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Un-balancing Orion advantage?
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djdood
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2009 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Enterprise -

Any Orion ship (except things like the Prime Traitor, freighters, etc.) can buy a cloak for the appropriate point-cost. It's not shown on the card, because not every Orion has one and not every player wants to take the point-hit it requires.

Give the rules a quick re-read and you'll see the reference I'm talking about.
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

'dood is absolutely right. Any Orion warship (including the LR, CR, and SAL) may have a cloaking device. They don't have the information on the cards because the information wasn't finalized when those cards were produced.
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USS Enterprise
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Joined: 27 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone can be given a cloak if the other players agree, so what I think what you're saying is the Orions can take a cloak even if the other players don't agree?
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Bolo_MK_XL
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Enterprise,

First thing with a cloak, unless its a Romulan with the cloak in the BPV, you will have to add 25% to the BPV, which in most cases will put you at least one Class Size disadvantage (CA vs CL, DD vs FF etc) ---
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USS Enterprise
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First off, yes, I know that you have to pay (Though, if all players agree, you can do just about anything.) Secondly, I'm 100% positive its 20%, not 25%. Thirdly, I don't have Romulans yet (Only Klingon border) so correct me if I'm wrong but I just assumed that ships with cloaks would say so on the card (Or maybe Romulans would say on the card if they didn't have cloaks, don't yet have Romulan Border as I previously said.)
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Hod K'el
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Joined: 21 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

USS Enterprise wrote:
Not all Orions have cloaks.


This is very true, but I usually do not use a cloak on my Orion ships at all. Why should I? I have a stealth bonus and I like to fly phaser boats. They need less power than other heavy weapons, my ship still gets guaranteed hits at range 5, and she still has enough power to put distance between me and the enemy ship before I get into deep trouble.

My phaser boat is usually a BR with the B slot housing a PH-G; otherwise, she has PH-1s. Only my SAL uses drones in every rack, unless I need a sensor suite.
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Hod K'el
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

USS Enterprise wrote:
First off, yes, I know that you have to pay (Though, if all players agree, you can do just about anything.) Secondly, I'm 100% positive its 20%, not 25%. Thirdly, I don't have Romulans yet (Only Klingon border) so correct me if I'm wrong but I just assumed that ships with cloaks would say so on the card (Or maybe Romulans would say on the card if they didn't have cloaks, don't yet have Romulan Border as I previously said.)


Romulan ships have the cloak built in so the card does not have to say it...it is there! Orions have an option to add the cloaking device, but only in certain situations and certain percentages. And yes, you do have to add 20% points cost if you take it.
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USS Enterprise
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know that. Orion's can add cloaks at all times, so can Feds, Klingons, exc, though it is not a normal part of the game with other races as it with Orions, merely an optional addition to allow it.
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djdood
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Orions adding cloaks is a part of the flavor-text of the game universe. The point-value purchase rule allows for players to add them as-needed. Some Orion ships have cloaks, others do not. Things in the SFU just are what they are.

Players can do whatever they want in their own gaming sessions, but if you read any of the SFU fiction or history articles, you'll see that the Orions are the only "empire" using cloaks other than the original inventors (the Romulans).

You are very unlikely to read anything different after 30 years of consistency.
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Bolo_MK_XL
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
You are very unlikely to read anything different after 30 years of consistency.


Even when the Klingons kept a group of Sparrowhawks, they removed the cloak ---
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2009 4:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just to be clear ...

Romulans (except where noted) automatically come with cloaking devices.

Orions may, if they pay the required points, use a cloaking device without seeking permission of any of the other players.

All other races may not use cloaks, except as experimentation, and with the acceptance of all of the other players.
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USS Enterprise
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you. Another question, it does say "And other Weapons," at the end of the list of WPN weapons you can choose. This means what?
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

At this point it means nothing. Smile

With the introduction of Orion Attack, the weapons options for Orion ships are now explicitly listed. For ships that existed prior to Orion Attack, please download the CRUL from Commanders' Circle. Please note that this list is now included in the rev5 Klingon Border rule book, as well as the new rev5 Reference Rule Book.
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