The Feds can afford PDUs. They are using them in a similar way to what the Kzinti previously did with PGBs. We simply want to slow down the Klingons.

PGBs are more efficient for the purpose than are PDUs. But the Feds still have more money than they know what to do with.

To upgrade or not to upgrade is an interesting question. One planet can't upgrade as it has 3FFT instead of a real tug. One could only upgrade to a base station as it has engineers instead of a tug.

The other two planets have real tugs. They could upgrade. Risk is nonzero but probably lowish, depending on Klingon strats. One potential weakness is that he might reserve fleets into position to kill the upgrade.

But I'm not likely to want to do SB upgrades on turn A9. At that point, the Romulan front will obviously be a priority. So I don't want to have a bunch of ships defending an SB upgrade.

Therefore, yes, a BATS upgrade might happen. But it's not very important one way or the other.

The main thing is to be spending the Fed money in ways that help them defend.

By Ted Fay (Catwhoeatsphoto) on Wednesday, October 04, 2023 - 05:29 pm: Edit

CT8 is complete.

Redeployment of 60 ships to the northern Fed theater (1807) should put some pressure on the Feds, at the expense of taking some pressure off of the Kzintis.

2 full (but not so great) reserves at 1403 (1 Lyran and 1 Klingon). 1 Good Lyran reserve at 1407.

3 full Klingon reserves in the Southern FTO. (2 in 2715 and 1 in 2216).

1 full Lyran reserve (meh) in 617.

Pincount disparity is deeply concerning for so early in the game. I am at, rough and dirty, even parity in the HTO and ZTO.

In the FTO I only have an excess of 30 SEQ or so.

I do NOT count pickets in my counts. Add a dozen ships or so for pickets in each theater (maybe 20 in the FTO).

But to ONLY have a pincount disparity of +30 on CT8 is.... appalling to the Klingon Emperor.

By Paul Howard (Raven) on Thursday, October 05, 2023 - 02:30 am: Edit

Well, to put a small smile on the Emperor's face...

1) Kzinti probably can't afford a full production run
2) Hydrans have got 4 more turns before they can build a small number of ships (Ep limiting!).
3) Feds production is still ramping up

Coalitions should improve the gap on turn 10 - and will accelerate away on turn 11.... and will then build a simialr number from turn 12 when the Gorns join in?

Question is - can the Fed economy get broken prior to turn 15?

By Ted Fay (Catwhoeatsphoto) on Thursday, October 05, 2023 - 10:46 am: Edit

1) Kzinti did actually build a full production run this turn. They had 25 EP or so left over from last turn due to ComCon arrival, a last sale to the WYN, and 10 from the Feds.

2) Hydran navy almost completely repaired (but for what is in the depot). However, it is correct that they will have 3 more turns after this one before building more real ships, and then will be limited by EPs. So, they are suppressed, mostly.

3) True.

As I said, the game is not over. I also would not give up even if my position were worse.

Answer to your Q: Doubtfully. I just don't have the SEQ advantage to rapidly push the Feds to the core worlds. That means a long slow grind, which is good for the Alliance. Hence my original assessment.

By William Jockusch (Verybadcat) on Thursday, October 05, 2023 - 07:11 pm: Edit

Kzinti Economy, turn 8

From last turn 27.8EP, but also 34EP debt
Income 67.8 + 4diplo = 71.8EP
Interest 3.4
Repay debt 27
Available to spend 69.2

Construction
TGT 6
CVS 12
MEC, LTT, MSC 19
6FF 15
FFK 3
Barony fighter storage depot 6
POL 0
PT 0
Subtotal 61

Repairs 3EP
Conversion
Kzintai BC>SR 5EP

Total spent 69
Remaining 0.2

By William Jockusch (Verybadcat) on Thursday, October 05, 2023 - 07:23 pm: Edit

Federation economy, turn 8

From last turn 3EP
Income 196+5diplo=201
Available 204

Builds
CVA 18 (FFF)
LSC 10
2DE 14
TG 6
3NCL 15
2FFE 8
FCR 10
Activations 8
MB 10
Fighter storage depot 6
Monitor 8
PDU 7
PRD (2306) 3
PDU(2306, ENG) 3
3PDU (2509, 2610, 3210) 24
2POL 0
2PT 0
2SWAC 3
Subtotal 153

Various repairs 17

Conversions
Earth 2x(CL>LSC) 8
Earth CA>CAD 3
6th DN>DN+ 2
5th CA>CC 2
4th DD>DE 1
Subtotal 16

Remaining 18

By William Jockusch (Verybadcat) on Thursday, October 05, 2023 - 07:33 pm: Edit

The Kzinti studiously ignored their long-term economic situation on turns 1-7 as they were under heavy military pressure.

With the Coalition switch in focus to the Federation, the Kzinti are making economic investments. They repaid most of their debt, converted a survey ship (their fourth), and, though it is not shown above, are ramping up WYN trade, with 6EP sent and received this turn.

Meanwhile, the Federation is doing everything possible to defend itself. A continued buildup of Coalition pressure is likely, and they will need every unit they can get. I find myself wondering if it was an error to not spend 8EP more on another PDU somewhere. But I don't feel we can really defend 2106, and other planets are currently out of range of the Klingons. So I'm not sure.

By Mike Erickson (Mike_Erickson) on Thursday, October 05, 2023 - 10:12 pm: Edit

>> I also would not give up even if my position were worse.

The heart of a true warrior.

--Mike

By William Jockusch (Verybadcat) on Friday, October 06, 2023 - 06:30 pm: Edit

Fed and Kzinti op move for turn 8 is done. The Kzinti are attempting to retake minor planets 1902, 1105, 1001, and 1202. They are attacking Klingon-held planet 1506, trying to kill the Klingon BATS in 1307, and trying to take Klingon planet 1407. The Coalition have two reserves that could go to any of the battles.

The Feds have a 62SE attack on Klingon BATS 1807, which they would obviously like to delete.

The Feds and Kzinti each also have a battle where they are likely to kill a province raider.

By Gary Quick (Northquick) on Saturday, October 07, 2023 - 02:16 am: Edit

Hydran Turn 8

Income: 26 (+5 Treasury, +9 carryover)
Builds(15): Main Shipyard 3/6, misy-conversion(eng)
Repairs(18): DNL, THR, HR, TR, DE, LNG, 5xCU, PGS, SC
Convert(5): 2xKN > 2xDDS

As currently stands, the Hydran fleet will be fully repaired next turn (including depot ships). The new shipyard is halfway complete.
The next task is to decide the direction for the Hydran fleet other than defense of the final on-map SB in 0215. Hydrans would like to get in an stop the emplacement of MB>BATS over Hydrax, but lack enough SE to get into the hex.

By Paul Howard (Raven) on Saturday, October 07, 2023 - 03:59 am: Edit

Where the KN's crippled or was 'expensive' conversions done on uncrppled KN's?

With the Hydran Fleet repaired nearly..... things might start to get interesting for the Hydran Front - although I don't think they have many Carrier Groups, so counter attacks may be expensive in losing the Crusiers?

By William Jockusch (Verybadcat) on Sunday, October 08, 2023 - 11:39 pm: Edit

The 1807 battle turned into a crip-fest of a type that Paul is familiar with. Feds lost 2SC, CMC and a SWAC. They did kill the BATS on approximately round 5. After that, neither side wanted to retreat and subject itself to a pursuit. The battle ended up going about 15 rounds. The Feds got a good roll in the pursuit battle, allowing them to kill a CVT group. Ted thinks I was lucky to win the hex.

This led the Feds to spend 11EP on field repairs. They will repair quite a lot next turn as they have in range SB, FRD, PRD, 2 BATS, and will get some repair help from the Marquis SB. Even with the field repairs and the large repair capacity, they will still be at least 14.5EP short of repairing everything on turn 9.

The Klingons have a 40-odd ship crip fleet. On C9, they should be able to get a lot of it to repair points with sufficient capacity. Maybe even all. Maybe.

By Gary Quick (Northquick) on Monday, October 09, 2023 - 05:51 pm: Edit

Paul,

It was two crippled KNs into the new DDSs

You're right in that we are lacking carriers (well, 2 TGV groups), so the challenge is to find appropriate targets given the cruiser risk. AT8 we opted for gimme targets only - we'll see next turn.

By William Jockusch (Verybadcat) on Saturday, October 14, 2023 - 03:25 pm: Edit

On C9, the Marquis SB fell in a 10-round battle. I rolled quite well. I had been hoping to get to a point where I could just let the damage fall. That didn't happen as there were too many targets that cried out for dirdam. On the bright side, we killed 15 hulls at the SB, including two carrier groups and four various DN hulls.

For his part, Ted went on a campaign to cut into my large supply of high-EW scouts. He succeeded in that, with a total of 6 scouts killed in the turn, or 7 if one counts the SAD. Both F and Z will need to build scouts next turn.

By Ted Fay (Catwhoeatsphoto) on Sunday, October 15, 2023 - 07:06 pm: Edit

By "rolling well" he means the 1st 5 rounds went 4, 6, 6, 6, 6.

Alliance rolls:
4
6
6
6
6
2
3
3
4
4

Average = 4.4

Coalition rolls:
6
4
2
4
3
1
2
2
4
5

Average = 3.3

By William Jockusch (Verybadcat) on Monday, October 16, 2023 - 04:33 pm: Edit

Yeah, they started off at the "insane" level then fell to merely the "very good" level. Plus 1.5 standard deviations.

By William Jockusch (Verybadcat) on Tuesday, October 17, 2023 - 08:32 pm: Edit

Kzinti economy, turn 9

From last turn 5.7EP, but also 7EP debt
Survey roll (2D6) 93+9+2(PT) = 104
HRS found a colony!
Income 72.8+4diplo=76.8
Interest 0.7
Borrow 4
Available 86.8

Repairs
Barony 3FF 3

Conversions
Barony 3ERR 1.5 (CDR)

Builds
2CVS 24 (using 12 FFF)
MEC 6
MSC 8
LTT 5
FFK 3
7FF 17.5
Kzintai 3PGB 9 (total 8PDU, 10PGB)
Barony FSD 6
Barony Survey slot 3
POL 0
PT 0
Subtotal 81.5

Total spent 86
Remaining 0.8

By William Jockusch (Verybadcat) on Tuesday, October 17, 2023 - 08:46 pm: Edit

Federation economy, turn 9

Survey 53+20+2=75 (7D6, PT)
From last turn 9.8
Income 192+5diplo=197
Available 207.8

Repairs 41

Conversions (all are CDR)
Earth 2LSC 6
Near Earth DN+ 1
Near Earth DE 0.5
Near Earth FCR 6.5
2nd CAD 2
4th DN+ 2
4th FFE 0.5
5th CVS 13 (all ftr paid)
Subtotal 30.5

Builds and activations:
Activations 8
DN 12
CFS 12
6NCL 30
6FF 18
2509, 2610, 3210 3PDU 24
2306 PDU (ENG) 3
Earth PRD 3
Earth FSD 6
2SWAC 3
POL 0
POV 3
Subtotal 122

Spent 193.5
Remaining 14.3
After econ, ComCon arrives, bringing Feds to 24.3EP.

By Gary Quick (Northquick) on Wednesday, October 18, 2023 - 05:57 pm: Edit

Hydrans continue building new Main Shipyard. Expensive, but it's really green and shiny!
Converted their first LNH-E.
All cripples are repaired or awaiting depot next turn. (LN, HN)

Coalition forces still out-SEQ the Hydrans, preventing target disruption of BATS over Hydrax.

By Stewart Frazier (Frazikar3) on Wednesday, October 18, 2023 - 06:32 pm: Edit

Hmmm, Kzinti math is slightly off

5.7 + 76.8 - 0.7 = 81.8 + 4 = 85.8 (86.8 shown)

Fed's also off by an EP

9.8 + 197 = 206.8 (207.8 shown)

By William Jockusch (Verybadcat) on Wednesday, October 18, 2023 - 07:17 pm: Edit

Yeah, spreadsheet has it correct though. Errors in bringing it from there to here. F and Z each scrapped a captured ship for the last EP.

By Paul Howard (Raven) on Thursday, October 19, 2023 - 02:18 am: Edit

So no Fed MB being upgraded to a BATS?

How does the Fed position look at the end of tyrn 9?

Thanks

Paul

By Ted Fay (Catwhoeatsphoto) on Thursday, October 19, 2023 - 12:32 pm: Edit

Fed position is extremely strong. Highly unlikely I can do much, except on the Rom front.

By William Jockusch (Verybadcat) on Thursday, October 19, 2023 - 09:21 pm: Edit

Feds aren't doing any base upgrades on A9 because they are too long-term! Anything we do needs to have immediate benefits, i.e. by C10.

We pulled a lot of forces from the Klingon front in order to prepare for the Romulan invasion. One result is that our forward planets don't have full fleets. Another is that our reserves are smallish. Both fronts feel a little thin. We do have a pretty good network of potential reaction movement. We'll see if it's enough.

We also sent a few quality ships to the Kzinti as they may be hard-pressed to defend their side planets this turn. The forces that killed the Marquis SB mostly retroed to the Coalition double SB at 1403. All crips will be repaired on Ted's turn, while the Kzinti crips from that battle are still crippled. So that could get exciting.

By William Jockusch (Verybadcat) on Wednesday, November 29, 2023 - 11:12 pm: Edit

Turn 10 F/Z economy:

I've decided to switch to a more summarized style for builds, at least for now.

Kzinti:
Available 86EP from all sources. But they need to do a lot of repairing. They end up skipping most of their builds to increase repair capacity. They add 11EP of debt and do 38.5EP of repairs. The only ship builds are CVA, MSC, and TGT. They do convert a survey ship (their fifth) and rebuild their engineers, who were killed in 1502 several turns ago.

Feds:
Available 202EP from all sources. This would be enough to do nearly all of their builds, repairs, and conversions, skipping only 1-2 of the overpriced escorts. But instead they choose to skip all 3 said escorts and borrow 27EP so they can build nine various PDU/PGB on side planets.