Federation Commander

[DirkSJ]

ESG damage is combined into the same volley as any other fire but then is distributed in a special fashion independent of that volley. There are a few interactions I wanted clarification on.

LDR ship is in the same hex as two undamaged Stingers. Hydran ship is 1 hex away.

LDR decides to fire a few gat pulses at the stingers, dump 2 full ESGs, and unload the rest at the Hydran.

Am I correct in assuming that the PH-G's actually hit the fighters "first" before the ESG damage to them is allocated even though it's all in the same volley? (5N2d) doesn't actually mention anything about order and all damage is supposed to be combined into a volley before being applied. Or are the ESGs assumed to allocate 10 points to each fighter regardless of PH-G fire since all damage is assigned before any damage is allocated?

To take another example of a crippled ship at range 0 and another enemy at range 1, 5N2d implies that you 1-point Mizia their ship until it pops when dumping ESG. The procedure calls for assigning one point of damage at a time until explosion. Because of this check for explosion each point must be allocated and the ship must checked if it explodes or not before the next point can be allocated. The way it reads, each of these will gets it's own roll on the DAC because there is a necessary "stop and see what happens" step (and in fact all ESGs should then always roll once per point because the ship "could" explode).

This second example again calls into question "order of fire"...do the direct fire weapons hit "first" before the ESG Mizia or after? If the direct fire weapons hit first, wouldn't the ESG be a second volley? Would each 1 point hit be a volley on it's own?

[mjwest]

The ESGs are assumed to allocate first since all damage is assigned before any damage is allocated. So, in your example, you probably want to fire the Ph-Gs at the ship, rather than the Stingers, unless you will fail to do 10 points of damage to each Stinger. (At least it is deterministic, so you will know what you need to do.)

For the other issue, the "stop and see what happens" is focused on drones and fighters; ships would simply accept damage points in its turn, and have that allocated later. You do not do damage allocation until all points are assigned. It is only for drones and fighters (or other such "widgets" that may be introduced in a scenario) where the effect of each point must be examined before continuing.
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Federation Commander Answer Guy

[DirkSJ]

[m1a1dat]

Not sure if i am understanding this correctly. If a Lyran is activating only ESG's at full power and there is a ship at range zero that is heavily damaged and only has say 10 boxes left and a ship at range 1 how much damage does the ship at range 1 take? Is all damage applied to the range zero ship and is overkilled or does some damage get to the range 1 ship also?

[terryoc]

Hmm, according to Mike's ruling the damaged ship would take a 20-point volley and the extra damage would go to waste. In that case, the Lyran should only release a 3 power point burst.
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"Captain" Terry O'Carroll, fourteen papers published including six best of issue
"Man, Terry, you are like a loophole seeking missle!" - Mike West

[Hod K'el]

Why would you not do Volley #1 ESG for 12 points. (1st Ship destroyed), Volley #2 ESG for 20 points, Volley #3 (4) PH-G (LDR) and roll that damage for the #2 ship since ESG's activate prior to weapons fire and ESG's are volley fire (shields can be reinforced per volley)?
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HoD K'el
IMV Black Dagger
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Life is not victory;
Death is not defeat!

[storeylf]

[DirkSJ]

[Hod K'el]

So a ship that cannot absorb damage can still absorb damage...how very quaint. Realistic, also. And since I can move, but not fire, in sub-pulses, I loose the opportunity to place my volley fire in sub-pulse waves. Oh, how cute!

Frak it! I'm going to bed.
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HoD K'el
IMV Black Dagger
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Life is not victory;
Death is not defeat!

[mjwest]

The problem is twofold:
1) Ships don't get a damage total after which they are deterministically destroyed.
2) Damage allocation only occurs after damage points have been assigned.

So, if you have a mythical ship at range 1 with but a single excess damage box left, and something else at range 2, then, yes, the mythical ship will absorb the ESG damage even though it is overkill. The reason is because we don't actually allocate the damage until after it is assigned.

Also, to be more precise in my prior ruling, damage applied to anything that just takes damage and does not use damage allocation will have the points checked after each assignment to see if it is destroyed. Damage applied to anything that does use damage allocation will just take damage in turn, and can't be destroyed until damage allocation is performed.

To rule anything else will result in weirdness. Like rolling for damage allocation one point at a time as ESG damage is assigned. And that would only make things worse.
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Federation Commander Answer Guy

[Hod K'el]

Mike,

I can appreciate your position, but I disagree with it.

If I have an enemy ship at range 0 and I am overrunning it, specifically to destroy it with an ESG burst, and it has 10 hits left, with an additional 2 frame hits, making a total of 12 hits, and I want to burst an ESG to range 1 because the enemy saw what I was going to do and moved a cruiser into a range 1 position (this completes the setup), then why does the 12 point ship absorb 20 points? This is not logical.

Simple math, 20-12=8 dispersed into the facing shield of ship #2. The 8 points is in an ESG wave that does not stop due to 'game mechanics'. That is why it is SCIENCE fiction. And how many people cannot do simple math and play this game? My guess is zero.

Now you and I both know that I am going to loose this argument in the end, but as a southerner, you also know I am going to fight to the end. Besides, if you do not hear what we think, how can the game get better?
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HoD K'el
IMV Black Dagger
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Life is not victory;
Death is not defeat!