Archive through June 01, 2016
Star Fleet Universe Discussion Board: Federation & Empire: F&E PRODUCTS: F&E Future Products (Near Term): F&E Civil Wars: Civil Wars: WYN cluster: Archive through June 01, 2016
By Ryan Opel (Ryan) on Sunday, May 29, 2016 - 04:33 pm: Edit

The DW and DF were captured during the Kzinti "Invasion" of Y182 and then converted to the ZDW and ZDF.

By Stewart Frazier (Frazikar2) on Sunday, May 29, 2016 - 10:34 pm: Edit

Chuck, was doing the base hull while looking through the WYN SSDs and just plain forgot about variants...

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Sunday, May 29, 2016 - 11:03 pm: Edit

I'll get the Klingon ones done Tuesday if no one has got to them by that point.

By Chuck Strong (Raider) on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 02:21 am: Edit

Remember that the rules prohibit police ships...

By Thomas Mathews (Turtle) on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 06:09 am: Edit

Thanks Ryan. Chuck I will post an updated table for the Kzintis tonight when I have a chance to sit down and find the correct references for the 2 units Ryan confirmed for me.

By Thomas Mathews (Turtle) on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 06:56 pm: Edit

Empire Ship Factors Wyn Designation SFB Product SFB Reference
Kzinti CL 6/3 None None None
Kzinti CLG 2-6G/1-3G None None None
Kzinti CLD 6 Sc Symbol <4>/3 None None None
Kzinti CVE* 6(3)/3(1.5) None None None
Kzinti CLE 4-6 Escort Symbol/2-3 Escort Symbol None None None
Kzinti DW 6/3 ZDW R6 39
Kzinti DWE 5-6 Escort Symbol/2-3 Escort Symbol None None None
Kzinti DWG 3-6G/2-3 None None None
Kzinti DWS 4-6 Sc Symbol/2-3 None None None
Kzinti DWV* 6(4)/3(2) None None None
Kzinti SDW 4-6 Sc Symbol <4>/2-3 None None None
Kzinti DD 6/3 None None None
Kzinti DDE 4-6 Escort Symbol/2-3 Escort Symbol None None None
Kzinti DDS 3-6 Sc Symbol/2-3 None None None
Kzinti DDV* 3-6(6)/1-3(3) None None None
Kzinti PFT* 2-6P Sc Symbol/0-3P None None None
Kzinti FFK 5/3 None None None
Kzinti FKE 4-5 Escort Symbol/3 Escort Symbol None None None
Kzinti FKX* 7/4 None None None
Kzinti FF 4/2 ZFF C1 4
Kzinti FFT 3-4U/1-2 None None None
Kzinti SF 2-4 Sc Symbol/0-2 None None None
Kzinti FFG 1-4G/0-2 None None None
Kzinti POL* 4/None None None None
Kzinti DF 4<4>/2 ZDF C3 30B
Kzinti FLG* 2-4G Sc Symbol/None None None None
Kzinti SDF 4<4> Sc Symbol/2 None None None
Kzinti EFF 2-4 Escort Symbol/1-2 Escort Symbol None None None
Kzinti FCR* 2-4(6) Escort Symbol/1-2 None None None
Kzinti PV* 2-4(3)/None None None None
Kzinti FDX* 6-7<4> Sc Symbol/3-4 Sc Symbol None None None


Note: Units with * after Ship Designation are not allowed to be sold to the WYN under (449.0).

Unknown Unit: WYN FZX: I am unable to determine if the ship was converted from a FKX or converted to an X-Ship from a Kzinti FF or WYN ZFF.

By Stewart Frazier (Frazikar2) on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 08:26 pm: Edit

Lyran/WYN sales chart -

LyrFF4/2LFFNANA
LyrFFE4#/2LFENANA
LyrFFT2-4U/1-2LFTNANA
LyrDD5/3LDDC1R12.3
LyrDDE5#/3LDENANA
LyrDDG3-5G/2-3LDGNANA
LyrSC2-5*/0-3LSC/LDSNANA
LyrDW6/3PBCR6R12.38
LyrDWE6#/3LWENANA
LyrDWG4-6G/2-3LWGNANA
LyrDWS4-6*/0-3LWSNANA
LyrDWT4-6U/2-3LWTNANA
LyrDWV^4-6(4)/2-3(2)LWVNANA
LyrCL6/3LCLNANA
LyrCLE6#/3LCENANA
LyrCLG2-6G/1-3LCGNANA
LyrCLS2-6*/1-3LCS?NANA
LyrCLV^5-6(4)/3(2)LCV?NANA


^The DWV and CLV cannot be sold due to their fighters

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 08:54 pm: Edit

Lyran HFF and HDD should probably be added to the list. I cannot off the top of my head remember if the WYN won't buy shock rating ships (such as the Kzinti FH).

From (449.22): ....Ships with shock cannot use their non-shock rating...

By Thomas Mathews (Turtle) on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 09:09 pm: Edit

The Kzinti FH is so new to the F&E game that I don't know if anyone has even thought about selling one to the WYN.

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 09:17 pm: Edit

I have, naturally.

By Dal Downing (Rambler) on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 09:20 pm: Edit

Should the CM and D5 be added one of the earlier Capt Logs had SSD for the PBB versions of these Ships ircc.

By Thomas Mathews (Turtle) on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 10:15 pm: Edit

The CM and D5 cannot be sold to the WYN under (449.22). No ship over 6 combat factors (attack or defense, including fighters or PFs) can be sold to the WYN.

The CM and D5 are 7 point ships. The PBB was converted from their Lyran DD. See the SFB ship description.

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Tuesday, May 31, 2016 - 01:34 pm: Edit

How does one do a table again? I've googled it with no success.

By Ryan Opel (Ryan) on Tuesday, May 31, 2016 - 01:48 pm: Edit

http://www.starfleetgames.com/discus/board-formatting.html#tables

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Tuesday, May 31, 2016 - 11:42 pm: Edit

The Kzinti FH is sellable to the WYN and should be on that table, even with the shock attack rating, it is not higher than a compot of 6.

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Wednesday, June 01, 2016 - 12:21 am: Edit

Existing WYN Variant SSD SFB Product Reference #
Empire Ship Factors WYN Designation SFB Product Reference #
WYN KE4 R3 R12.15 and R12.15A
Klingon F5W 6/3 None R6 R3.97
Klingon FWE 5-6/2-3 None J2 R3.113
Klingon F5L 6/3 None Advanced Missions R3.34A
Klingon F5 5/3 None Basic Set R3.6
Klingon F5J 4-5/2-3 None R3 R3.38
Klingon F5S 2-5/1-3 None Advanced Missions R3.20
Klingon F5T 2-5/1-3 None R11 R3.155
Klingon F5G 2-5/1-3 None M R3.90
Klingon F5E 4-5/2-3 None R3 R3.77
Klingon F5R (not sure if sellable) 2-5[6]/1-3 None R6 R3.94
Klingon E4 4/2 KE4 Basic Set R3.7
Klingon E4S 2-4/1-2 None R11 R3.153
Klingon E4T 1-4/0-2 None R11 R3.154
Klingon E4A 2-4/1-2 None J R3.25A
Klingon E4R (not sure if sellable) 1-4[6]/0-2 None J2 R3.115
Klingon E4G 1-4/0-1 None M R3.91
Klingon E4J 3-4/1-2 None R3 R3.39
Klingon E4X 6/3 None A33 CL#51

By Dal Downing (Rambler) on Wednesday, June 01, 2016 - 02:01 am: Edit

Richard for giggle's you might want to include the E5 class as well.

By Dal Downing (Rambler) on Wednesday, June 01, 2016 - 02:04 am: Edit

Are Klingon E3 considered Police Ships. I know the G2 is.

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Wednesday, June 01, 2016 - 02:34 am: Edit

The E5 is not in F&E.

E3s cannot be sold to the WYN.

By Dal Downing (Rambler) on Wednesday, June 01, 2016 - 04:24 am: Edit

And for completeishism the E6 is probably not in F&E either is it?

For my own knowledge where is the rule on selling E3 to the WYN?

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Wednesday, June 01, 2016 - 07:52 am: Edit

The E6 is not in Federation and Empire (you can check the SIT for such questions).

The rules for the E3 are in the new version of Fighter Operations.

By James Cain (Jcain) on Wednesday, June 01, 2016 - 09:50 am: Edit

The E4J is a police ship.

FEDS: Please cite your source.

By Dal Downing (Rambler) on Wednesday, June 01, 2016 - 06:08 pm: Edit

E4J was the Penal ship of the ISF until sufficient F5J could be proifixed per the ship description in Master Ship Book.

By Richard B. Eitzen (Rbeitzen) on Wednesday, June 01, 2016 - 06:19 pm: Edit

I don't know what 'proifixed' means.

I don't have the Klingon Master Ship Book, but module R3 says:

'(R3.39) E4J PENAL ESCORT (Misery Class): The smallest of the penal ships, the only one with an impulse-powered boom, and the only E4 variant able to separate its boom. The E4J was the penal ship of the internal Security Forces.'.

Klingon Internal Security Ships are listed separately.

I think it is possible that the E4J was used by both the fleet (prior to the general war) and the ISF. I think it is possible that all E4Js were sent to the ISF by the general war (and that the DSF was no longer producing any at that point).

However, if the DSF had any (for example, during the 4PW), and if WYN ship sales are allowed at all, I don't see any problem with this ship being used that way.

In any case I don't actually see anything declaring it an actual 'police' ship.

By Thomas Mathews (Turtle) on Wednesday, June 01, 2016 - 07:23 pm: Edit

(440.8) Klingon E4J: This is an early Klingon penal frigate. Each E4J lost must be replaced with another E4J using (528.0).

The Klingon E4I is a police ship. Module R8, R3.140.

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