Okay, here's a poll to help find out what we think the X2 photon ought to look like. The questions I've listed are pretty inclusive, but if there's something I'm missing, we can add it in. This is not the thread for arguing your personal view of the photon or why you want it the way you do. We can do that in the regular photon thread. All this is for is to collect the information, and see where we stand and if that will help us come to a compromise. Note that for answers of "other" you should describe what it is you want. I'll open the poll when we have some consensus on the questions. Once it's been closed, I'll post the results in the photon thread. Hell, I can even email the results, in that helps.

1. What should the X2 standard photon be?

1. 8 points
2. 10 points
3. 12 points
4. Other

1. 12 points
2. 15 points
3. 16 points
4. Other

1. 16 points
2. 20 points
3. 24 points
4. Other

1. None
2. No holding overloads over 16
3. Required even-arming of overloads over 16
4. Discharge time limit of 8 impulses for overloads over 16
5. Three turn arming for overloads over 16
6. "Cool down" period of 1 turn for any tube that fired a photon over 16

1. The standard table from X1
2. A table with slight changes to range brackets
3. A table with no changes to the range brackets, but improvements to hit
4. A table with both changes to the brackets and improvements to hit
5. A table based on 2-6 to help offset the effects of EW
6. Other

1. None
2. Better firing arcs (more than 120 degrees)
3. Different firing arcs (LF+L or RF+R instead of FA)
4. Downloaded photons
5. Enhanced proximity fuses
6. Proximity overloads
7. Something else

1. 4
2. 6
3. other

By michael john campbell (Michaelcampbell) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 08:42 am: Edit

1. What should the X2 standard photon be?
Other
8 through 12 as dial up.
Proxies would then be 4 through 6 ( rounding down )


2. What should the X2 fast load photon be limited to?
12 points
16 points
I'm moving more and more towards twelve to reinvigerate the two turn arming cycle of the Fed as a legitimate tactic.


3. What should the X2 full overloaded photon be limited to?
24 points
That'll basically balance it with the firepower of a six disruptor Klingon.


4. If overloads of over 16 are possible, what restrictions would you choose to place on having an overload that high, if any?
No holding or completing if more than 6 points of warop were jammed into it.


5. What table should the photon use?
The standard table from X1
Other
I suspect the Other is covered below.


6. What other improvements or changes would you like to see in a 2X photon?
Better firing arcs (more than 120 degrees)
Maybe
Downloaded photons
Varriable from 8-12 already makes that pretty well availinble
Enhanced proximity fuses
Something that's 3/4 damage for +12 to hit would be cool but with all the bonuses, probably not needed
Proximity overloads
Absolutely
Something else
The ability to switch from Prox to standard and back over just four impulses
Also the ability at the impulse of fire to choose 9-12 point warheads to fire in overload mode or standard.

7. How many photons should the X2 CA carry?
4
other
We might want to have three on the unrefitted Fed Cruiser to avoid killing Klingons too easily in the Trade Wars period.

By Jeremy Gray (Gray) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 12:31 pm: Edit

1. What should the X2 standard photon be?
12 points

2. What should the X2 fast load photon be limited to?
16 points

3. What should the X2 full overloaded photon be limited to?
24 points

4. If overloads of over 16 are possible, what restrictions would you choose to place on having an overload that high, if any?
None

5. What table should the photon use?
The standard table from X1

6. What other improvements or changes would you like to see in a 2X photon?
None

7. How many photons should the X2 CA carry?
4

Note, I'm basically looking for a Megaphoton (from J2) with a fast overload feature. I'm assuming that other EW enhancements of X2 ships will allow the Fed to improve the photons' accuracy.

By John Trauger (Vorlonagent) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 02:13 pm: Edit

1. What should the X2 standard photon be?

10 points with the option of an underloads of 8 or 9. (Good idea, MJC)


2. What should the X2 fast load photon be limited to?

12 points. I'm convinced there's a potential "followup volley" problem and would prefer to spice photons up with...


3. What should the X2 full overloaded photon be limited to?

20 points. I have become convinced that 24 is just too much.


4. If overloads of over 16 are possible, what restrictions would you choose to place on having an overload that high, if any?

No holding overloads over 16. An 8-impulse must-fire window becomes an advantage if it allows an "unholdbale" photon to hold past a turn break. We then have the problem of facing 20 point overloads AND heavily reinforced shields.


5. What table should the photon use?

The standard table from X1. I'm open to a slightly altered set of range brackets.


6. What other improvements or changes would you like to see in a 2X photon?

None


7. How many photons should the X2 CA carry?

4 for 205 definitely. Open to 6, but want a gameplay reason for such a change.

By Kenneth Jones (Kludge) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 02:13 pm: Edit

Jeremy the Mega Photon was in P6 IIRC. Not J2. Thats fighters/carriers.

By Kenneth Jones (Kludge) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 02:19 pm: Edit

1. What should the X2 standard photon be?

8 points I'm willing to be convinced for the 10pt. BUT I don't think it will fly with TPTB.

2. What should the X2 fast load photon be limited to?

15 points

3. What should the X2 full overloaded photon be limited to?


16 points
20 points CRITICAL

4. If overloads of over 16 are possible, what restrictions would you choose to place on having an overload that high, if any?

Discharge time limit of 8 impulses for overloads over 16

5. What table should the photon use?

The standard table from X1

6. What other improvements or changes would you like to see in a 2X photon?

None

7. How many photons should the X2 CA carry?

4

By Christopher E. Fant (Cfant) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 03:18 pm: Edit

1. What should the X2 standard photon be?

10 points

2. What should the X2 fast load photon be limited to?

16 points

3. What should the X2 full overloaded photon be limited to?

20 points

4. If overloads of over 16 are possible, what restrictions would you choose to place on having an overload that high, if any?

Other. Fire on the turn of arming.

5. What table should the photon use?

A table with no changes to the range brackets, but improvements to hit

6. What other improvements or changes would you like to see in a 2X photon?

None

7. How many photons should the X2 CA carry?

4

By Jeremy Gray (Gray) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 03:44 pm: Edit

Kenneth, you are correct. I was thumbing through J2 while responding to the poll. My mind is playing tricks on me.

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 04:20 pm: Edit

1. What should the X2 standard photon be?

10 points

2. What should the X2 fast load photon be limited to?

12 points

3. What should the X2 full overloaded photon be limited to?

20 points

4. If overloads of over 16 are possible, what restrictions would you choose to place on having an overload that high, if any?

No holding; must fire on turn arming is completed..

5. What table should the photon use?

Standard X1 table.

6. What other improvements or changes would you like to see in a 2X photon?

None

7. How many photons should the X2 CA carry?

4

By Tos Crawford (Tos) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 04:28 pm: Edit

1. What should the X2 standard photon be?

10 points

2. What should the X2 fast load photon be limited to?

12 points

3. What should the X2 full overloaded photon be limited to?

16 points

4. If overloads of over 16 are possible, what restrictions would you choose to place on having an overload that high, if any?

No holding overloads over 16

5. What table should the photon use?

A table with slight changes to range brackets

6. What other improvements or changes would you like to see in a 2X photon?

Better firing arcs (more than 120 degrees)
Enhanced proximity fuses
Proximity overloads

7. How many photons should the X2 CA carry?

4

By Aaron Gimblet (Marcus) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 08:18 pm: Edit

1. What should the X2 standard photon be?
12 Pts
2. What should the X2 fast load photon be limited to?
12 Points
3. What should the X2 full overloaded photon be limited to?
24 points
4. If overloads of over 16 are possible, what restrictions would you choose to place on having an overload that high, if any?
No Firing period of 1 turn for any tube that fired a photon over 16. Instability might also be nice.
5. What table should the photon use?
The standard table from X1
6. What other improvements or changes would you like to see in a 2X photon?
None
7. How many photons should the X2 CA carry?
4

By michael john campbell (Michaelcampbell) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 08:41 pm: Edit

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Quote:

10 points with the option of an underloads of 8 or 9. (Good idea, MJC)

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By Loren Knight (Loren) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 08:46 pm: Edit

1. What should the X2 standard photon be?

2:10 points

2. What should the X2 fast load photon be limited to?

1: 12 points

3. What should the X2 full overloaded photon be limited to?

2: 20 points

4. If overloads of over 16 are possible, what restrictions would you choose to place on having an overload that high, if any?

6: "Cool down" period of 1 turn for any tube that fired a photon over 16. Note: I'm switching to this vs. my must fire in 8 impulses restriction.

5. What table should the photon use?

6: Other. I like mine. It has a new range bracket for 9-10 that allows a proxi to hit 1-5. Also it has the extended range of 31-40 where a standard hit is 0 and a proxi is 1-2. A standard would have a chance it a -1 shift (or more) can be achieved. Otherwise I'm OK with the standard table from X1.

6. What other improvements or changes would you like to see in a 2X photon?

1: None

7. How many photons should the X2 CA carry?

1: 4.

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 08:53 pm: Edit

I have nine responses so far. A few more, and we'll close the poll. I have all the data arranged in Excell with each question put into pie chart form (including percentage and actual vote-count data labels), for easy viewing. It updates itself, so new data is easily entered and recorded.

Using this data it appears we should be able to make up two or three photon choices, and then playtest what we do have and see what comes up.

By Tos Crawford (Tos) on Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 11:03 pm: Edit

I'm OK with underloading. 8, 9 or 10 can still be a viable standard load unlimited range warhead.

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Friday, May 23, 2003 - 12:32 am: Edit

I never though we were ever talking not having the 8 point still. There should always be the 8 point for 2 + 2 power. I was proposing that the 10 point war head be given the same parameters as the 8 point standard. I.E. a muli-level standard.

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Friday, May 23, 2003 - 01:10 am: Edit

In fact, I wouldn't can loading an 8 Point photon "Downloading". 8, 9, or 10 are loading options of "Standard".
Possible cammands would be:
Standard, and Full Standard. The Nine point will probably be so rarely used that there is no real official command for it.

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Friday, May 23, 2003 - 09:16 am: Edit

Poll closed. Results have been posted in the photon thread.

By Ed Crutchfield (Librarian101) on Friday, May 23, 2003 - 09:57 am: Edit

Question 1
10 points. You can expect technology advances, additional damage is not excessive. 12 points might be excessive.

Question 2
12 points. 16 is to great, without limitations. Limitations mean changes and addenda to existing rules, it has a better chance of success with out haveing to modify and change existing rules. 12 points still gives you 24 points for each 2 turns. Maybe a power surcharge would be the way to go. Extra cost to arm or extra power to hold? That would add a penalty without changing existing rules.

Question 3
20 points. It is an improvement. 24 is probably to great again with out penalties. Again maybe too many rule changes to make it work.

Question 4
None if 20 or less. More than 20 then no holding.

Question 5
A table with slight changes to range brackets. The die roll advantage obtained through ECCMshould be enought of a die roll improvement to satisify any Fed(including me)

Question 6
None. Actually the photon works very good in its present modes.

Question 7
4 on a standard X2 cruiser is fine. If you start building larger ships then you have to reconsider. The combination of X2 photons and the improved phasers will be more than adaquate to deal with GW and most X1, Other X2 will be interesting to see.

By michael john campbell (Michaelcampbell) on Friday, May 23, 2003 - 10:08 am: Edit

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Quote:

A table with slight changes to range brackets. The die roll advantage obtained through ECCMshould be enought of a die roll improvement to satisify any Fed(including me)

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By Mark James Hugh Norman (Mnorman) on Friday, May 23, 2003 - 11:56 am: Edit

MJC: there is no such thing as JUST having a legendary officer. All the evidence I have seen suggests that outstanding crews are far more common than legendary officers. Anyway, X1 gives tha impression (I cannot remember if it is actually stated) that the oustanding crew geains no outanding crew abilities and all X-ship advantages are due to the technology, as the ships are so heavily automated. IIRC, the x-ship update makes no modification to this background.

By michael john campbell (Michaelcampbell) on Friday, May 23, 2003 - 08:41 pm: Edit

Read XD6.34 for yorself in the X corrections.

You'll see that it's not dependable enough for developing our BPVs upon.

Sure with 8 EW you might get a negative shift against a GW ship but not an X1 or X2.

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Friday, May 23, 2003 - 09:22 pm: Edit

Actually it is only unlikely but a negative shift against X1 and X2 is possible.

By michael john campbell (Michaelcampbell) on Friday, May 23, 2003 - 10:04 pm: Edit

Yeah.

By Andrew Harding (Warlock) on Saturday, May 24, 2003 - 12:33 am: Edit

1: 1, 8 point standard
2: 1, 12 point fastload
3: 1, 16 point overload
4: 1, none
5: 1, X1 photon table
6: 1, none
7: 2, 6