It does have a lot of P-1s.

By Kenneth Jones (Kludge) on Saturday, March 06, 2004 - 01:35 pm: Edit

It is a big cruiser. BUT the total phaser power is comparable to a CX. The largest advantage is the various NWO boxes.

If you look closely you'll see this was Tos's XCM before I got to playing around with it. I'm still not completely happy with it, but it's closer to what I see as a Fed 2X cruiser. And I might want to make some rearrangements. But it does not have any sort of ASIF, Because I will need to type up my shield rule idea (maybe).

*Note: The NWO section is basically a bobtail/collar that hangs underneath the saucer. making it a CF/NCA/HDW/XShip hybrid.

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Tuesday, September 21, 2004 - 08:12 pm: Edit

Well, it's been awhile so I figured I'd stir the pot a bit. I did a little bit more tweaking and playing around, and have these latest versions of Fed X2 ships; an XCA, XCC, and XDD.

R2.?? Federation XCA
R2.?? Federation XDD
R2.?? Federation XCC

Fun stuff. As usual, the emphasis remains on flexibility over "more power". These are the Phaser-5 toting versions, as most people like them better.

A few notes:

• The XCA and XDD carry NWO boxes to increase flexibility and allow for some degree of customization for various missions. Cargo, lab, or hull would be most common.
• The XDD would be one of the most common X2 ships. To further increase it's flexibility, and to make it more capable of filling the plethora of different roles a DD often gets stuck with, it has two option mounts in addition to its NWO. These can only carry photons, G2X racks, or Plasma L's. Both mounts must be the same.
• All have somewhat less power than X1. Again, it's my thought that X2 is a return to more multi-purpose ships, where X1 was all about getting the most weapons and power on a hull and getting it into combat. As such, the XCA and XDD aren't quite as effective as their earlier versions, at least at combat.
• The XCC is the last X2 ship to be built, and the most powerful. It is meant to fight and command, and would be built or converted from XCA's sometime after the trade wars, presumably upon the arrival of the Xorkaliens.
• X2 photons have a base warhead of 10, a fastload of 12, and a max overload of 20. Further, the decision to fire standards or proximities need not be made during EA, but can instead be made at the point of firing.

By Tos Crawford (Tos) on Tuesday, September 21, 2004 - 08:48 pm: Edit

Nice work Mike.

By Joseph R Carlson (Jrc) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 12:55 am: Edit

Mike I like your SSD, which brings up a question in my mind.

Is the XCA and XBCH the same ship? Or is the XCA a continuation of the CA line and XBCH a larger SC3 ship? In R5 it indicates that the X version of the BCH is an X2 ship.

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 08:57 am: Edit

No, the XCA is a vanilla-model CA that returns to the basics. It is essentially an upgraded version of the plain old CA; a ship that does lots of things pretty well but isn't designed expressly for combat.

Now, if the need should arise, I do have an SSD for an XBC, but unless the Xorks turn out to be really bad ass, it won't be necessary. With 12 phaser-5's, 2 phaser-6's, 4 photons, 2 drone racks, 2 option mounts and a butt-load of power (42 warp, 6 AWR, 4 impulse, 18 battery points) and better shields than the XCA or XCC, it's a beast.

By Peter David Boddy (Pdboddy) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 09:04 am: Edit

Heh, since I've seen it quoted that when the Xorks arrived we'd wish we were fighting the Andros, I think you should post that XBC. :P

By Charles E. Leiserson, Jr. (Bester) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 10:30 am: Edit

Hey, Mike. Would it be alright with you if I posted a modification of one of your XCAs as an idea?

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 10:32 am: Edit

Fire away.

By Charles E. Leiserson, Jr. (Bester) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 11:38 am: Edit

One of Mike's designs from last year just seemed to fit perfectly with my view of X2, so I played around with it for awhile.

Here are the results: Variant 1 and Variant 2. The only real differences between my two versions are in the side phasers.

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 01:33 pm: Edit

Okay, you asked for it...

R3.?? Federation 2X Battlecruiser

Made as a post-Xork invasion ship to beat 'em back with. Very conjectural, as a possible ship should the Xorks turn out to be as bad as SVC is hinting. It is NOT a conversion of the XCC, but is a new ship. Just like the old BC was based on the CA but not a conversion, this is based on the XCC but is built from scratch. The option mounts are a way to make a very rare ship more flexible; like the XDD it is limited to photons, G2X racks, or Plasma L's.

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 01:58 pm: Edit

Actually I was thinking about the Xorks the other day and realized that SVC didn't really hint to how "bad" they are although they must be pretty powerful to have such a large enpire. What he actually said was that they were really "mean".

Now, clearly these guys are going to be designed to out match X1 so that's pretty powerful and they are going to beat down early X2 as well. But all he said was that they were really mean people.

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 02:30 pm: Edit

Somewhere, he said something about "wishing you were fighting Andros" in comparison...sounds pretty darn tough to me! Eh, it doesn't matter. The above is just an example.

By Peter David Boddy (Pdboddy) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 02:54 pm: Edit

Would have shock if it took photons?

By Alan Trevor (Thyrm) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 03:15 pm: Edit

How about if it could use both option mounts for one photon, with the extra space going for "bracing" to prevent shock? That would give the ship 5 2X photons with no restrictions on use.

(Actually, this derives from an idea I had for a "one-of-a-kind" variant of the BCJ, that replaced both the lower hull photons with a single photon, but removed all shock restrictions. I never actually suggested it because I decided it probably wasn't worth the loss of the 6th photon. But maybe it would be for the 2X Battlecruiser, if 6 photons wasn't an allowable option, even with shock.)

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 03:28 pm: Edit

Mike: My comment had nothing to do with your design, it was just an observation that I was reminded of.

I naturally assume that X2 will be comparatively more powerful that X1 and X1 fights Andros OK. So logic take me to the conclusion that the Xorks MUST be worse than the Andros since they will be facing X2 and clobering it (for a while anyway).

I also recall him saying the Xorks may have come here out of fear that if we were capable of defeating the Andros when they weren't then we are a threat to them. That was just one among a few posabilities he off handedly mentioned. IIRC.

By Joseph R Carlson (Jrc) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 03:35 pm: Edit

Mike and Loren,

My impression is that the Andos are vulnerable to direct fire weapons like photons(BCJ), once the PA panel-battery system is full damage occurs quickly. Whatever weapons the Xorks had may have produced a similar result.

The Xorks have been described as xenophobic and extremely aggressive. I picture them like a beehive that has been stirred up, they aggressively attack at close range (direct fire). Tough could be not just the size or a technical advanced ship but a number of ships that just overwhelm the defenses (sure this is all speculation).

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 03:37 pm: Edit

Loren, I know! Just making the point that it's all very speculative right now.

By Joseph R Carlson (Jrc) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 03:45 pm: Edit

Mike,

Does the XBC have an ASIF? What was your thinking behind the shield strength (no implied criticism just curious). Overall it is a nicely done ship.

By Alan Trevor (Thyrm) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 03:59 pm: Edit

Remember that, X-ships not withstanding, the Alpha races wouldn't have beaten the Andromedans if they hadn't discovered the secret of the RTN. Maybe the reason the Xorks were never able to defeat the Andros is that the Xorks never did discover the RTN in their portion of the galaxy.

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 04:01 pm: Edit

No SIF; regenerating shields instead. Never could find an ASIF I liked very much, so I went with that instead. As for strength, it was just an increase over the XCC of about 12%.

The really disturbing XBC I have is a Tholian one, which is essentially an XDN. The Tholian D is basicall the equivalent of anyone else's BCH, so for X2, that's what it is...a big darn XBC. Not a whole lot bigger, I guess, than this one. But it looks pretty scary, when you realize it's the same size as a DN but with X2 stuff on it.

By Alan Trevor (Thyrm) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 04:25 pm: Edit

The problem with an XBC based on the Tholian DPW is that it may be too strong. While the D-series ships are generally referred to as "the Tholian BCH", by the time you get to the full-up DPW you have something that is, in my opinion, actually stronger than a BCH, even if not quite a full Dreadnought. It's listed at 208 BPV but it "fights heavier" than that.

An XBC based on a DPW-type design just might put the Tholians in the very unusual position of having the most powerful ship in Alpha Sector (other than some possible Xork monster ship). I'm not sure whether that would be good or bad (someone has to be strongest), but it sure would be different.

By Loren Knight (Loren) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 04:32 pm: Edit

Mike: Indeed...

Ah gee, you didn't like my ASIF version? It's so simple and fitting of the basic logic that it was developed to preserve crew (and cargo).

Ah well.

BTW: I'll be getting a check to you ASAP.

By Mike Raper (Raperm) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 04:43 pm: Edit

Well, it isn't based on a DPW, but the vanilla D. It acutally isn't that horrible...no more warp than anyone else, and less phaser 5's. It's actually pretty cool looking, as I based the SSD on the revised DN's from CapLog. I'll post a pic later, and you'll see what I mean.

By Alan Trevor (Thyrm) on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 05:08 pm: Edit

Mike;

1) What, no phaser-x?

2) Even if it has phaser-5s, why on earth would it have fewer of them? The hull of the basic D is larger than standard BCH hulls, since it is in fact a small SC2 ship. What is that space being used for?

3) It's extremely unlikely (uhh... make that "inconceivable") that such a ship would not have web casters.

My own thoughts regarding a Xork-era Tholian XBC have been going in a different direction and are based on some 2X applications of web capability to keep the Tholians competitive with the larger XBCs of other races. I'll post some of my ideas if I can ever manage to convince myself that they might work.