Archive through June 19, 2024
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Archive through June 19, 2024
A2 was brutal for the Kzinti. The crippled ships from 1304 went to 1504 where they were joined by a dozen ships from 1401. But both Klingon reserves went there, and managed to kill CVL CLE EFF FCR in pursuit!
There was also a pinning action in 1402, but it didn't amount to much, unsurprisingly.
Ouch
The loss of a CVL and FCR is a tad more painful!!
Was the whole group already crippled and VBIR went up and the Coalition rolled very well - or a Mauler used and a good roll got?
(I am guessing the latter, as 60 compot would need 37.5% to get to the minimum 22 (23) and 40% would needed if 2 points was owed - not impossihle both VBIR and a 5 or 6 for the Coalition is needed at the lower end!!!)
It was a little of both, but mainly Sam had two maulers in the reserves that went there from last turns construction. As it was the battle was an attempt to evacuate the cripples home from the Dukes SB on the coalition turn. Sam pointed out that I had a spare BC that I should have put as an ad-hoc escort that might have at least saved the CVL. I was mainly concerned about the crippled DN the Kzinti had on the line and wasn't paying close enough attention. Ah well, can't have everything I suppose.
My initial plan was to strike the (relatively) exposed FRD park in 1307 (it was defended by the two Klingon reserves and out of reach for thr Lyran reserves) but there was one reaction possibility that would have created a battle bringing in the Lyrans and threatening to cut off supply. Decided it wasnt worth it, ended up having basically the same battle but over 1504 instead. Plus the Kzinti paid dearly in that battle (see above) so it was probably good that I didn't stick to thr original plan.
CT3 is underway. Coalition tightening the noose a little more this turn; main focus of attack was Count's SB (which has already fallen, the modest fleet mostly escaped, the Lyrans lost a DN and CC, which are a dime a dozen for them but at least the CC was captured. Also some fights to presumably cut-off access to western Kzinti territory (1001 and 1202 mainly) but a reserve fleet sent to 1202 saved at least the inner core of Kzinti space. There is another siege of Kzintai, we'll see how that goes. I'm not sure if it was just a covering force to prevent reaction out (1502 is also under attack) or if it is a serious attack. I don't think there is the density there to actually take Kzintai, but certainly enough to do some real damage. On the other hand, the Hydrans are joining this turn so I can't imagine he'd be willing to cripple the whole fleet. I guess we'll see what happens.
I wouldn't say that the main focus of the attack was 0902 - essentially all of the uncrippled Klingons are in 1401 (aside from the dozen or so dealing with 1502 and 1805). The Lyrans tried to kill Kzinti ships this turn, though I might have miscalculated the force necessary to take the SB (I had cripples on the line for a few rounds). But there were 9 Lyrans in 1001, which the Kzinti had to retreat over because I hadn't captured it yet. That got me my pursuit battle, but the only ships killed were ff ffk.
Kzintai definitely isn't falling this turn. But with 106 Coalition SEQ in 1401, something is going to happen.
Ah now I remember most of the Lyran ships were not in range of 1401, so it would make sense to go after the Count's SB. There was also that shuffle around planets 1001 and 1202, results of which was unexpected for both of us.
Hopefully the Klingons bore of throwing their ships in the meat grinder at 1401 and notice the lightly defended Marquis starbase...
What Karl didn't expect was that I wasn't really in 1401 for the planets. Nine rounds of essentially open-space combat where I directed a cruiser nearly every round in exchange for cripples. Just the one major devastated.
When you kill a whole bunch of ships, you get better chances for captures - which is why I've captured another cruiser. A BC this time.
The damage in 1401 this turn:
Kzinti dead: 4PDU(Keevarsh) 4PDU(Kzintai) 2PDU(Kuballus) 2CC 4BC CV MEC DD EFF LAD SAD
Kzinti cripples: TGC (2EP)
Klingon dead: TGA+DP+BP
Klingon cripples: D6M D7 D6J 15D5 5F5L 12F5 (49EP)
Lyran cripples: 5CW 2DD FF (10.5EP)
Also notable is drone bombardment - the Klingons used 6EP and the Kzinti used 7.6EP. While Kzinti salvage easily covers that, it's still quite a bit of money spent.
All told, I think that's a fairly favourable trade for the Coalition.
The rest of the crippled ships adds up to about 66.5EP for the Klingons and 50EP for the Lyrans.
Retrogrades etc. happening now.
Bloody, bloody fall of Y169.
Most of the action was over 1401 as expected. Oddly, only one planet is devastated (Vronkett) as Sam preferred to direct on whatever cruiser hull was exposed. In a rare moment, he was able to get enough to direct a CV group outright (the outer escort had been destroyed the round before and I left it on the line as the odds were so low of this happening.) Lyrans captured a Kzinti BC and Kzinti captured a Lyran CC.
Here are the gory details for CT3:
Z dead: (2 bases, 10 PDU, 10 Ships, 1 capture, 3 Auxes)
SB, BATS, 10PDU, 2CC, 3BC(1 captured), CV, MEC, EFF, DD, FFK, FF, LAD, SAD, SAV
Z wounded: (6 ships) BT, BC, CLE, FFK, FF, MON
K dead: (4 Ships) BT, 2D6M, F5L
K wounded: (48 ships) 3D7, D6M, D6J, 16D5, 4F5L, 19F5, E4, 3E4A
L dead: (2 ships) DN, CC(captured)
L wounded: (19 ships) 7CW, 5DW, 3CL, 2DD, 2FF
Hydrans are joining next turn, which will be a welcome distraction.
I also realized too late how much the Kzinti were spending on drone bombardment (about 14EPs, even with the LAD)...could've purchased a few PDUs with that money. On the other hand, more PDUs might be dead if dbb wasn't used so maybe its a draw.
Ouch - a third Kzinti Carrier by the end of the Coalition turn 3 dying.
It's rare to see a CVL or CV die (outside of an Alliance assault on a Coalition hard point) - so the loss of a CVE, CVL and CV is pretty unusual.
Ateast the Captures on iether side seem to be fairly even on numbers (accepting if one side directs more often, they should get more captures but persuits should help balance that out).
On paying for Drone v not using it and building more PDU's - you pay your money and you take your chance.
That Drone bomnbardment might get you to a key damage level (28 or 30 for example) ....whereas a PDU might never be used in combat!
Honest answer - is you do both!!
(In my last game with William, we often only paid for a couple of points of drone to get to a key compot level - 25% at 109 is only 27 damage... whereas 110@25% get you 28!!)
Retrogrades & strat are done. The new builds went south, as did essentially all of the free-strat eligible ships. There are four small reserves of a cruiser and a frigate each in the north - otherwise, nearly all of the uncrippled Klingons and Lyrans are guarding the FRD park in 1307 (it's now got 6 FRDs - 5 Lyran and 1 Klingon). Pincount is really close - one or two Kzinti ships might be able to make it through to 1307, but probably not much more than that.
Large reserves are in 0413, 1212, and 1716. All told, 54 Lyrans and 64 Klingons are in range of 0617.
Losses of Kzinti carriers are not a trend I want to continue, but they were lost in 3 different ways that hopefully won't be repeated. The CVE was put on the line in a regular fleet battle with it's one escort. I thought there were much better targets to direct on so it would be safe, but obviously I was mistaken. The CVL loss was on me; in pursuit I did have an option to put the non-crippled BC in as an ad-hoc escort and at least save the carrier. But that didn't happen either.
The CV loss was the real surprise. The prior turn the outer escort had been destroyed but I left the group on the line to fill out the 3 squadrons. Since Sam was directing on single hulls (instead of PDUs) left and right I didn't want to give him any real targets. I didn't honestly think that the carrier group was in that much danger, but then he had a mauler on the line...and the VBIR rolled up by 2...and Sam rolled exactly enough to maul the entire group. So here we are.
Really though, I think every once and awhile it should be possible to break through and kill carriers, it is very difficult to do in this game but shouldn't be *impossible.* Anyway lesson learned, I need to be more careful with the Kzintis, particularly when Sam is doing unorthodox things like mauling hulls over the capital instead of PDUs.
Anyway it looks like all the coalition builds and reserves have shifted to the Hydran front, enough to give the Kzinti a slight pincount edge as Sam has pointed out. Both Lyran and Klingon reserves on the front are very weak so there are lots of options.
AT3 Y169 Fall
Kzinti Econ
Survey: 24 + 3 + 1 + 3 + 2 (3 survey ships + PT) = 33
2.375 Existing treasury
13 On Map (2 minors, 5 provinces (3 disrupted))
19 Off Map (1 Major, 2 Minors, 3+1 Provinces)
29 Capital (4 Majors (1dev), 4 Minors) Vronkett recovery ¼
Income: 61EP
63.375 New Treasury
Prior turn accounting
DBB AT1: 12 (1.2EP)
DBB CT1: 0902 20 (2EP) 1401 48 (4.8EP)
Total DBB: 8EP
Salvage AT1: EFF(0.625) = 0.625
Salvage CT3: BC(2), SAV(0.5), CC(2.25), BC(2), SAD(0.5), CC(2.25), DD(1.5), CV(2.5), MEC(1.25), EFF(0.625), LAD(1)) = 16.375
Total salvage: 17EP
EPs recieved from allies: 0
Other income: 0
Total: 72.375 EP
Y169 annual FFF: 12-7.5=4.5
Production:
Standard production (69)
12+3 CV (4.5FFF)
6 MEC
4 FKE sub EFF
8 TGC sub BC
5 2FF sub CL
6 MEC sub CM
5 CM
3 FFK sub FF
3.5 SF sub FF
7.5 3FF
0 Free PT
6 2PGB
Conversions (1)
0 ENG upgrade BS to BATS
Repairs (2.5)
(OM) - DNL
0 no E/S Raid
Total:
72.375 - 71.5 = 0.875 EP remaining
Command Points: 2+1=3
FFF: Y169 12 - (7.5 spring) - (4.5 fall) = 0 remain Y169
AT3 Y169 Fall
Hydran Econ
Survey: 0+7=0
0 Existing treasury
30 On Map (1 major, 1 minor, 11 provinces)
17 Off Map (2 Majors, 1 Minor, 2 Provinces)
24 Capital (3 Majors, 3 Minors)
74 New Treasury
Prior turn accounting
Salvage: None
EPs received from allies: 0
Other income: 0
Total: 74EP
Y169F FFF: 6
Production:
Standard production (65)
8 DG (0.75FFF)
5 TR
4 LN sub UH (1FFF)
4 LN sub DE (1FFF)
5 2HN sub 2AH (1@0215)(1@1017)
7.5 3CU
3.5 CR sub HN
5 2FFT sub 2HN
0 Free Prime Team
0 Free MMG
14 2PDU
9 3PGB
Conversions (6)
5 LN to SR (0617)
1 HN to SC (0215)
Repairs (0)
0
Other expenditures:
0 no E/S Raid
3 Set up new survey line
Total: 74
74 - 74 = 0EP remaining
Command Points: 0+1=1
FFF: Y169 6 - 2.75 = 3.25 remain
You subbed 2xHN for the two scheduled AH's. Are you aware that 431.734 states that CU's may be substituted for an AH? Not a huge difference, but a slightly better ship for the same cost.
John
It was ruled recently (IIRC) the AH's can only become HN's if not built.
Karl I am guessing the BS to BATS upgrade is in the Barony (as Engineers can't work in the Capital Hex)??
I'm a little surprised that my strategy is so novel. Basically, I reasoned that since killing cruisers lowers the compot of future lines (because cruiser production is limited) and most combat is over fixed defenses, it's a huge advantage to the Coalition to fight in (essentially) open space. So that's what I've been doing, fighting mostly where there are no PDUs so Karl doesn't have a significant compot advantage.
At press time, the Kzinti have attacked all the pickets (but there's a couple of battles where the reserves mean that a Kzinti ship is likely to die instead). They're also attacking 0906 - where I accidentally didn't put any ships to be repaired, for some reason. There's no way it survives, but some of the reserves also went there.
The Hydrans are attacking just two targets: 0411 and 0413. Both of them will be destroyed if Karl wishes, especially as there are only a dozen Lyrans in 0411. There's a lot of Hydrans attacking.
Sam
Directing to kill cruisers/big ships has been tried before.
The issue from the limited number of games it has been arttempted is, is the Alliance economy is often stronger - and probably number 1 reason for it failing, the Coalition miscount at some point and the Alliance gets into the FRD park.....
.... and so the Coalition resigns!
The Alliance player can alter what they do - never defend planets which have been devastated for example or just do a single round in deep space - and so the Coalition has to do it over something bumping up the Compot - even a mInor planet for example.
Will be interesting to see if it works this time 
Combat is ongoing. In Kzinti space, they have liberated all but 3 provinces and one planet, plus raided and destroyed a Klingon BATS. However, the Lyrans put up some resistance, successfully repelling the Kzinti attack on 1001 and also using a reserve to save a 1 on 1 battle to kill the Kzinti FF and hold on to the province.
Hydran combat in south Lyran space is happening right now. So far the BATS got mauled by the FSP but the tug carrying it destroyed, and an SAF destroyed in the second round. The fleets are pretty evenly matched, though, so the Hydrans are taking some on the chin. Haven't decided if they will stick around to after this.
Last battle will be the EB Starbase and then the Hydrans will need to hurry back to defend home space for turn 4. Hydrax is within range of the west fleet, which has been bolstered by repaired cripples from the Kzinti front. Enough to do some damage for sure, but I don't see any Lyran infrastructure in Klingon space set up yet. I imagine they will need to provide another FRD park in the Hydran theatre. That doesn't appear to be happening soon, unless some are moved from the Kzinti front.
Right, Karl has so far been happy to fight over undevastated planets with no defenses. If he weren't, I wouldn't be so happy to pick off cruisers.
He could certainly force me to fight over Kzintai, and will at some point, but until then I'll keep killing cruisers.
The Hydran front has started similarly - 4 rounds of combat so far, and I've killed TG 3RN in exchange for BATS SAF and cripples. Hydran cruisers are even better targets than Kzinti cruisers, so I'm feeling good about it so far.
Losing RN's at that rate is not good for the Hydrans.
Especially when the Hydrans only seem to be doing cripples back...
Question is - I am surprised the Coalition seems to have enough good ships to fight everywere in strength - with so many Coalition ships crippled - as the Alliance just throwing themselves on Coalitioon hard points - rather than trying to attack where the Coalition isn't?
How many Coalition ships will remain crippled for the start of Coalition operational movement?
On defending undevastated planets - the Kzinti can perhaps do that if there is 3 Carrier Groups (and
say a CC in form) defending (so worst they lose is an outer escoret) and go low on BIR (so the CC in Form is safe) - but defending with Cruisers is a pretty major error IMHO - they are losing good hulls for no real gain.
The FRD park was the only defended spot in the Kzinti theater - aside from the ships which had taken 0902/1001. There's not much in the way of targets, especially with most of the fleet in 1401.
The Hydrans could have hit 1013, but there are even more ships there. There are probably going to be about 30 crippled Coalition ships come OP operational movement, between Alliance attacks and lack of repair capacity.
The gain that the Kzinti are getting from sacrificing BCs is that their planets aren't devastated yet. Which is a marginal benefit, IMO. It might slow me down enough that I haven't captured an Alliance capital by C7 - but if the fleet is weak, I think I'll be okay with that.
I actually was specifically using the BCs as a distraction since I knew that they would get directed when put on the line. That meant that PDUs/Planets were not getting directed, and letting the damage drop would cripple as many coalition ships as possible. Although one could assume those cripples will return as a repaired ship, there is still the logistical headache of the FRD park, limited repair capacity, and of course the EPs spent on repair. The other (if minor) benefit to all the dead Kzinti BCs is that the salvage EPs at least bolstered the Kzinti economy. For the Kzinti in particular my combat strategy revolves around carrier group deployment as you mentioned, Paul. There just isn't much room for non-attrition related units on the line.
Hydran combat is finished, the forward-deployed fleet in 0413 had the BATS knocked out as well as the SAF poached and cripples taken, but in return the Lyrans took down several Ranger hulls. Something similar happened in 0411, where the Starbase also went down, but took several Lyran hulls with it, while the Lyrans directed cruisers pretty much every round. The bonus was that the stored MB as well as the colony in the hex were also lost. There were cripples already in the hex waiting to be repaired CT4, and Sam wisely used CDR to resurrect a Lyran CC.
If I had to do it over I probably wouldn't have fought as many rounds at 0413 as I did (I think it went 4 rounds.) My goal there was to cripple as many Lyrans as possible, being an off-turn for the coalition these ships would start their turn without a base to repair them and would have to be moved back by operational movement. Also now the closest non-BATS repair facility is Lyrantan. I don't know if it's enough to hobble the Lyran contribution to the Hydran counterattack, but I guess I'm about to find out if it was worth it.
Did the Hydrans get to kill the Bats in 212(?) aswell?
If they did, that will hamper the Lyrans in Hydran space and so will help offset the pain suffered.
If they didn't - the trade probably IMHO wasn't worth it.
Those 10+ compot hull want to fight over a Hydran SB or Hydrax..... not over a Coaltiion base (unless thye need to do so - i.e. one shot cripple a SB!!)