Aircraft hangar bays aren't sealed spaces/systems designed to accommodate destroyers that can be teleported in and out of them via technologies beyond the understanding of anyone else

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Monday, July 18, 2022 - 03:04 pm: Edit

This is something that came up over on the Prime Directive side of the BBS, but it is a fair question to ask: exactly how do Andromedan hangar bays work?

Are they designed to fit their satellite ships directly - albeit more "snugly" than, say, a Seltorian Hive or Nest Ship docks ships in their respective hangar bays?

Or, is it the case that Andromedan hangars are, to borrow a phrase from a different science fiction franchise, "bigger on the inside"?

In either case, it would appear that the mechanics - such as we can understand them - are such that converting a given bay from one configuration to another is no easy task.

In Star Fleet Battles, that is. Fortunately for the Andromedans over in Federation Commander, that game system is more flexible in terms of how an Andro player can fill a given Mothership's hangar bay space.

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Also, in terms of the orders of battle for Operation Unity, I might wonder if any definitive setup (should one ever exist) might have to wait until the Andro War module is written up for Federation and Empire.

As it happens, since there is no accounting for mine warfare in F&E, there likely won't be any minesweepers in that game system's version of the Unity OOBs...

By Jessica Orsini (Jessica_Orsini) on Tuesday, July 19, 2022 - 11:37 am: Edit

'Tis a mystery of the Andromedans, which is not spoken of with outsiders.

By Steven Zamboni (Szamboni) on Tuesday, July 19, 2022 - 01:22 pm: Edit

The first test set of Andro minis I made had the actual satellite ship minis inside, with gaps in the hull rings so the satships could be seen. (Painter's nightmare.)

I was originally favoring the idea that satships were just stored in the transporter buffer, but the fact that motherships need to be physically modified may mean there's something like an internal temporal elevator that allows satships to be placed "up on a the top shelf".

By Mike Erickson (Mike_Erickson) on Tuesday, July 19, 2022 - 01:39 pm: Edit

My person preference is this simply remains a mystery that the non-Andro empires can never really understand, although it certainly seems like such an "obvious" problem that could be "easily fixed."

Aside from just the space considerations, perhaps there are additional details pertaining to the way the Andro advanced technologies work that effectively require this satship packing rigidity?

And to the Andros, the limitations are obvious, natural, and accepted. To outsiders, its pure WTF?

--Mike

By John M. Williams (Jay) on Tuesday, July 19, 2022 - 08:49 pm: Edit

Though if you scootch one ship a little bit to the right, and you scootch the other ship a little bit to the left, it's amazing how much you can fit in a hanger (er...drydock)!

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/296322850466302493/

By Mike Erickson (Mike_Erickson) on Wednesday, July 20, 2022 - 09:39 am: Edit

You know the guy with the Battleship in the back is always the one who has to leave first.

--Mike

By Jeff Anderson (Jga) on Wednesday, July 20, 2022 - 10:56 am: Edit

All these questions about Andromedan hangars still makes me think of the captured Gorn gunboat in "Battle for Rimworld."

How does the incident with Slee, Chunk, and their friends impact this debate?

By Jessica Orsini (Jessica_Orsini) on Wednesday, July 20, 2022 - 02:26 pm: Edit

The After Action report in Captain's Log #29 discusses that a bit. Mind, (G19.45) expressly notes that there is no provision in the existing rules for transporting a non-Andromedan unit into the hangar; the fiction piece played a bit fast and loose with Andromedan transporters et al.

By Stewart Frazier (Frazikar3) on Wednesday, July 20, 2022 - 06:15 pm: Edit

It's a yes this happened but it's not going to happen under a player's control during a scenario ...

By A David Merritt (Adm) on Wednesday, July 20, 2022 - 08:03 pm: Edit

Although, it may not have happened as told in story, and tri-video....

By Jeff Anderson (Jga) on Wednesday, July 20, 2022 - 11:05 pm: Edit

(I can imagine a tri-video event an hour and a half long detailing the Captain of a starship in a realistic manner; he spends the whole time doing paperwork.)

(Ooh, riveting... )

In all seriousness, there've been lots of films done about historical events that have had elements that were definitely NOT part of real history, but the people behind them thought it made for a better story. This is something that will probably never change.

By Randy Green (Hollywood750) on Thursday, July 21, 2022 - 02:26 pm: Edit

Me: I'm human, I don't understand how this Andromedan technology works. It must work by magic.

Andromedan Robot Overlord: Back to the mine.

By Ginger McMurray (Gingermcmurray) on Monday, August 01, 2022 - 07:02 pm: Edit

The master ship chart for the Klingons says "see the B10 rules" for when they can see service early.

A) where are the B10 rules and,

B) more specifically, what's the earliest a B10A can appear and under what circumstances?

We're about to do a fleet battle and I want to know my options.

By Jessica Orsini (Jessica_Orsini) on Tuesday, August 02, 2022 - 07:45 am: Edit

The B10 rules are in (R3.17) in Advanced Missions; they are reprinted in the Klingon Master Starship Book.

By Ginger McMurray (Gingermcmurray) on Tuesday, August 02, 2022 - 09:09 am: Edit

R3.17 doesn't say anything about 2 decades, only one. Is there perhaps another rule somewhere which would allow for earlier B10s?

Nevermind, I found it. It's in the footnotes. The early versions are in campaigns.

By Marcel Trahan (Devilish6996) on Tuesday, August 02, 2022 - 12:22 pm: Edit

There was a posting from SPP about 2 years ago about B10's introduction dates

By Ginger McMurray (Gingermcmurray) on Tuesday, August 02, 2022 - 12:41 pm: Edit

Thanks, I found it. In any case I got the group to agree to Y195 and no X-ships so it's available regardless.

By Stewart Frazier (Frazikar3) on Tuesday, August 02, 2022 - 06:57 pm: Edit

According to the F&E ruleset, the earliest a B10 (and the B10A) could appear (starting in Y169) is Y172 (rolling nothing but sixes on a D6), on average one should appear in Y175, and if you're just that unlucky, it will take a lot longer (ie, the war is over before you finish it) ...

By Mike Erickson (Mike_Erickson) on Wednesday, August 03, 2022 - 08:38 am: Edit

If the Klingons forgo construction of a C8 in Y170S and Y171S and take two extra B10 die rolls in their place, AND all rolls are a 6, then the first B10 could be completed and in combat in Y171F (Turn 7).

If one was lucky enough to make this happen the B10 could theoretically then move operationally from the capital and attack one of the Fed BATS in 2008, 2010, or 2012 as part of the initial Klingon invasion of the Federation. I'm sure that would really brighten the Fed player's day...

--Mike

By Ken Kazinski (Kjkazinski) on Friday, August 12, 2022 - 06:28 pm: Edit

Ginger, see the Klingon Master Rulebook page 15. The escort tables start in Y169.

The year in service (YIS) is Y195 but annex 3 has a Y2 note. Also, if you look at the Advanced Missions 2014 SSD (pg 61) you will see in the Crawford box a YIS of 169.

By Stephen E Parrish (Steveparrish) on Sunday, August 14, 2022 - 05:42 pm: Edit

I have a question about Power Absorber Mines (M10). In section M10.214 it states that the effects of electronic warfare could cause placement of a PA mine to fail. I am uncertain how to apply this. Can the electronic warfare of the ship firing the plasma torpedo possibly cause the PA mine to miss, or does this only work with shps that can lend electronic warfare to other objects, or is it something else? I was flying a Gorn HBC against an Andromedan Exploiter, and he used the PA mines against my torps with devastating effect. I read the rule (D6.37), but I am not sure how to apply this either. Thanks.

By wayne douglas power (Wayne) on Sunday, August 14, 2022 - 06:15 pm: Edit

OEW or natural sources can effect the EW shift (D6.372 for procedure).

By Stephen E Parrish (Steveparrish) on Monday, August 15, 2022 - 11:45 am: Edit

Thanks.

By Fred Werenich (Phredator) on Monday, August 15, 2022 - 06:21 pm: Edit

EW question.

My understanding has always been that you allocate power to EW on ships during energy allocation and announce same simultaneously at start of turn. D6.32 confirms this.
eg. Fed CA speed 16, 3 ECM, 1 ECCM + 3ECM from ECM drone in flight. D7 speed 18, 2 ECM, 4 ECCM + 3ECM from ECM drones in flight.

During the turn any ship may elect to drop any portion of their EW for tactical reasons within limits. But to increase EW you must spend battery power (Andros have an exception on previously expended EW battery power).

Last game one player argued that in essence all EW on SHIPS were swing points which may be raised at will and need not be declared impulse 1.

I find no rule in 2012 rulebook to support his perspective. Was there such a rule at one time? Am I missing something?
Is my interpretation of the rules correct?