Federation Commander Forum Index Federation Commander
A NEW fast paced board game of starship combat!
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Location Maps

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Federation Commander Forum Index -> Rules Questions
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Davec_24
Commander


Joined: 16 Jul 2008
Posts: 596
Location: England

PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 5:40 pm    Post subject: Location Maps Reply with quote

In the Revision 4 rulebook, rule (8A1) describes how to use a "location map". If you are using this type of map, a certain location on the map canot move off the map in any direction, and so the map stops floating when it reaches the map edge, and any unit then going off the map edge such that floating the map would move the "location" off the map is considered to have moved off the map.

My question is, what happens if two units move off the map at the same time, at opposite map edges? Or what if moving the map to keep a ship that is about to move off the map on the map (with that so far?) will move the map such that another ship that was near the edge of the map would then be off the map? In all of these cases, I am assuming that such a moving of the map would not require moving the fixed "location" off the map (and in the first case may not require moving the "location" at all).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mjwest
Commodore


Joined: 08 Oct 2006
Posts: 3489
Location: Dallas, Texas

PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Personally, I would rule that the ship that already has position would maintain position.

But the best way to define a location map is not to say the location cannot move off the base map, but rather say that the map limit is defined to be xx hexes from the location. (That is what I have tried to do in any of my scenarios.)
_________________

Federation Commander Answer Guy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Davec_24
Commander


Joined: 16 Jul 2008
Posts: 596
Location: England

PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's a good idea actually, I'll probably do that in future. The only trouble with that is that it doesn't solve the problem of needing a large board if people are moving in different directions or to opposite corners (as I suppose it basically becomes a large "fixed map" in this case) to each-other - I suppose I'll just have to remember how the map panels relate to each other.

Another idea we toyed with when we encountered this problem was that the ship closest to the marker (and thus the disputed area or mission objective, etc.) will stay on the map. The trouble is that that could be open to abuse as it could then be possible to firce the other player to leave by forcing the map to move such that the other ship is off the map. If you were to say that the ship which can stay on the map without moving it stays on the map, this is no longer a problem so that sounds like a better idea.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Kang
Fleet Captain


Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 1955
Location: Devon, UK

PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you do use a location map then you need to be very careful about using disengagement conditions where a ship 'leaves the map'. This can also be a problem when a ship is 'considered destroyed' if it leaves the map.

Take the 'Surprise Reversed' scenario for example - here, the Fed CA has to disengage by a certain turn, by leaving the map. But the map is 50 hexes around a certain point. In my thread http://www.starfleetgames.com/federation/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=1227&highlight=disengagement , Mike did say that "Quite frankly, any scenario that requires "disengagement" by turn XX on a floating map probably should be reexamined." - and I agree. Also Scoutdad came up with another idea about disengaging by being 35 hexes from the fixed point - another good one.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Pinkfluffychicken
Lieutenant Commander


Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 217
Location: Kingston-upon-Thames

PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
My question is, what happens if two units move off the map at the same time, at opposite map edges? Or what if moving the map to keep a ship that is about to move off the map on the map (with that so far?) will move the map such that another ship that was near the edge of the map would then be off the map?


We use map boards to extend the map out to the hex row where the ship would disengage if the other ship causing the issue on the opposite map edge were not there.
_________________
Famous last words #11: "That's a very big fleet!"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Davec_24
Commander


Joined: 16 Jul 2008
Posts: 596
Location: England

PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pinkfluffychicken wrote:
We use map boards to extend the map out to the hex row where the ship would disengage if the other ship causing the issue on the opposite map edge were not there.


I think this is what I will do in future, probably also adopting MJW's suggestion of making the "map edge" a fixed distance from a fixed point. The trouble is that I may run out of table space if I have to deploy more than four map panels in a row!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mjwest
Commodore


Joined: 08 Oct 2006
Posts: 3489
Location: Dallas, Texas

PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, the other thing is to quit running away!

Laughing
_________________

Federation Commander Answer Guy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Davec_24
Commander


Joined: 16 Jul 2008
Posts: 596
Location: England

PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 10:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And eat some plasma... well it would certainly shorten the game. Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Pinkfluffychicken
Lieutenant Commander


Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 217
Location: Kingston-upon-Thames

PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 10:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's a loooot of space. We've used this map for many years - pre FC - and I've never heard of it being fully used. On the rare occasions you need to extend the location map at all it's only by a few hexes.

It's great compromise (as others have said) between the races that want to run away forever, and the ones who want to pin you in a corner asap.

edit: Thinking about it, we've had this as a club rule for many years and there was co-operation to make it work. If it's now an official arena there probably will need to be some definitive ruling on how "scrolling" the playing surface across the available hexes operates...
_________________
Famous last words #11: "That's a very big fleet!"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Davec_24
Commander


Joined: 16 Jul 2008
Posts: 596
Location: England

PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 11:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pinkfluffychicken wrote:
That's a loooot of space. We've used this map for many years - pre FC - and I've never heard of it being fully used. On the rare occasions you need to extend the location map at all it's only by a few hexes.


On the occasion where this became a problem, we were using the large hexes (we usually do so that we can use my minis) and the map was 3 panels by 3. We found that we did run out of hexes when both of us were trying to move off the map edge at the same time (so it wasn't that the general direction of a fight was moving in one way so we could scroll the map easily) even though the range wasn't massively large. This was made worse by us being at high speed and so having a turn mode of 5, which makes it even harder to avoid this problem.

In the end, we just agreed to turn and stay on the map, but I can imagine in a game where such a spirit of co-operation and a desire to enjoy the game is overwhelmed by a desire to win at all costs, this approach would fall down.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Pinkfluffychicken
Lieutenant Commander


Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 217
Location: Kingston-upon-Thames

PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah. Big hexes = heap big difference.

The problem is not hexes, it's real space...
_________________
Famous last words #11: "That's a very big fleet!"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Davec_24
Commander


Joined: 16 Jul 2008
Posts: 596
Location: England

PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I find playing with the big hexes to be a much more enjoyable gaming experience, partly because I can use miniatures and partly because things become less fiddly, especially when dealing with stacked counters. Unfortunately this does require a lot more space, and my coffee table is only big enough for a 3x3 map, maybe a 3x4 at an extreme pinch. Sad
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Federation Commander Forum Index -> Rules Questions All times are GMT
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group