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FC Evolution
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How much should FC evolve to include?
All the races in the alpha octant (including Andros), but not complicated scout, fighter, and X-rules.
51%
 51%  [ 47 ]
All the races in the alpha octant (excluding Andros), but not fighters, scouts, and X-ships.
10%
 10%  [ 10 ]
X-ships
3%
 3%  [ 3 ]
Scouts
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Fighters for everybody
5%
 5%  [ 5 ]
Everthing SFB has
10%
 10%  [ 10 ]
any combonation of the above. (specify in a post, please)
9%
 9%  [ 9 ]
Omega Octant races
5%
 5%  [ 5 ]
Anything else that SFB has. (specify in a post, please)
3%
 3%  [ 3 ]
Total Votes : 92

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Kang
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Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 1929
Location: Devon, UK

PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2008 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you want SFB complexity, play SFB. Simple, innit?

Andros OK, Jindarians OK etc.

But the problem for me already is all the different Rules Supplements, i.e. one booklet from each 'Attack' module. We would need a unified Rulebook, otherwise it will get [indeed is getting] like the Designer's Edition SFB, with Expansions 1, 2 and 3. Now, where were those rules for....

You get the idea.
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pneumonic81
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Joined: 23 May 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2008 1:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

its not a matter of complexity. its a matter of variety.
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silent bob
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Joined: 30 Apr 2008
Posts: 139

PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2008 4:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sure bring in all the races. however a shas been stated a unified rule book would be nice.
so work out the stats/abilities of weapons and tech etc, then add it to a border rulebook so no matter what race cards you pick up you can play those races.

the attack expansions then become ship and scenario expansions rather than rules ones.
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DNordeen
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Joined: 05 Apr 2007
Posts: 517

PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 5:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can live without the fighters and gunboats. Playing the Kzintis means I have enough stuff on the board without adding fighters who launch drones Wink

I really like the scout rules in Comm and would be satisfied to see more scouts ships presented in Comm. Same with LTTs and Tugs. I liked the initial idea in Comm and would like to see only cargo pods (no combat pods, fighter pods, etc. to complicate things) and more LTTs and Tugs for the other races.

Andros wouldn't matter either way. They would need more rules added so that's a downside, but they'd be simplified and could be ignored or used as a player prefers them.

So overall:

Yes:
More scout ships
More LTTs and Tugs with cargo pods only
More Ships in general
More Races

No:
EW
Non-hydran fighters
Stasis Generators
PF Tenders
Tug Pods other than cargo pods

Maybe:
Gunboats depending on how they play and only the standard; no leaders or scouts (they're unnecessarily complicated).
X-Ships always struck me as munchkin for SFB. They would add a lot of new rules, and completely dominate the game. Depending on the level of complexity they add, I could probably live with them or ignore them.

Lastly, we should only add rules for new weapons and for absolutely necessary race-specific systems (Andro PA Panels=Yes; Stasis Generators=No). Caveat being that the Comms have already put out all the rules we need for scouts and tugs so I don't see a need for any more general rules (i.e., non-weapon; non-race rules).

Just my 2 cents
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pinecone
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Joined: 03 May 2008
Posts: 1865
Location: Earth

PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any more races besides the ISC and Andromeans you have in mind? The Drex Laughing ?
I'd like to see the Vudar though.
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Steve Cole
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Joined: 11 Oct 2006
Posts: 2998

PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

See the fighter-drone rules in CL#37.

When I hire Matt-2.0 or Jolene-3.0 I will post the PDFs, or you can Email and ask me. Remember that I cannot get private messages on this board since PHP hates Macs.
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Mike
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Joined: 07 May 2007
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Location: South Carolina

PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do not agree with the adage, "If you want SFB complexity, just play SFB."

IMHO, the FedCom 8-impulse game system is *much* better than the SFB 32-impulse system. In spite of a statement in the FedCom rulebook that the FedCom system started sometime after Y2K when someone at a trade show asked for a simpler system, there were "house rules" incarnations of an 8-impulse system (and even a 4-impulse system!) for SFB back in the 1990s.

With the addition of the running track of "all reserve" power and game system changes to accommodate the new power usage, Federation Commander became a distinct game of its own.

However, many of us would like to see the same history, powers, ship/weapon systems, etc. included in FedCom that are in SFB. In effect, we want the richness of SFB without its cumbersome 32-impulse system.

Shoot, I've seen some very irregular SFB-style SSDs for ships that followed more of a movie/TV-series timeline (as opposed to the SFU timeline) that I would enjoy seeing done in FedCom "ship card" format.

Oh, well. My rant is over.
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jmt
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Joined: 08 Oct 2006
Posts: 395
Location: Plano, TX

PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike wrote:

However, many of us would like to see the same history, powers, ship/weapon systems, etc. included in FedCom that are in SFB. In effect, we want the richness of SFB without its cumbersome 32-impulse system.


If Federation Commander Fleet Scale is to be the "fleet battle system" for SFB, then having all the "stuff" is a must; thus the concept of "Borders of Madness".
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MikePowers
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Joined: 13 Oct 2006
Posts: 176

PostPosted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 5:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike wrote:
I...there were "house rules" incarnations of an 8-impulse system (and even a 4-impulse system!) for SFB back in the 1990s.
Actually, as I understand it, SFB itself used to have 24, 16, and 8-impulse "turns" as options, back in the 1970s.
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Scoutdad
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Joined: 09 Oct 2006
Posts: 4454
Location: Middle Tennessee

PostPosted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MikePowers wrote:
Mike wrote:
I...there were "house rules" incarnations of an 8-impulse system (and even a 4-impulse system!) for SFB back in the 1990s.
Actually, as I understand it, SFB itself used to have 24, 16, and 8-impulse "turns" as options, back in the 1970s.

Yes it did. I still have copies of the 8, 16, and 24 impulse charts in my SFB archives folder.... right there along side the 1/2 sheet size SSDs from the original "pocket-box" edition of SFB.

Everything old is new again! Cool
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bobrunnicles
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Joined: 26 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scoutdad wrote:
MikePowers wrote:
Mike wrote:
I...there were "house rules" incarnations of an 8-impulse system (and even a 4-impulse system!) for SFB back in the 1990s.
Actually, as I understand it, SFB itself used to have 24, 16, and 8-impulse "turns" as options, back in the 1970s.

Yes it did. I still have copies of the 8, 16, and 24 impulse charts in my SFB archives folder.... right there along side the 1/2 sheet size SSDs from the original "pocket-box" edition of SFB.


Me too Smile Although I didn't get into SFB until the boxed set with the cool Fed CA above a planet shooting the Romulan War Eagle cover (still one of the best box covers imho) I distinctly remember the multiple different impulse charts. And plotted movement - which I actually really enjoyed Wink
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bobrunnicles
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Joined: 26 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike wrote:
However, many of us would like to see the same history, powers, ship/weapon systems, etc. included in FedCom that are in SFB. In effect, we want the richness of SFB without its cumbersome 32-impulse system.


QFT. I LOVE the concept of PFs/Fighters, and would be VERY happy to see them in FC. Same with Andros.
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Mike
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think they're calling the "PFs" gunboats now.

Anyway...

I thought those old 8, 12, 16, 24 impulse charts that SFB had were to be used when one of those speeds was the maximum speed any ship was plotted to move during that particular turn??? Oh, well.
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Scoutdad
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Joined: 09 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike wrote:
I think they're calling the "PFs" gunboats now.

Anyway...

I thought those old 8, 12, 16, 24 impulse charts that SFB had were to be used when one of those speeds was the maximum speed any ship was plotted to move during that particular turn??? Oh, well.

Correct on both counts.
The "PFs" are now indeed known as gunboats.

The old style 8, 16, 24 impulse charts were designed to be used to speed the game up if the fastest unit in play during a turn was moving at a lower speed than the chart speed. For example, if playing a middle years game with speed 20 drones and all ships moving less than speed 24 on turn 6, you could use the 24 impulse chart and then on turn 7 switch to a differnet impulse chart if necessary.
They eventually went the way of the dodo due to everyone wanting every opportunity to fire / react / adjust / etc. during a turn. And some times, you'd just get some really odd things happening on an odd (less than 32) impulse chart.
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bobrunnicles
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike wrote:
I think they're calling the "PFs" gunboats now.


Oops....missed that.

Quote:
I thought those old 8, 12, 16, 24 impulse charts that SFB had were to be used when one of those speeds was the maximum speed any ship was plotted to move during that particular turn??? Oh, well.


Absolutely, they were never mandatory, just one possible way to speed things up if you didn't want to churn through the 32 impulse charts every turn. In my experience I used them a lot with the early Monster (ie solo) scenarios, although I rarely used them against a human opponent.
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