arcs.
Otherwise, ain't bad.
Sounds like this has been on your mind (or similar) for some time.
Well....that's why I put the splash function as a gimmick. Altho I saw it more as a anti-superstack thing.
"Suggest: Heavies arming at medium or light have same firing arcs."
?? You mean they still have their crappy 60 degree arc? Well...yeah. The firing arcs wouldn't change for downfired heavies and mediums.
"Sounds like this has been on your mind (or similar) for some time."
Yup. Since the Y1 playtest, in fact.
Whaddya think, sirs?
*pushes the button*
A 3-turn-arming short-range weapon that can't be held won't be very usable. The enemy will just stay away until it gets emptied, then run in on the reload turn. This is made even worse by the arming cost rising as it goes on so the Tellarite has to slow down. And they have bad firing arcs and worse turn modes.
Have you [Mike] playtested this?
Jim...they are SUPPOSED to suck. EY, remember?
If the weapon is better (or as good as) a photon, then SVC will probably not go for it.
If you play the Fed National fleets vs other W-era ships, they are generally bleh (Vulcans the exception...).Terran/Alpha-Cents tend to be the best of the W-era Feds.
Also, the weapon is 1-3 turns arming. See the downfire option. There really isn't a 'reload turn', since he can fire it as a Light the next turn. No cooldown period.
Fly some D3's or Kzin WCA's vs Fed National ships, and you see why the Feds went and built a Star Fleet.
I missed the downfiring option, which probably does make it usable. There's a difference between sucky and unusable/unfun/broken.
This cannon should use roling delay or it's disruptor bait.
Read up on its arming cycle again, Daniel.
And remember it can downfire.
I wanted to emulate the old 'R-torp' dilemma, before rolling delay was invented.
OK, just for the heck of it, I made a Tellarite WCA. As it sits right now, it is probably way too powerful, but it is a start. (I'll put it up a little later.) I am taking the liberty to make a few changes to make it all a little simpler. (Sorry, FC has been rubbing off on me ...)
The ship itself is a large sphere, with two outboard engines and a large shuttle deck block sticking out the back. It turns like crap (TM E), but can HET normally. I think I will give it a 4-6 breakdown rating. I might make it 5-6. The idea is that it turns like crap, but is very structurally sound. So, it can handle the HET, but it just can't turn quickly. Let's keep the idea that it only can use a single Warp TAC each turn (for a total of two: one warp, one impulse).
Armor is 10-8-8-10, and shields are 5 all around. In that vein, I have given it pure LS/RS arcs. It has 3 LS Ph-2 and 3 RS Ph-2. It has one HBC LS and one HBC RS.
The BC still comes in H, M, and L. I am giving it a to-hit of this:
0: 1-6
1-2: 1-5
3-5: 1-4
6-10: 1-3
11-15: 1-2
16-20: 1
The HBC can reach the full 20 hexes. The MBC can reach out to 15. The LBC can get to 10. The reason for upping the ranges is because some range is needed to compete with photons and disruptors. The above to-hits are not great, but are better than the photon in some cases. I am thinking about eliminating the range 0 and preventing feedback. Dunno yet.
Mike never put out any damages. Let's go with a photon-like fixed damage of 4/9/15. Arming is just as described above, at 2+3+4. Again, no hold, no rolling delay. Note that since it can be down-fired, you can always discharge at any point in the arming process and start again.
For the armor, instead of requiring power (I am not thrilled with making something out of nothing all the time), how about using "armor ammo"? The armor is made of a modular ablative "magic metal". It can be quickly repaired in combat, but at some risk. The ship has stores of "50 armor boxes" that can be used to repair destroyed armor boxes. The ship can repair as many boxes as twice its damage control rating, but it costs no power. However, if that armor belt takes damage while being repaired, the "armor ammo" being used is lost (without providing any benefit as the repairs were not completed). And once the "armor ammo" is all used up, no more armor repairs can be done. I don't know if that works, but at least it is different.
Finally, this is not an attempt to "take over" Mike's discussion or ideas. This is meant to be suggestions to his ideas that can be freely accepted or rejected. (Assuming they even work at all.) And the hull shape is all his idea. (I'd done a big block. 
)
Mike S suggested that damage be twice the arming energy (ie 4/10/18) at R3, more closer in and less further out. That's not far different from yours except that it's constant.
Doing 15 damage at R20 is kinda unique. Even a bolted R plasma can't manage that, though it is more accurate. It's 'balanced' but suffers from the Fed TC problem: if you hit, you win. If you miss, you lose. That may not be avoidable with this type of weapon unless it's changed to range-of-effect like fusions and TR beams.
I have some doubts about the LS/RS arcs on the cannons. Something that big and brutal shouldn't have a 180 arc except on a base. Limit it to LFL RFR and it'd seem more plausible.
I originally planned on having three weapons on the ship: LF+L, RF+R, RA. But I didn't have any room for the RA box.
I missed the part about the damage. I originally thought of the 4/10/18, but decided that I needed to add some disadvantage to the higher power levels to not let them be as "efficient" as disruptors and photons. Thus the 4/9/15.
Actually, I am not comfortable with the 15 at range 20 either. How about this:
Heavy Damage:
1-10: 15
11-15: 9
16-20: 4
Medium Damage:
1-10: 9
11-15: 4
Light Damage:
1-10: 4
What this does is make the damage levels graduated, but it feeds in on the heavy/medium/light tradeoffs and their range restrictions.
It kinda sucks to spend 9 points of power to just get 4 points of damage, but at least you are doing damage ...
When it comes to alternate weapons, what about giving the Tellarites either the light or heavy photons that the Federal Republic of Aurora would later re-invent?
Perhaps the Tellarites weren't able to figure out a way of overloading a light (or heavy) torp by the time of the Middle Years, and were obliged to switch to the Federation standard (overloadable) torpedo when the TL12 era rolled in.
The Federation would stick with the standard photon doctrine going forward, but the Aurorans would be obliged out of necessity to revisit the variable-scale photon concept - though by then, they could work out how to overload their light and heavy photons.
(Oh, and an interesting PD note - apparently the issue of full Federation membership for the SFU Tellarites is hindered by political concerns from certain older member species, not least the Andorians. Perhaps this status means that the Tellarites had to take an equivalent of the 'Orion option' in terms of which ships served in their local defence fleet?)
SVC has already stated definitely that light photons are completely off limits to the Federation, or the Federation *would* have used them. That was a decision made back when Y1 was being developed.
I have wanted to use a "normalized" version of the proton torpedo (from P6) since before Y1, but SVC said no to that, too. I still want to use the proton, but it is not to be.
Besides which, all of that is pretty much moot. Mike's design intent was to have a "big bore" weapon, and, sorry to say, the light photon (or even the proton) don't qualify. Therefore, to keep it within what he was suggesting, I kept the Blast Cannon.
(In reality, Mike and I both expect that the Blast Cannon is moot anyway, as they will end up using the photon like everyone else, anyway. The Federation apparently just didn't bother with different weapons when the photon worked well enough. I guess the whole idea of "racial weapons" gets to be the ISC's unique thing. Which, really, isn't all that bad.)
Also, the intent is NOT to try to make a "new Orion" or a separate long-term fleet within the Federation. The Tellarite fleet would operate just like the Alpha Centaurans or Andorians. They are converted sublight ships that are scrapped when the unified fleet is finally built.