Unbalanced fighters should be revised in BoM

USS Enterprise · Post by **USS Enterprise** » Sun May 24, 2009 1:29 am

I was kinda referring to the possibility that fighters be given to all races in FC.

So, BOM is a way to play fleet battles in a limited amount of time for SFB? Like the "Fleet Scale," For SFB? But is this a More complex FC or a simpler SFB (Or both.)

Scoutdad · Post by **Scoutdad** » Sun May 24, 2009 2:04 am

Simpler SFB...

Mike · Post by **Mike** » Sun May 24, 2009 3:31 am

This has all been discussed before...and will probably be discussed again.

Hopefully next time with a little more tact.

DorianGray · Post by **DorianGray** » Sun May 24, 2009 3:37 am

terryoc wrote:
As far as balance is concerned, I've seen the FC fighter rules and I just can't see FC fighters being as powerful as they are in SFB. They're slow (speed 16, no warp booster packs), short ranged (max range 8 for direct fire weapons AND drones), and vulnerable (no small-target modifiers, no EW fighters, no chaff packs, nada.) In fact, they're so slow that they can't even catch up with freighters! Now, against fixed positons like bases they're kinda scary, but a base studded with phaser-4s is going to eat fighters like popcorn from outside any range the fighters can be effective at.

Ok, this really will help me sleep at night.

+1 for weaker more balanced fighters.

SWO_Daddy · Post by **SWO_Daddy** » Sun May 24, 2009 6:29 am

Keep in mind speed 16, no warp boosters, is actually faster than fighters in SFB from their introduction until late in the GW. The range 8 restriction takes away options like Hydran Stingers sniping from range 10, but fighters don't get deadly until they are much closer anyway. The removal of dogfights and chaff packs saves time, but mainly impact fighter vs. fighter combat. And the lack of EW across the board in FC means the lack of small targets and EM cuts both ways. Ships in SFB, particularly with scout support, have an EW edge over fighters. In FC, its all straight up.

I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that fighters under the playtest FC rules are that much weaker than fighters in SFB. Ships in FC can't do everything a ship SFB can either. I think they are a tad weaker personally, but not substantially so. Fighters in BOM will still kill if a ship isn't careful.

USS Enterprise · Post by **USS Enterprise** » Sun May 24, 2009 12:01 pm

I'm just going to have to trust people's judgement on this then. I really don't know how fighters work.

DorianGray · Post by **DorianGray** » Mon May 25, 2009 12:34 am

As long as SVC gets the idea we're all happy.

No more craxy cheap powerful expendable gunboats and fighters that regular ships cannot effectively counter.

terryoc · Post by **terryoc** » Mon May 25, 2009 8:34 am

Keep in mind speed 16, no warp boosters, is actually faster than fighters in SFB from their introduction until late in the GW.

Yes, but the ships in FC are fully refitted, late GW ships for the most part. And they don't pay housekeeping, making them faster by about four hexes per turn in most cases. BoM fighters can do damage to ships when they get close, but "getting close" is very difficult unless the target is slowed for some reason, usually an anchor by a ship (at least that's my experience).

Post by **Steve Cole** » Mon May 25, 2009 5:38 pm

Dorrian: I have said before (on this forum) what I had to say about fighters, and in CL37. I don't need to repeat myself, and have yet to reach the point of thinking further than that, although I accept that further thinking will be required. Even CL37 is still trying some different ways to see what works, but fighters in FC (other than Stingers) are BoM.

As for making a list of the mistakes in your original screed, I don't have the time. If you really wanted to discuss this, you'd really look the stuff up for yourself. For me to make a list would come off as petty and pendantic, more as scolding you than encouraging you, and I want to encourage you, not scold you. Do the research and come back.

DKeith2011 · Post by **DKeith2011** » Mon May 25, 2009 9:47 pm

Would it be possible to get the BoM fighter rules reposted on the site or better yet get all the existing BoM rules compiled into one issue of Communique?

It would really simplify matters to have the playtest rules available for all to see and review.

malleman · Post by **malleman** » Mon May 25, 2009 10:27 pm

Dorian, you should order CL37 and play a game. Maybe D7V vs D7V. Don't forget escorts.

You can even try some other ships. Follow the BoM thread on the other board and goto strike fighters. Look under August 8th and 17th.

Try it Mikey, you might like it

.

Post by **Steve Cole** » Tue May 26, 2009 4:08 pm

Email me in July (after Origins) and I'll run the idea of putting the CL37 fighter stuff into commander's circle. (If you email me before Origins, I personally guarantee the email will be lost and never answered.) By and large, we put the stuff there to get you to buy the issue, and putting caplog stuff on the free download page isn't something that "werewolf" is going to vote for.

Mike · Post by **Mike** » Wed May 27, 2009 2:07 am

I paid good money for CL37 and basically for the fiction and FC stuff. Don't know how I'll feel if it shows up at CC.

Wolverin61 · Post by **Wolverin61** » Wed May 27, 2009 3:21 am

Mike wrote:I paid good money for CL37 and basically for the fiction and FC stuff. Don't know how I'll feel if it shows up at CC.

Reminds me of seeing a dvd in the cutout bin I paid full price for last year. It's cheaper now but I wouldn't have been able to watch and enjoy it for the past year.

Requete · Post by **Requete** » Wed May 27, 2009 5:09 am

Mike wrote:I paid good money for CL37 and basically for the fiction and FC stuff. Don't know how I'll feel if it shows up at CC.

You'll feel happy that you supported ADB and happy that the more impecunious among us get a chance to look at the material also?

Though if this kind of thing would cut into sales of CL then I guess I'd be against it too... CL is "too rich for my blood" but I want ADB to make lots of money so that they can continue producing stuff that I like to buy.