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mojo jojo Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 23 Jun 2009 Posts: 340
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Posted: Wed Jul 21, 2010 11:22 pm Post subject: ISC Strike/Light Cruiser |
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I just got W&P and Boosters 28-30.
Should the ISC CS be the same points as the CL? Having 2 PPD is far superior than having 2 PL-S. |
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HappyDaze Lieutenant JG
Joined: 21 Apr 2010 Posts: 79 Location: Orlando, FL
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 12:12 am Post subject: |
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The balance is that you need to have at least as many ships as PPDs. This means the other (expensive) ISC ships help to weigh out the cost difference (of about 5 per PL-S to PPD per the Orions). |
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Savedfromwhat Commander
Joined: 23 Aug 2007 Posts: 657
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 12:16 am Post subject: |
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Then how do you use the CS in a scenario by itself... |
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mojo jojo Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 23 Jun 2009 Posts: 340
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 1:02 am Post subject: |
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HappyDaze wrote: | The balance is that you need to have at least as many ships as PPDs. This means the other (expensive) ISC ships help to weigh out the cost difference (of about 5 per PL-S to PPD per the Orions). |
It that's the case, it would imply that the other non-PPD ships are overpriced.
A CS+DD costs the same as a CL+DD. Yet who in the world would ever choose the CL+DD for the same points?
I would submit that the PPD in FC terms is more than a 5 pt improvement over a PLS. The PPD costs 8 energy over 2 turns and averages 22.3 damage at range 4-10. The PL-S costs 8 energy over 3 turns and while it can theoretically do 30 damage, in practice it averages much less. Even a guaranteed hit at close range by a PL-S only averages the same per turn damage as a PPD. |
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mojo jojo Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 23 Jun 2009 Posts: 340
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 1:48 am Post subject: |
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I noticed the same issue applies to the DNP and the DNT. |
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wedge_hammersteel Commander
Joined: 27 Sep 2008 Posts: 578 Location: Lafayette, LA
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 2:10 am Post subject: |
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At Origins, I recall SVC saying to add 10 points to the ship with the PPD. |
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mojo jojo Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 23 Jun 2009 Posts: 340
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 2:32 am Post subject: |
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I'm comparing the ISC CC and CA. The CC costs 35 pts more and has additional over the CA:
1 PPD
4 PWR
2 Control
Based on this, I'd say the system values the PPD as roughly 30 pts.
The Gorn BCH costs 32 pts over the BC and has additional:
1 PL-S
2 PH-1
2 PH-3
1 Control
3 PWR
2 BAT
2 TRAN
18 shield boxes.
Based on this, the system probably values the PL-S as roughly 15 pts or so.
So each PPD should cost roughly 15 pts more than a PL-S. That sounds right to me, that a PPD is roughly the value of 2 PL-S or 1 PL-R. |
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terryoc Captain
Joined: 07 Oct 2006 Posts: 1386
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:53 am Post subject: |
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Savedfromwhat wrote: | Then how do you use the CS in a scenario by itself... |
I assumed the answer to that one is, "You don't". Presumably doctrine requires these ships to be the core of an echelon, and they would always have other ships around. Same with the CC. _________________ "Captain" Terry O'Carroll, fourteen papers published including six best of issue
"Man, Terry, you are like a loophole seeking missle!" - Mike West
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Savedfromwhat Commander
Joined: 23 Aug 2007 Posts: 657
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 11:05 am Post subject: |
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First and future shock calls for a lone cs. |
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mjwest Commodore
Joined: 08 Oct 2006 Posts: 4075 Location: Dallas, Texas
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 3:06 pm Post subject: |
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You can always use a lone ship. So, you can use an ISC CS by itself if you want.
The restriction is there for squadrons and fleets so you don't load up on PPD ships at the expense of anything else. _________________
Federation Commander Answer Guy |
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Kang Fleet Captain
Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 1976 Location: Devon, UK
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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Savedfromwhat wrote: | Then how do you use the CS in a scenario by itself... |
(You point it at the enemy and shoot.)
As for which ships can be used when and where - it's your game, use them where you like. This is Federation Commander, not Star Fleet Battles. If you can fit a D7 with photons, then you can use whatever ships you want.
Just don't tell anyone... _________________
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mjwest Commodore
Joined: 08 Oct 2006 Posts: 4075 Location: Dallas, Texas
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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Kang wrote: | Just don't tell anyone... |
Oh, you can tell anyone you want. Just don't expect ADB to publish a ship card for the D7 with photons ... _________________
Federation Commander Answer Guy |
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mojo jojo Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 23 Jun 2009 Posts: 340
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 4:10 pm Post subject: |
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mjwest wrote: | You can always use a lone ship. So, you can use an ISC CS by itself if you want.
The restriction is there for squadrons and fleets so you don't load up on PPD ships at the expense of anything else. |
Mike, this is a very useful ruling. But it doesn't answer the original question. Should there be a point adjustment one way or another for a CS/CL or DNP/DNT? |
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mjwest Commodore
Joined: 08 Oct 2006 Posts: 4075 Location: Dallas, Texas
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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I will have to research on that, and I can't do that right now. _________________
Federation Commander Answer Guy |
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HappyDaze Lieutenant JG
Joined: 21 Apr 2010 Posts: 79 Location: Orlando, FL
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Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:23 pm Post subject: |
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mjwest wrote: | You can always use a lone ship. So, you can use an ISC CS by itself if you want. |
Can we get this added as an official ruling? |
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