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FCOL Tournament Rules Draft: Please Read and Comment
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Scoutdad
Commodore


Joined: 09 Oct 2006
Posts: 4460
Location: Middle Tennessee

PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the goal is to get people playing FCOL, then you need Double Elim at least and Swiss would certainly be best...
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ericphillips
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Joined: 16 Apr 2009
Posts: 702
Location: Los Angeles, CA, USA, Sol, Gould Belt, Orion Arm, Milky Way Galaxy, Local Group, Universe Beta

PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is a listof the ships in FCOL as of Aug 4, 2010. Some are ineligible for the tournament:


Race Ship
Federation BATS
Federation BB
Federation BCF
Federation BCG
Federation BCJ
Federation CA
Federation CC
Federation CF
Federation CL
Federation CLC
Federation CS
Federation CVS
Federation DD
Federation DDG
Federation DDL
Federation DN
Federation DNF
Federation DW
Federation FF
Federation FFB
Federation GSC
Federation MB
Federation MB(DR)
Federation NCA
Federation NCC
Federation NCD
Federation NCF
Federation NCL
Federation OCA
Federation POL
Federation SB
Frax BCH
Frax CA
Frax CW
Frax DW
Frax FF
Frax POL
Gorn BB
Gorn BC
Gorn BCF
Gorn BCH
Gorn BDD
Gorn Carrier
Gorn CC
Gorn CL
Gorn CLE
Gorn CM
Gorn CS
Gorn DD
Gorn DN
Gorn HDD
Gorn HDDLeader
Gorn MB
Gorn SB
Hydran BAR
Hydran CA
Hydran CU
Hydran CWG
Hydran CWS
Hydran DG
Hydran DWH
Hydran HN
Hydran IRQ
Hydran KN
Hydran LB
Hydran LN
Hydran MHK
Hydran MNG
Hydran OV
Hydran PAL
Hydran RN
Hydran SB
Hydran TAR
Hydran THR
ISC CA
ISC SB
Klingon B10
Klingon BATS
Klingon C7
Klingon C8
Klingon D5
Klingon D5W
Klingon D6
Klingon D7
Klingon D7C
Klingon DW
Klingon DW
Klingon DWL
Klingon DWL
Klingon E4
Klingon F5
Klingon F5W
Klingon FD7
Klingon MB
Klingon MB(DR)
Klingon SB
Kzinti BATS
Kzinti BB
Kzinti BC
Kzinti BCH
Kzinti CC
Kzinti CF
Kzinti CL
Kzinti CM
Kzinti DN
Kzinti DW
Kzinti FF
Kzinti FFK
Kzinti MB
Kzinti MB(DR)
Kzinti NCA
Kzinti NCC
Kzinti SB
LDR NCA
LDR NCA
Lyran BC
Lyran BC
Lyran CA
Lyran CC
Lyran CF
Lyran CL
Lyran CL
Lyran CW
Lyran DD
Lyran DN
Lyran DW
Lyran DW
Lyran FF
Lyran NCA
Lyran NCA
Lyran SB
Orion CA
Orion CR
Orion DN
Orion LR
Orion MB
Orion OK6
Orion SAL
Romulan BH
Romulan CON
Romulan FFH
Romulan FH
Romulan K5R
Romulan K7R
Romulan K9R
Romulan KCondor
Romulan KE
Romulan KR
Romulan MB
Romulan NH
Romulan RH
Romulan SB
Romulan SKH
Romulan SN
Romulan SPA
Romulan VUL
Romulan WE
Seltorian BCH
Seltorian BW
Seltorian CA
Seltorian CL
Seltorian DD
Seltorian DN
Seltorian FF
Seltorian SB
Tholian BATS
Tholian BB
Tholian CA
Tholian CAP
Tholian DD
Tholian DN
Tholian MB(D)
Tholian MB(P)
Tholian NCA
Tholian NDD
Tholian NDN
Tholian NFF
Tholian PC
Tholian SB
Tholian SB
Tholian SB
WYN AuxC
WYN AuxC
WYN CA
WYN CW
WYN DD
WYN FF
WYN FF
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gar1138
Lieutenant Commander


Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Posts: 342
Location: Eugene, OR

PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How about eight turns? That would give just a little bit more space for plasma empires (they could launch on turn 1 or turn 2). Plus, without the specific time limit with FCOL (as opposed to face-to-face tourney), it seems like a good compromise between six turns and ten turns.

Additional question: Which ships would be non-eligible for use? I'm specifically interested in the Frax (looks like a few have recently been added), but also the Fast Cruisers?

Thanks,

Garrett
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DirkSJ
Lieutenant Commander


Joined: 08 Jun 2010
Posts: 239

PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A non-tree style, like swiss, handles DQs or people deciding not to play anymore better than a tree system does.
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terryoc
Captain


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 1379

PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gar1138:

Ships eligible for use under current rules are anything printed in a box, attack product or booster, with the following exceptions:

Battleships
General/Civilian units (bases and freighters, basically)
Drone ships
Escort ships
Middle Years ships

Ships only in Captain's Log like the FRAX would normally be ineligible, because not everyone has those products. OTOH if you have a FCOL subscription you'll be able to familiarise yourself with the opponent's ship cards, and the FRAX use standard technology that anyone who's played Klingons and Kzintis are familiar with will know. I'm inclined to allow the FRAX.

DirkSJ, I agree, I was thinking of going with a Swiss system.
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terryoc
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Edited the first post to add some of the proposed ideas to it. Thanks for your input everyone, keep the ideas coming! Smile
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Scoutdad
Commodore


Joined: 09 Oct 2006
Posts: 4460
Location: Middle Tennessee

PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Terry:
I do not currently have an active FCOL account (but I think this will convince me to re-up), so take this for what it's worth:

You are correct, the Frax have no new weapons tech / rules - so learnign them (and how to go against them) would not be an insurrmountable obstacle. And they are still one of our groups favorite SFB empires.
That being said however; I do not think they sure be allowed.
The goal of this idea is to increase online play of Fed Comm.
That means going out of the way to insure fairness... and that menas not allowing one empire that has not been published anywhere other than CL / Communique.
Yes... the rules and ship cards are freely available, but why allow this and not that? Mauler rules and ship cards are available; and so are carriers and fighters - but they're not allowed.

Yes, I am taking it to extremes... but you see where i'm going don't you? It's a slippery slope and when / where do you stop? My suggestion for the intial FCOl tourney is to stick with only units published in an official product.

As for time limits, I think it should be at least 6 tiurns - but 8 would be better. I think ten turns is a bit too many as that will drastically lengthen the playing time of many games; adn therefore, the entire tournament.
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Krellex
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Joined: 30 Sep 2009
Posts: 261
Location: RIS Boise

PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just wait 'til we get the Frax subs uploaded into the client, and then you can reconsider allowing them in the tourney. Shocked Wink
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terryoc
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Posts: 1379

PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK then, eight turns, no FRAX (yet), no Borders of Madness. Basically the same as the Origins rules, which we know work.

Once the FRAX are released as a downloadable product this may (or may not) change. We'll see how it goes. If, in the future, there is enough interest, may start a small tournament with Weird Stuff (subs, maulers, carriers) included just for fun.
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ericphillips
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Joined: 16 Apr 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have never had a problem with ships being able to fire everything on turn one. So I am okay with this. Eight turns ok.
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ericphillips
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

terryoc wrote:
Gar1138:
DirkSJ, I agree, I was thinking of going with a Swiss system.

I think a swiss system is the way to go!
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ericphillips
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

terryoc wrote:
If, in the future, there is enough interest, may start a small tournament with Weird Stuff (subs, maulers, carriers) included just for fun.

Again, I agree. A weird stuff tournament would be fun, but lets keep it basic for this one.
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pinecone
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Joined: 03 May 2008
Posts: 1865
Location: Earth

PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm cool with all that, although the swiss makes me hesitate. Some people might not have time to do a best two out of three. But we'll see.

Sometime, I think we should do a huge scenario (Maybe a starbase assault) with one person controlling one ship, but with many ships. This would be in the future when we have enough people to do that. Smile
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gar1138
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Joined: 10 Jul 2007
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Location: Eugene, OR

PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 11:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This all sounds good. At some point, someone will have to explain to me how a "Swiss System" works (I've never been in a tournament like this before). Smile

Garrett
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DirkSJ
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Joined: 08 Jun 2010
Posts: 239

PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gar1138 wrote:
This all sounds good. At some point, someone will have to explain to me how a "Swiss System" works (I've never been in a tournament like this before). Smile

Garrett

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_tournament

TL;DR
Everyone plays in every round of the tourney (no one is eliminated). First round is generally random matchups (or based on prior tourney rating). After that each round you are paired with people based on where you are in the standings with the caveat that you never play the same person twice. It takes the same number of rounds to decide a winner as a tree-based tourney but everyone gets to play every round.

How you are rated varies. Some are just pure win/loss record and some score different tourney points for win/partial win/tie. Some tourneys you play 3 games per opponent, some you just play 1.
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