THOLIAN WILL GENERAL UNITS
R1.07 Tholian Large Q-Ship (Home Galaxy Version) 2
R1.07 Tholian Small Q-Ship (Home Galaxy Version) 3
R1.20 Tholian Small Armed Freighter (Home Galaxy) 4
R1.21 Tholian Large Armed Freighter (Home Galaxy) 5
R1.30 Tholian Will System Activity Maintenance Station 6
R1.58 Tholian Small Auxiliary Cruiser (Home Galaxy) 7
R1.59 Tholain Large Auxiliary Cruiser (Home Galaxy) 8
R1.60 Tholian Heavy Auxiliary Cruiser (Home Galaxy) 9
R1.79 Tholian Will Communication Relay Station 10
R1.A23 Tholian Jumbo Auxiliary Cruiser (Home Galaxy) 11
R1.A29 Tholian Variant Jumbo Auxilairy Cruiser (Home) 12
R1.A34 Jumbo Armed-Freighter (Tholian Home Galaxy) 13
R1.A35 Heavy Armed-Freighter (Tholian Home Galaxy) 14

THOLIAN HOLDFAST REVISED SHIPS
R7.05 Tholian Dreadnought (Revised) 15
R7.31 Tholian DP Dreadnought (Revised) 16
R7.44 Tholian DH Heavy Dreadnought (Revised) 17
R7.45 Tholian Dreadnought Carrier (Revised) 18
R7.46 Tholian Dreadnought SCS (Revised) 19
R7.69 Tholian DPW Dreadnought (Revised) 20
R7.80 Tholian Heavy War Cruiser (Corrected) 78

THOLIAN SHIPS
R7.89 Tholian Police Destroyer 21
R7.90 Tholian Improved Police Destroyer 22
R7.91 TholIan Police Commando Destroyer 23
R7.92 Tholian Police Destroyer Carrier 24
R7.93 Tholian Police Escort Destroyer 25
R7.94 Tholian Police Destroyer Scout 26
R7.95 Tholian Police Photon Destroyer 27
R7.96 Tholian Police Destroyer Leader 28
R7.97 Tholian Police Transport Destroyer 29
R7.98 Tholian Police Web Charger Destroyer 30
R7.99 Tholian Police Flagship Destroyer 31
R7.100 Tholian Police War Destroyer 32
R7.101 Tholian Police Improved War Destroyer 33
R7.102 Tholian Police Commando War Destroyer 34
R7.103 Tholian Police War Destroyer Carrier 35
R7.104 Tholian Police War Destroyer Escort 36
R7.105 Tholian War Destroyer Scout 37
R7.106 Tholian Police Photon War Destroyer 38
R7.107 Tholian War Destroyer Transport 39
R7.108 Tholian Police War Destroyer Leader 40
R7.109 Tholian Web Charger War Destroyer 41
R7.110 Tholian Police Flagship War Destroyer 42
R7.111 Tholian Police Carrier 43
R7.112 Tholian Police Flagship 44
R7.113 Tholian Destroyer Leader 45
R7.114 Tholian Mauler Cruiser 46
R7.115 Tholian Mauler War Cruiser 47
R7.116 Tholian Pocket Battleship 48
R7,117 Tholian Jumbo Web Tender 49
R7.118 Tholian Alternate Jumbo Web Tender 50
R7.119 Tholian Heavy Fighter Resupply Pack 51
R7.120 Tholian Light Carrier Pod 51
R7.121 Tholian Light Battle Pod 51
R7.122 Neo-Tholian Battleship (Home Galaxy Version) 52
R7.123 Neo-Tholian Dreadnought (Home Galaxy Version) 53
R7.124 Neo-Tholian Heavy Cruiser (Home Galaxy) 54
R7.125 Neo-Tholian Light Cruiser (Home Galaxy Version) 55
R7.126 Neo-Tholian Destroyer (Milky Way Galaxy) 56
R7.126A Neo-Tholian Destroyer (Milky Way Galaxy) 56
R7.127 Neo-Tholian Frigate (Milky Way Galaxy Version) 57
R7.127A Neo-Tholian Frigate (Milky Way Galaxy Version) 57
R7.128 Tholian Fast Heavy Cruiser 69
R7.129 Tholian Fast War Cruiser 70
R7.130 Tholian Fast Destroyer 71
R7.131 Tholian DF Light Dreadnought 72
R7.132 Neo-Tholian Fast Heavy Cruiser 73
R7.133 Neo-Tholian Fast Light Cruiser 74
R7.134 Neo-Tholian Light Dreadnought 75
R7.135 Neo-Tholian Light Battleship 76
R7.136 Neo-Tholian Heavy Carrier 77

THOLIAN HOLDFAST FIGHTER SQUADRONS
R7.F Tholian Fighter Squadrons 66
R7.F Tholian Heavy Fighter Squadrons 67
R7.F Tholian Bomber Squadrons and Workboat 68

THOLIAN HOLDFAST ADVANCED SHIPS
R7.214 Neo-Tholian Advanced Technology Destroyer 58
R7.215 Neo-Tholian Advanced Technology Frigate 59
R7.216 Neo-Tholian Advanced Large Heavy Cruiser 60
R7,217 Neo-Tholian Advanced Technology Mdm Cruiser 61
R7.218 Neo-Tholian Advanced Technology Hvy NDD 62
R7.219 Neo-Tholian Advanced Technology Hvy NFF 63
R7.220 Neo-Tholian Advanced Command Module 64
R7.221 Neo-Tholian Advanced Light Command Module 65

By Chuck Strong (Raider) on Wednesday, January 20, 2021 - 02:36 am: Edit

I don't know if I'm asking too late, but do these police ships use a standardize designation format that one can intuitively interpret? Such as: PD, PD+, PDG, PDV, PDE, PDS, etc,?

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Wednesday, January 20, 2021 - 02:46 am: Edit

yes

By Douglas Saldana (Dsal) on Wednesday, January 20, 2021 - 04:43 am: Edit

What's the difference between R7.126/7 and R7.126/7A? Both versions of each ship are listed as "Milky Way Galaxy Version".

Is one set of ships supposed to be "Home Galaxy Version"?

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Wednesday, January 20, 2021 - 08:27 am: Edit

Steve Petrick can tell you. They might be particle cannons vs disruptors but I am not sure.

By Alex Chobot (Alendrel) on Wednesday, January 20, 2021 - 02:56 pm: Edit

Per the Tholian MSB, the Holdfast arrived with a few Navy destroyers and frigates that were quickly lost. R7.126 and R7.127 represent what these ships would have looked like had they survived and been fitted with Milky Way technology and weapons.

The A subscripts are for hulls that arrived with the 312th but were cannibalized for parts for the larger ships. They were subsequently refurbished after the General War in time to see use against the Andromedans.

By Steven Zamboni (Szamboni) on Wednesday, January 20, 2021 - 03:22 pm: Edit

The minis for most of the relevant new ships are already done, I'm just waiting for the final SSDs to count greebles bumps

By Steve Petrick (Petrick) on Monday, January 25, 2021 - 11:36 am: Edit

Douglas Saldana:

Two NDDs and four NFFs made the trip to the Milky Way Galaxy with the Tholian Holdfast sphere. They were used heavily in combat against the Klingons and all were destroyed by about Y112. There was a study for converting them to local technology (dsruptors became available to the Tholian Holdfast about Y113, i.e., when the Tholian Holdfast destroyer entered service. So they became available for "what if" scenarios.

Then the 312th Battlefleet arrived in Y178. It was noted that several smaller ships were "scrapped" rather than being put into service to enable the larger ships to be repaired (which included installing disruptors). After the General War came to its end (with a whimper rather than one side gaining a victory), some of the Hulks were refurbished and put into service,

So the SSDs are the same, but the ships are from two different time periods, and the former is a conjectural ship, while the latter is a historical ship.

By Douglas Saldana (Dsal) on Monday, January 25, 2021 - 04:53 pm: Edit

Was there ever a resolution to the issue of whether the Tholians could overload their disruptors in the Early Years?

Recalling that the Tholians stole the technology from the Klingons at a time when the Klingons themselves had not yet deployed disruptors capable of being overloaded.

By Alan Trevor (Thyrm) on Monday, January 25, 2021 - 08:31 pm: Edit

Douglas Saldana:

Tholian Master Starship Book:

From Section (R7.4) DESTROYER (DD): "Prior to Y120 this ship cannot overload its disruptors, no change in BPV."

By Charles Gray (Cgray45) on Tuesday, January 26, 2021 - 12:08 am: Edit

Gotta admit, the only thing i'm missing is the Tholian BB from CL28 but since that was purely conjectural, I can see why it was kept out.

Also, putting it in would probably give the Klingons too many nightmares.

By Alan Trevor (Thyrm) on Tuesday, January 26, 2021 - 01:04 am: Edit

Charles,

I don't think it was just conjectural in the sense of being an "Unbuilt Variant". I believe it was actually "impossible", like the various "Heavy PFs" or X-tech Light Dreadnoughts. It wouldn't have worked even if the Tholians had had the resources to build it.

My favorite Tholian ship from Captain's Log 27 is actually probably the TK7 - a Klingon D7 rear hull mated with a Neo-Tholian Command Module. It's an adequate, though not exceptional, cruiser. But it seems like something that could actually have existed if the Tholians had ever managed to obtain a D7 rear hull; unlike the Archeo-BB or the TK8, which would have been an absolute behemoth of a dreadnought if it had ever existed. But I don't really believe it was "possible".

By Douglas Saldana (Dsal) on Tuesday, January 26, 2021 - 01:35 am: Edit

I once proposed a TK4 (D4 rear hull with a Light Command Module) on the theory that the Tholians were short of larger hulls in the Early Years (since they couldn't build them) and they almost certainly captured at least one D4 during "The Great Klingo-Tholian War".

By Douglas Saldana (Dsal) on Tuesday, January 26, 2021 - 01:06 pm: Edit

I'm glad the disruptor question was addressed, I was worried that detail would get missed.

Are any other Tholian Early Years restrictions addressed either in R4T or in the Master Starship Book?

A few years ago I asked (in the Rules Questions topic) what year the Tholians began to use Suicide Shuttles and Wild Weasels and whether or not these shuttles missions would be under EY-restrictions (given that the Tholians didn't have these technologies in their Home Galaxy).

SPP replied at the time but I no longer recall what his precise answer was and I don't know whether it was published in a Captain's Log. The issue wasn't addressed in the Module Y1 rules.

By Steve Petrick (Petrick) on Tuesday, January 26, 2021 - 03:04 pm: Edit

TRANSPORTER-BOMBS: The Tholians in the M81 Galaxy cannot purchase or use T-bombs. The Tholian Holdfast cannot purchase T-bombs as Commander’s Option items in the Milky Way Galaxy prior to Y88, and from that year until Y145 any such T-bombs operate under the Early Years rules (detection radius Range Zero, number any given ship can carry is reduced); see (YM3.0).

SUICIDE SHUTTLES AND WILD WEASELS: The Tholians in the M81 Galaxy cannot employ suicide shuttles, or use wild weasels. Suicide shuttles and wild weasels are available to the Tholian Holdfast from Y86, but these operate under the Early Years [(YJ2.11) and (YJ3.0)] restrictions (except for their faster speed) until Y121.
In the M81 Galaxy, when playing a monster scenario using table (S6.1) to randomly determine how to defeat the monster, if a result of "1" occurs the Tholian Will player may ignore the result and roll again. The unique dynamics of webs and web casters in the M81 Galaxy resulted the Tholian Will and its opposition never seeing the use of a suicide shuttle as a practical weapon.

By Steve Petrick (Petrick) on Tuesday, January 26, 2021 - 04:22 pm: Edit

Doublas Saldama:

If you have any other issues you can think of, ask away. I do not claim to be prefect and I may have forgotten something or missed something, but I tried to be as complete as possible.

By Jay Gustason (Jay20) on Tuesday, January 26, 2021 - 05:08 pm: Edit

What will the book cost

By Alan Trevor (Thyrm) on Wednesday, January 27, 2021 - 08:43 am: Edit

Dang! I stand corrected. I just checked Captain's Log 28 and both the Tholian BB and TK8 dreadnought are shown as "UNV" in the Annex 3 for that CL. I had felt certain they were "Impossible". Memory failing in my old age, I guess.

But I am surprised. The TK7 seems reasonable but the BB and TK8 seem "too good to be true". So I had assumed they were impossible, even if (for the TK8) the Tholians had managed to capture a C8 rear hull.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Wednesday, January 27, 2021 - 09:57 am: Edit

Is the Tholians of Draco article included in the Tholian Master Starship Book to be added to Module R4T, or would it be best to hold it in reserve until or unless a future product were to delve into the Draco-Tholian Enclave in more detail?

Speaking of which, I hope that this module will be successful enough to encourage a future Draco-themed product - not least if it were to include the survey ship Sojourner.

Plus, with the sheer amount of material for the home galaxy Tholians which the TMSSB provides to draw from, perhaps a future module exploring the M81 Galaxy as a functional setting in its own right could be that much closer to being viable?

By Alan Trevor (Thyrm) on Wednesday, January 27, 2021 - 11:14 am: Edit

OK, my faith is restored. Looking through Captain's Log 28 a little more (I hadn't looked through it closely for a long time), I find a sentence in the And Now for Something Completely Different... paragraph on page 1 that aeems to indicate all of the ships in that issue were "impossible to build". It's just as well since it's not just the Tholians who have ships in that issue that are too good to be true. There are a lot of ships that would have been built, I think, if it were possible to do so. But it seems they really were impossible even if the Annex 3 says "UNV".

By Jeff Anderson (Jga) on Wednesday, January 27, 2021 - 11:54 am: Edit

Quantum physicists talk about anything being possible (and with certain theories on multiple universes, there's a reality out there SOMEwhere where each possibility has occurred), so there really just might be Tholian Archaeo-Battleships and TK8 Dreadnoughts out there. Somewhere. They're just not in the mainline SFU Canon universe.

By Steven Zamboni (Szamboni) on Wednesday, January 27, 2021 - 01:13 pm: Edit

And in that universe, their battleships engineers are scoffing at the concept of "frigates".

"One-third move cost? You can't get a stable warp field on a ship that small!"

By Douglas Saldana (Dsal) on Wednesday, January 27, 2021 - 07:55 pm: Edit

R7.126 and R7.127 should probably have the same note that R7.4 does regarding use of disruptors prior to Y120.

By John Hall (Fedf111fan) on Tuesday, February 16, 2021 - 03:59 pm: Edit

Does R4t come out on thursday 2/18 still?

By Alex Chobot (Alendrel) on Tuesday, February 16, 2021 - 05:03 pm: Edit

*rereading Tholian MSSB* I really kind of want to sketch out some kind of (T0.0) or (U0.0) campaign for the Early Years Klingons vs Tholians.