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Cloak understanding
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Blammo
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Joined: 01 Mar 2011
Posts: 170
Location: Barnesville, GA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 6:38 pm    Post subject: Cloak understanding Reply with quote

Hello:
I am getting ready to run some battles with Romulans and I want to make sure my understanding of how cloak works in FC is correct:

Item - A Romulan ship declares cloaking on Impulse #1 and pays for four impulses (including that one) of cloaking. They are considered cloaked on Impulse #2. They will not have to start paying additional power to maintain the cloak until Impulse #5.

Example:
Impulse #1 - Declare cloak, pay for four impulses of cloak, fade out.
Impulse #2 - Fully cloaked, no power cost for cloak (as of other functions step)
Impulse #3 - Fully cloaked, no power cost for cloak
Impulse #4 - Fully cloaked, no power cost for cloak
Impulse #5 - Fully cloaked, pay power cost to maintain cloak (and continuing paying on each subsequent impulse that the player desires to remain cloaked)

Is this a correct interpretation of how the process works?

Cheers!

EDIT: Edited my example for clarity


Last edited by Blammo on Mon Mar 07, 2011 7:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
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wedge_hammersteel
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Joined: 27 Sep 2008
Posts: 579
Location: Lafayette, LA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 7:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought it was

Impulse #1 - Declare cloak, at the end of other functions phase, pay for 4 impulses
Impulse #2 - fade out, no power cost for cloak
Impulse #3 - Fully cloaked, no power cost for cloak
Impulse #4 - Fully cloaked, no power cost for cloak
Impulse #5 - Fully cloaked, no power cost for cloak for this impulse but you need to pay for cloak for impulse 6 at the end of other functions phase of impulse 5 or begin fade in during impulse 6.
Impulse #6 - pay power cost to maintain cloak (and continuing paying on each subsequent impulse that the player desires to remain cloaked)
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storeylf
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Joined: 24 Jul 2008
Posts: 1842

PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe Blammo has it right.

You cloak during other functions, and are cloaked (faded) straight away - note you cannot declare cloak and then launch as you are already faded by the launch phase. The cost covers you till the following other functions. If you later do not pay for continuing in other functions then you fade in immediatley (i.e. can be launched at straight away).
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blammo has it exactly right.

(5P2) says that you pay and immediately enter fade out. This lasts until the next Other Functions phase, at which point the ship is cloaked for the next three impulses. On the impulse following that, you must pay to maintain the cloak, or immediately begin fading in.
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duxvolantis
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Joined: 16 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 1:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mjwest wrote:
Blammo has it exactly right.

(5P2) says that you pay and immediately enter fade out. This lasts until the next Other Functions phase, at which point the ship is cloaked for the next three impulses. On the impulse following that, you must pay to maintain the cloak, or immediately begin fading in.


To clarify, when Blammo says on Impulse 5 "pay power cost to maintain cloak" this is done during the other functions phase and is paying for the ability to maintain the cloak on impulse 6 (right?).

When you pay for cloak on Impulse 1 you have paid the energy cost to cover powering the cloaking device from the Other Functions of Impulse 1 through the Other Functions of Impulse 5:
1-2
2-3
3-4
4-5
= 4 impulses


I think that where the confusion comes in is that you have to decide every impulse during Other Functions if you want to stay cloaked for *next* impulse.
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Dux Volantis
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Blammo
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

duxvolantis wrote:
To clarify, when Blammo says on Impulse 5 "pay power cost to maintain cloak" this is done during the other functions phase and is paying for the ability to maintain the cloak on impulse 6 (right?).


That is my understanding: that cloak power cost and decision goes from Other Functions to Other Functions.
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

duxvolantis wrote:
I think that where the confusion comes in is that you have to decide every impulse during Other Functions if you want to stay cloaked for *next* impulse.

Yes, this is correct. The decision to use or continue (or not use) cloak is done in the Other Functions phase and cloak lasts from Other Functions to Other Functions. Basically, a "cloak turn" runs from Other Functions to Other Functions instead of Energy Allocation to Energy Allocation.
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mike_espo
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think there is a conflict in the reference rulebook:

pg7, 1E1 sequence of play, it says: "Pay to continue or begin cloak"(5PE3)-which is during the Energy Allocation phase .This before the impulse sequence.

However, go to the example page 85; it says that cloaking costs are paid in the Other Functions Phase...???

If I begin to cloak on say Impulse 4 can I wait till the energy allocation phase of the next turn to pay for continued cloaking? From the reference I made to pg7, this would appear so.
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JimDauphinais
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Joined: 22 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
pg7, 1E1 sequence of play, it says: "Pay to continue or begin cloak"(5PE3)-which is during the Energy Allocation phase .This before the impulse sequence.


I suspect this language is in error. Note that it is not in either of the two posted CRUL files. So the language predates Rev 5 of the Rulebook. It may be a rules artifact.

There is no continuation payment over turn breaks for cloaking. Continuation of cloaking is paid for in the Other Functions Phase when the decision to continue is made.
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, that should probably not be there. However, it doesn't hurt anything, either.

Basically, if you pay for cloak in 1E1, it still doesn't take effect until the Other Functions phase. You would simply be pre-paying for something that has a better (i.e. later) time to pay for it. It is probably an artifact of SFB-think.

So, my ruling is that it is there, and so is in effect. But regardless of whether you pay for cloak in 1E1, it doesn't change when it takes effect.
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mike_espo
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 10:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks. Makes sense. Very Happy

But, the only difference I see is that one must pay to continue cloaking with the current turn's energy; at the end of Impulse #8.
Instead, you can wait till power regenerates on the next turn...in the energy allocation phase. If you time it right.
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terryoc
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you fail to pay to continue cloaking, you start fade in. (Doesn't matter if you intend to pay during EA of the next turn).
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mjwest
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, Terri is correct. Any energy provided to cloak in Energy Allocation would be pre-payment. You must still pay for anything you need to for Impulse #8 of the previous turn on Impuse #8 of the previous turn.

Like I said, the cloak comment in 1E1 provides zero benefit. It probably shouldn't be there, but given that it is, it causes no harm and provides no benefit.
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JonPerry
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that when Wedge typed this
Quote:
Impulse #1 - Declare cloak, at the end of other functions phase, pay for 4 impulses
Impulse #2 - fade out, no power cost for cloak
Impulse #3 - Fully cloaked, no power cost for cloak

he was partly right.
For "getting shot at" purposes, the Romulan is still in the fade out period during Offensive Fire of impulse 2, as that happens before the functions step of impulse 2.
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mike_espo
Lieutenant JG


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2011 1:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In SFB, I played mostly Romulan. Just picked up Romulan Space at my local gameshop.

Played the scenario Mobile Base X. The cloak rules seem to work pretty good. With two exceptions: Drones, I feel are too easy to hit cloaking ships. There should be a chance for Drones only to lose lock-ons. Also, once a ship cloaks, an enemy can just latch on to its tail and wait for it to uncloak and clobber it. Sad

Maybe allow for some hidden movement; maybe leave the cloak counter on the map, but allow the ship to move hidden within 3 hexes of the counter. Allow the cloaked player to inform the others which shield the cloaked ship is facing. All other rules stay the same Very Happy
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