SVC, the WWII bombers were in Stellar Shadows Journal 1.

B17, B24, and B25 were in that product.

I also have a printout of a B29 that I think was released online at some point.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Wednesday, October 25, 2023 - 11:52 pm: Edit

Qari (Missing):

Base Hull: BB, NCA, HDW, HCW, Heavy POL, POL.

Leaders: CCH, NCA, CW, CL, DW.

Fast: BBL, CW, NCA.

Carriers: BBV, SDS, CVA, SCS, BCV, BCS, CVD, ACS, DCS, NCA, CW, patrol carrier, scout carrier, CL, DW, DD, FF, POL.

Escorts: NCA, CL, DD, FF.

Commando: NCA, CL, DW, DD, FF.

Minesweeper: Cl, DW, DD, FF.

Scouts: NCA, CL, DD, FF. Survey ships.

PF Tenders: NCA, DW.

Transports: TG, NCA, CW, DW, FF, Pods.

Police Flagship.

Scud carriers: NCA, CL?.

Trans Mortars: CW?, CL? DW?, FF?.

Drone: CW?, CL?, DW, DD.

Generics: Starbase, Base Station, Monitor, Def Sat, Ground Bases.

Interceptors.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Sunday, October 29, 2023 - 01:13 pm: Edit

Triaxian (Missing):

Base Hull: BB, BCH, NCA, HDW, HCW, CL, DW, FF, Heavy POL, POL.

Leaders: CCH, NCA, CW, CL, DW, DD, FF.

Fast: BBL, DNL, CW, NCA.

Carriers: BBV, SDS, CVA, SCS, BCV, BCS, CVD, ACS, DCS, NCA, CW, patrol carrier, scout carrier, CL, DW, DD, FF, POL.

Escorts: NCA, CL, DW, FF.

Commando: NCA, CW, CL, DW, DD, FF.

Minesweeper: CW, CL, DW, DD, FF.

Scouts: NCA, CW, CL, DW, FF. Survey ships.

PF Tenders: NCA, CW, CL, DW.

Transports: TG, NCA, CW, DW, FF, Pods.

Police Flagship.

Generics: Starbase, Base Station, Monitor, Def Sat, Ground Bases.

Interceptors, Bombers, Heavy Bombers.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Sunday, October 29, 2023 - 01:14 pm: Edit

QARI: Add to Fast missing: DNL.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Thursday, November 02, 2023 - 06:16 pm: Edit

Sharkhunter (Missing):

Base Hull: BB, NCA, HDW, HCW, CL, DD, FF, Heavy POL, POL.

Leaders: CCH, NCA, CW, CL, DW, DD, FF.

Fast: BBL, DNL, CW, NCA.

Carriers: BBV, SDS, CVA, SCS, BCV, BCS, CVD, ACS, DCS, NCA, CW, patrol carrier, scout carrier, CL, DW, DD, FF, POL.

Escorts: NCA, CL, DD, FF.

Commando: NCA, CW, CL, DW, DD, FF.

Minesweeper: CW, CL, DW, DD, FF.

Scouts: NCA, CL, DW, DD, FF. Survey ships.

PF Tenders: NCA, CW, CL, DW.

Transports: TG, NCA, CW, DW, FF, Pods.

Police Flagship.

Generics: Starbase, Base Station, Monitor, Def Sat, Ground Bases.

Interceptors, Heavy Bombers.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Thursday, November 02, 2023 - 06:21 pm: Edit

Barbarian (Missing):

Base Hull: NCA, CW, DW, HDW, Heavy Pol, Pol.

Three Engine Hulls: BB, DN, BCH, NCA, CW, CL, DW, HDW, FF Heavy Pol, POL. (The three engine CA and DD were in SFT #10).

Fast: BB, DN, CA, NCA, CW. Tri-Engine versions?

Note: No variants listed due to option box nature of this empire.

Interceptors, PFs.

By Mike West (Mjwest) on Friday, November 03, 2023 - 11:10 am: Edit

On the Barbarian ships, I do not have SFT #10. Where the designs as stupidly obvious as they would seem? I.e. are they exactly the same ships but just with three engines instead of two?

So, for example, the CA would be box-for-box identical, except that there are three 10-box engines instead of two 15-box engines.

Is that correct?

If so, then it doesn't really matter if I have them or not, as recreating them isn't a big deal. Though, to be honest, I wouldn't really be worried about them.

Also, I will argue that the CL *is* the CW. What they need is an actual non-war CL. I'd have to look at the DD again to see whether it is at a full DW level or is really just a DD.

Also, for the record, I do have PFs for the Barbarians. I'm pretty happy with how they turned out. Don't know if they pass the Petrick test, but I don't see any real hang-ups for them.

I also have most of the CL variants using only option boxes. The big problem with making variants using only the option boxes is that all variants are non-combat. There is no such thing as a "strike carrier" or anything similar using this approach.

Finally, where is the Barbarian BB published? It isn't C4 or P6, my two sources for simulator ships.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Friday, November 03, 2023 - 11:16 am: Edit

The Barbarian battleship is in Captain's Log #43.

Also, there is a range of Early Years material for certain simulator empires in Captain's Log #42 and in the CL42 Supplemental File - which might also be of use in case any "National Guard/Local Defence" versions of said units ever needed to be made.

Other simulator SSDs to be found in various issues of Captain's Log are listed in this file.

By Mike West (Mjwest) on Friday, November 03, 2023 - 11:43 am: Edit

I know about the Early Years simulator ships because I made them. So I'm good on them.

Thank you for the reference for the Barbarian BB.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Friday, November 03, 2023 - 03:16 pm: Edit

Mike, you are correct about the 3-engine ships. They just divide the boxes into 3 engines. I feel they are wasteful but included them for completeness. I wouldn't want to see four-engine or single-engine variants either. I think the argument for the 3-engine was that was a common arrangement for many empires (Rom heavy and sparrowhawks, Lyran trimarans, half of the Hydrans, the Kzintis).

If you haven't seen it, this will be hlpful with the Canadi'ens. https://www.starfleetgames.com/federation/Commanders%20Circle/documents/playtest/Canadi'en_New_Ships.pdf

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Friday, November 03, 2023 - 03:32 pm: Edit

Flivver (Missing):

Base Hull: BB, BCH, NCA, HDW, HCW, CL, DD, Heavy POL, POL.

Leaders: CCH, CC, NCA, CW, CL, DW, DD, FF.

Fast: BBL, DN, CF, CW, NCA.

Carriers: BBV, SDS, CVA, SCS, BCV, BCS, CV, CVD, ACS, DCS, NCA, patrol carrier, scout carrier, CL, DW, DD, FF, POL.

Escorts: NCA, CL, DD, FF.

Commando: NCA, CW, CL, DD, FF.

Minesweeper: CW, CL, DD, FF.

Scouts: NCA, CW, CL, DD, FF. Survey ships.

PF Tenders: NCA, CW, DW.

Transports: TG, NCA, CW, DD, FF, Pods.

Police Flagship.

Generics: Starbase, Battle Station, Base Station, Monitor, Def Sat, Ground Bases.

Interceptors, PFs, Bombers, Heavy Fighters, Bombers, Heavy Bombers.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Friday, November 03, 2023 - 03:33 pm: Edit

Add to Sharkhunter missing: CC.

By Mike West (Mjwest) on Friday, November 03, 2023 - 05:37 pm: Edit

---

Quote:

If you haven't seen it, this will be hlpful with the Canadi'ens. https://www.starfleetgames.com/federation/Commanders%20Circle/documents/playtest/Canadi'en_New_Ships.pdf

---

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Friday, November 03, 2023 - 06:59 pm: Edit

I tried making a Canadi'en PF; it was very challenging to keep that outline.

Note that the Canadi'en FF is in the playtest material online as well.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Friday, November 03, 2023 - 07:26 pm: Edit

Deltan (Missing):

Base Hull: BB, BCH, NCA, HDW, HCW, CL, DD, Heavy POL, POL.

Leaders (all missing): CCH, CC, NCA, CW, CL, DW, DD, FF.

Fast (all missing): BBL, DN, CF, CW, NCA.

Carriers (all missing): BBV, SDS, CVA, SCS, BCV, BCS, CV, CVD, ACS, DCS, NCA, patrol carrier, scout carrier, CW, CL, DW, DD, FF, POL.

Escorts (all missing): NCA, CW, CL, DW, DD, FF.

Commando: NCA, CW, CL, DD, FF.

Minesweeper: CW, CL, DD, FF.

Scouts: NCA, CW, CL, DD, FF. Survey ships.

PF Tenders (all missing): NCA, CW, DW.

Transports: TG, NCA, CW, DD, FF, Pods.

Police Flagship.

Drone (The Deltans were given a drone DW in module P6): CA?, NCA? CW, CL, DD, FF.

Generics (all missing): Starbase, Battle Station, Base Station, Monitor, Def Sat, Ground Bases.

Interceptors, PFs, fighters, heavy fighters, Bombers, Heavy Fighters, Bombers, Heavy Bombers. All attrition units missing.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Friday, November 03, 2023 - 07:41 pm: Edit

Canadi'en (Missing; "*" indicates conversion data available):

Base Hull: BB, DN, BCH, NCA, HDW, HCW, CL*, DD*, Heavy POL, POL.

Leaders (all missing): CCH, CC, NCA, CW, CL, DW, DD, FF.

Fast (all missing): BBL, DN, CF, CW, NCA.

Carriers: BBV, SDS, CVA, SCS, BCV, BCS, CVD, ACS, DCS, NCA, patrol carrier, scout carrier, CL, DW, DD, FF, POL.

Escorts: NCA, CL, DD, FF.

Commando: NCA, CW, CL, DD*, FF.

Minesweeper: CW, CL, DD*, FF.

Scouts: NCA, CW, CL, DD*, FF. Survey ships.

PF Tenders (all missing): NCA, CW, DW.

Transports: TG, NCA, CW, DD*, FF, Pods.

Police Flagship.

Maulers: NCA.

Generics (all missing): Starbase, Battle Station, Base Station, Monitor, Def Sat, Ground Bases.

Interceptors*, PFs*, heavy fighters, Bombers, Heavy Fighters, Bombers, Heavy Bombers.

By Ken Kazinski (Kjkazinski) on Sunday, November 12, 2023 - 11:52 am: Edit

The B-29 was in CL31 Pg-26

By Mike West (Mjwest) on Wednesday, November 15, 2023 - 07:03 pm: Edit

Back on the Barbarians for a moment ...

For the base fleet, the items given are: NCA, CW, DW, HDW, Heavy Pol, Pol.

I agree on the HDW, Pol, and *maybe* the Heavy Pol. The CL is 100% a CW and the DD is 100% a DW. Basically, if you convert the Barbarian CL to use Fed tech, it kicks the NCL's butt. Same with the DD to the DW. Now, maybe you want a MY-CL and MY-DD, but they already have a CW and DW.

The problem I have with both the NCA and Heavy Pol is that they are "build-up" ships that just don't really work with the Barbarians. I mean, sure, we could do something, but the base hulls are good enough that it would just seem egregious.

So ... HDW, Pol, and fast ships (BB, DN, CA, CL).

(I also ignore flag ships, as, to me, they should have to "waste" an NWO for a flag to get one, not have a separate design.)

Once the two engine ships are all done, the three engine ships are just freebies. No reason to worry about listing them out separately.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Thursday, November 16, 2023 - 05:18 pm: Edit

I forgot the HCW for the Barbarians, but has the same points you mention about the NCA and heavy POL.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Thursday, November 16, 2023 - 05:22 pm: Edit

In hindsight it would have been better if all the C4 war cruisers and war destroyers were dual SSDs allowing them to be used as CLs and DDs by eliminating some boxes.

By Jeff Anderson (Jga) on Thursday, November 16, 2023 - 06:05 pm: Edit

I've seen carriers (and fighters) for a number of simulator races, but not all.

They may be out there, but Barbarian Carrier Groups? Deltan?

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Thursday, November 16, 2023 - 10:38 pm: Edit

Not for the above, Jeff. Not yet any way.

Mike: The problem with leaders is they also add shields and power, while upgrading existing weapons. The weapons can be handled by the option boxes, but they will be lacking compared to the leaders of other empires if they just use the base hull.

By Mike West (Mjwest) on Friday, November 17, 2023 - 09:53 am: Edit

Jeff,

Only the simulator empires with fighters are: Frax, Qari, Triaxian, Sharkhunter, and Canadi'en. None of the others have any. I'd argue the Barbarians don't need any as they'd just use the fighters of the empire they are representing. The rest have to be created.

Nick,

Fair point. Just trying to keep things under control. I can't promise you I will do that full list of ships, but I will work on the more important (e.g. NCA, as it is used for *everything*) and interesting ones. At least to start.

Looking at the existing Barbarians, I'd say the CA is meant to be a CA/CC hybrid, particularly since its weapons load is so similar to the BCH. So, I'm going to not worry about a CC. However, a CCH makes sense, and the SSD let's that happen.

... (edit) ...

OK, instead of working, I took a look at this because I became curious.

The DDL and FFL ended up being pretty easy. The FFL gets a second center OPT and another APR. The DDL gets two more forward OPT and two more APR. In both cases, this keeps them in line with their larger class, but gives them an improvement over the base hull. I'll see if either needs bigger shields, but that isn't a big problem either way.

The CCH is a little trickier. I give it two more FH phasers and two more APR. The phasers means it just matches the BCH (which is OK). The APR is more than the BCH, but it gets two more PO, so that is still in line with the bigger hull. I will probably bump the forward shields, too.

The CL is much harder. It is already so packed there isn't really room for anything. I have given it a flag box thus far, but am trying to figure out what else. It has the same weapons, same IMP, same APR, same BATT, and virtually the same shields. Fundamentally, it *is* already a CA, just with fewer secondary systems. (Honestly, this is an absolutely wonderful CW! It pretty much kicks the butt of virtually all other CWs. I love this ship.) I might just live with the flag box and matching the CA's shields and calling it a day.

By Steve Petrick (Petrick) on Friday, November 17, 2023 - 12:50 pm: Edit

The Gorn CC has a total of two flag boxes more than a Gorn CA/BC (Note, This is from memory). Different empires might not add weapons or power systems to a ship.

By Nick Samaras (Koogie) on Friday, November 17, 2023 - 08:25 pm: Edit

This is true for many command cruisers, but I can't think of any CWL/DWL/FFL that doesn't add more boxes of some kind to the base hull.

Mike: I agree with the CC should just convert NWO boxes to flag and call it a day.