Hey Guys,

I like the early cloak strategy with the ORI, to avoid the turn 1 EPT, or just throw a wrench into the opponent's turn 1 plan. ... even with a HB heavy package, the ORI can still move good enough turn 1 to get into position for the turn 2 uncloak & attack run. Maybe you stay cloaked turn 2, but if that's the tactic you select, you gotta be REAL careful about when to uncloak.

The "plot 4-14 and WW the turn 1 EPT" plan ... sounds good, but not in the opening, only when the plasma ship is low on plasma and is counting on an EPT to make map room to re-arm, that's when it sucks to see a 4-14 plot. That's when I like to hold the plasma until I see the speed change. That exactly what did in the SEL today ... he parked and TACed until imp 11, but then changed speed to 8. He was able to WW the plasma launched late in the previous turn, but then I just held the plasma and got behind him and waited for the speed change ....

Any plan that requires a HET roll is ultimately risky. ORI and AND .... it seems just when you need to use the HET or displace, you can't rely on that tactic .... Vs the SEL, he HETed early, after turning in and seeing a launch of 50 pts ... and ultimately he had to HET again to get into FA. He made it (rolled a 1), and then he blasted me with 3xSC and 3xOL PC and hit with 2xSC, 3xOL PC, and he still had some phasers to fire too, but the combination of 50 pts reduced to 33 and then followed by phasers on the same shield was tough to resist.

Some of you guys ... you know who you are ... just love the risk of the rolls, like bolt everything at range 5 .... I guess it can pay off, but it can also really let you down.

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Friday, November 11, 2022 - 07:41 am: Edit

Heh, as Bolty McBolterson, I rarely actually alpha bolt, or even bolt S torps. I bolt F torps all the time (and would really love a Carronade refit...), but I generally only bolt S torps against Tholians ('cause there is a web about to solidify), in situations where hitting with the S bolt on a down/weak shield will really improve my position, or in situations where my opponent like, runs into a wall or decels when I'm coming in for an anchor, and I can bolt some torps, do some internals, and then get away scot free.

I'll rarely play for an alpha bolt situation in a game that otherwise seems rough (WYN, Orions, Romulans), but that doesn't happen that much.

By Seth Shimansky (Kingzila) on Friday, November 11, 2022 - 11:17 am: Edit

LOL I remember Baghdad BOB and his quote "It has been rumored that we have fired Scud missiles into Kuwait. I am here now to tell you, we do not have any scud missiles and I don't know why they were fired into Kuwait."

Bolty McBolterson quote "I rarely actually alpha bolt, or even bolt S torps"

I think you forgot who your audience is - we all have played you.

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Friday, November 11, 2022 - 12:11 pm: Edit

Really, I rarely alpha bolt (in so much as that means "play to get a centerline, 3-4 torp bolt shot"). As noted, I bolt F torps all the time; I'll occasionally bolt an S torp if it is, like, a game changer on a down shield. I can only think of a handful of games in decades of play where my main plan was "get a centerline bolt shot with all the torps".

I mean, sometimes things go badly, and I end up bolting a bunch of stuff at a stopped opponent when I wasn't planning on it, but that usually end up with me losing. So I try to avoid that.

By Geoffrey Clark (Spartan) on Friday, November 11, 2022 - 12:31 pm: Edit

Game 1.6 Report - RKR vs SEL

Turn 1 - RKR has a 16-21-28 speed plot with 10 in general, and holding S/G. SEL has a 24-17-28 plot. On imp 19, SEL changes speed to 17, RKR launches 2x30 and starts to slip out. SEL does not turn off, Imp 25 we are at range 8, RKR fires 4xph-1s yielding 8 pts to the #1, finds 5 reinforcement. SEL fires 4xph-3 at plasma B, and 4xph-1s and 4xOL PC at RKR, sees 9 reinforcement taking the #5 down to 11 pts. Imp 26 sees plasmas A&B land on the SEL's #1, one real one fake, doing 24 and taking the #1 down to 3 boxes. RKR follows up with real S+F, SEL fires 3xSC hitting with 2, taking the #5 down to 3 boxes, then 2xph-1s do 5 more, and hit an aft hull and Rwarp. SEL shortly does a HET away from plasma, and accelerates to 28.

Turn 2 - RKR plots 28-15, SEL plots 31-17-16, running from plasma. No real fire, as RKR is behind SEL and we don't get inside range 8.

Turn 3 - RKR plots 28-21, SEL plots 17, No real fire, as RKR is behind SEL, and with a weak #1, it is difficult to get RKR into FA.

Turn 4 - RKR plots 15-21-15, SEL plots 17-28. Imp 1 sees an EPT come out, and SEL runs it out to 30 points, takes 5 on each shield (#1 is reinforced). SEL is against the wall, and RKR is chasing from behind, uses reserve to stay at speed 21. Impulse 29, RKR launches S+F (S is fake), Impulse 31 there is a phaser exchange at range 4 which brings the RKR's #1 down by 13, and brings the SEL's #5 down to 2 boxes. Plasmas are at range 3 on 32.

Turn 5 - RKR plots 28-21-10, SEL plots 0-8-9. Impulse 1, SEL pops a WW and starts to tac around. RKR moves to stay behind while the WW is destroyed by the F, and the fake S is revealed. Impulse 7 SEL pre-emptively launches WW, and starts to tac the other way, as the RKR has come around to the other side. Impulse 8 or 9, SEL considers bringing the RKR into FA and firing on passive, RKR is about range 4-5. SEL decides to tac away and Impulse 11 changes speed to 8, voiding WW. RKR turns in behind, and gets to range 2, launches 50 pts. SEL fires all rear-facing phasers at plasma, taking 50 down to 33. Before plasma hits, SEL HETs again (rolls a 1) to bring the #2 to bear, and RKR turns to show the #2 as well, range 2. Plasma hits for 8 internals. SEL fires 3xSC, hits with 2, fires 3xOL PC, hits with all three, and fires 2xph-1s, RKR takes 42, and 7 internals. RKR fires phasers over three impulses, for 18, 8, and 3, followed by 5xHit&Run raids, which kill 1xph-1. RKR launches a fleet of four shuttles, which try to maneuver for weak shields.

SEL is down 3xPC, 1xSC, 2xph-1, 2xph-1, 4xbtty, and 9xPower

RKR is down 1xF, 2xph-3, 2xPower

Paul considers another turn, and decides to conceed. Great game, thanks!

By Seth Shimansky (Kingzila) on Friday, November 11, 2022 - 02:21 pm: Edit

Im just trying 2 b funny

By Andy Koch (Droid) on Friday, November 11, 2022 - 03:05 pm: Edit

I too, was Bolty McBolterson v the Andro.

By Jeff Guthridge (Jeff_Guthridge) on Friday, November 11, 2022 - 03:51 pm: Edit

Yeah, and RNGesus was with you too.

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Friday, November 11, 2022 - 04:22 pm: Edit

Seth wrote:
>>Im just trying 2 b funny"

Heh, like, I suspect that in games we have played, I probably bolt more than average, as we have played a lot of Gorn vs Romulan games, and those are always a total crap shoot. But in general, while I probably do bolt more than most folks, when I win games, they usually end with me tractoring someone and slamming them with a bunch of launched plasma.

Often when I find myself bolting S torps, it is generally 'cause I feel like I'm in a losing situation, and I'm willing to take the gamble of pulling the bolt trigger and if I hit, it'll give me a leg up, and if I miss, I'm just still losing. I evened up the finals of Platinum Hat one time (vs TKR) with a R10 bolt shot on a weak shield, and lucked out, hitting S+F for 22 plus some phasers on, like, a 2 box shield plus batteries, and that really evened things out. But I was behind at that point, and if I had missed, I would have been more behind.

But generally speaking, I rarely go into a game planning to bolt my S torps (again, unless I'm fighting a Tholian)--I'd much rather just hit folks with launched plasma :-)

By Andy Koch (Droid) on Monday, November 14, 2022 - 07:57 am: Edit

Peter you are forgetting the "launch-the-enveloper-and-follow-Andy-into-the-corner-and bolt-the S-F+phasers-on -a rear-shield-and HET-launch-the-other-F-and-Fire-two-more-phasers-into-the-hole" gambit.

By Andy Koch (Droid) on Monday, November 14, 2022 - 07:58 am: Edit

Jeff:
Yes. I got lucky, but otoh I am not super afraid of getting gutted by that Andro before I could do it again...

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Monday, November 14, 2022 - 09:07 am: Edit

Andy wrote:
>>Peter you are forgetting the "launch-the-enveloper-and-follow-Andy-into-the-corner-and bolt-the S-F+phasers-on -a rear-shield-and HET-launch-the-other-F-and-Fire-two-more-phasers-into-the-hole" gambit.>>

Heh. I never bolt the S in that game. I launch it to keep you running away.

So I was messing around with what happened in my WAX game, and figured out that if I had slipped or turned right instead of going forward when I ended up at R0 from the WAX, I would have been infinitely better off, landing some plasma, shooting through the hole, and had a fighting chance at that point.

The recriminations phase. It never ends!

By Geoffrey Clark (Spartan) on Tuesday, November 15, 2022 - 01:52 am: Edit

Hey Peter,

>> So I was messing around with what happened in my WAX game, and figured out that if I had slipped or turned right instead of going forward when I ended up at R0 from the WAX, I would have been infinitely better off, landing some plasma, shooting through the hole, and had a fighting chance at that point.

I'm glad you found some lessons learned in the GRN vs WAX match, I knew there way an alternate approach in there, even though I don't know the details.

>> The recriminations phase. It never ends!

Yes, it is one of the most important phases!

By Geoffrey Clark (Spartan) on Tuesday, November 15, 2022 - 02:38 am: Edit

Hey Peter, Seth,

Thanks for your discussion about bolting.

In the Masters 2021, it was my RKR vs Bill's Gorn. I could guess before the game began that his plan was to bolt, and so I made a plan to make him pay for it. You can see the write-up over there (I can't link to it ...), but basically he ran form the first volley (1 real, 1 fake), and then at the end of turn 2 I launched real S+F that he had to wade through to get his shot. He made a bit of a maneuver mistake, do I got the phasers in through the same shield ... and then, he ended up missing with 3 of 4 bolts. There is a bit of what-if discussion, what would happen if he hit, but it would have been pretty even at that point, even if I think the Rom would have been advantaged.

Seth already taught me in the Rom Civil War that some early bolts can be good for the mid-game. I think I'm averse to bolting, and I should look for the opportunity a bit more. In a situation where bolting and missing risks the whole match ... I don't like it.

By Jamey Johnston (Totino) on Tuesday, November 15, 2022 - 02:53 am: Edit

It also depends very heavily on your opponent. Someone who is very skilled against plasma can make it exceedingly difficult for you if you don't include bolting as part of your tool kit.

If you play lots of games against the same person, however, using certain strategies exceptionally rarely can make them pay off huge when you do use them, so there's that.

By Jack Taylor (Jtaylor) on Tuesday, November 15, 2022 - 09:51 am: Edit

Spartan (KR) vs MadJack (Lyran)

Scheduled for 4p eastern Wednesday 11/16

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Tuesday, November 15, 2022 - 09:52 am: Edit

Geof wrote:
>>I'm glad you found some lessons learned in the GRN vs WAX match, I knew there way an alternate approach in there, even though I don't know the details.>>

It was more of a "Huh. If I had thought the exact right thing at the exact right time, things could have gone better" situation. But thinking the exact right thing at the exact right time is often difficult to do.

As I noted at some point, one of the things that makes this fight hard for the Gorn (vs the WAX) as opposed to, say, the similarly armed Romulan is the turn modes--at speed 31, the Gorn and the WAX have to use secret-simultaneous move plotting, where the Romulan would get to react to the WAX's moves. So there is a lot of guessing involved, and often, guessing poorly gets you killed. If I had thought to myself "Huh. He is clearly going to turn in this impulse, so I should slip out" while we were plotting secret moves, I do better. But if I slip out and he *doesn't* turn in, I end up in a slightly worse position than where I was in the first place.

Oh, guessing games. You are such a pain.

By Geoffrey Clark (Spartan) on Wednesday, November 16, 2022 - 04:05 am: Edit

Totino wrote:
>> It also depends very heavily on your opponent. Someone who is very skilled against plasma can make it exceedingly difficult for you if you don't include bolting as part of your tool kit.

Yes, as they say, the opponent gets a vote. HETs can be a problem, and of course the 4-14 WW plot can be a pain, however, with 4xPlasma + 2xFakes, on a fixed map, it does not matter if it is Orion, WAX or Andro, at some point, with competent plasma ship play, the opponent will have to deal with launched plasma.

I might select to bolt, but I do not buy any argument that I'm ever "forced to bolt".

By Seth Shimansky (Kingzila) on Wednesday, November 16, 2022 - 07:34 am: Edit

When playing a Plasma ship early on bolting becomes more of an option because you want to hurt the other ship. It becomes very hard to run from plasma when you have no rear #4 shield or getting a chance to take some warp away. I like to play more towards Spartans tactics of launching. It can take up to 8-10 turns to get a plasma to hit after running from plasma & ww. If the other player is very good at avoiding the plasma then bolting becomes more of an option.

On the other side a PLasma ship is still very deadly when crippled and has 2 S torps.

A plasma ship is very deadly crippled if it has 2 S torps

By Peter Bakija (Bakija) on Wednesday, November 16, 2022 - 08:16 am: Edit

Geoff wrote:
>>on a fixed map, it does not matter if it is Orion, WAX or Andro, at some point, with competent plasma ship play, the opponent will have to deal with launched plasma.>>

I don't think this is an issue of competent play or not. Yes. You can make an Orion or WAX (I'm ignoring the Andro, as the current one is still generally hobbled) have to deal with launched plasma *eventually*, but, the trick is making them deal with launched plasma *before you are already too damaged for it to make a difference*, and both those ships are very good at mangling you early, when they still have all the options for getting around/avoiding plasma. If the Orion can HET around plasma twice at speed 31 and do 30 internals (which it often can), it doesn't really matter than you can hit it with a full enveloper in 3 turns.

By Jack Taylor (Jtaylor) on Sunday, November 20, 2022 - 06:39 pm: Edit

MadJack vs Spartan continuing tomorrow at 4p.

By Jack Taylor (Jtaylor) on Monday, November 21, 2022 - 06:26 pm: Edit

Deleted by author

By Jack Taylor (Jtaylor) on Monday, November 21, 2022 - 06:32 pm: Edit

Spartan over Madjack

I have decided to retire from SFB. Unfortunately it no longer makes my life better, I need to try something else. Good luck to everyone and especially Geof, I hope he wins the whole things. Warm regards to everyone. Jack signing off.

By Gregg Dieckhaus (Gdieck) on Monday, November 21, 2022 - 07:25 pm: Edit

Jack...
I hope you take a break and can come back stronger than ever.
If not enjoy your retirement.

Gregg

By Daniel Bitseff (Cadet_Stimpy) on Monday, November 21, 2022 - 08:27 pm: Edit

Any word on this?

2.1 BigSlowTarget ZIN Droid GRN

Also, I'm sure Jack will be back. This game can certainly be frustrating at times, but you always come back for more abuse.