New to Federation Commander

mike_espo · Post by **mike_espo** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:40 pm

Hi all

I have played SFB in the 80s for about a decade. Have not played since. Was thinking of getting back into it. Unfortunately, I do not have any of the components still.

Then I found out about Fed. Commander. It looks to be easier than SFB, but was wondering about the detail.

Just what I have been able to gather from BGG and this website, some ommisions I noted: No sensors or scanners. So I can guess that through battle damage there is no degrading of fire? No EW amongst other things.

Also, if memory serves, one of the things that was frustrating is with every expansion, new rules would crop up....is this the case with FC? Is errata published online-so I don't have to buy additional rules?

I am thinking about Romulan Border as my first pick.

Opinions or comments would be most welcome to help make a decision

thanks

Scoutdad · Post by **Scoutdad** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:52 pm

Hey Mike, Welcome aboard.

I've played SFB since 1980 and still can't say enough good things about Fed Comm. Yes, I still prefer SFB... but in my area I now have 0 SFB opponents and over a dozen Fed Comm players.

The rulebook is less daunting...
The high quality pieces are more enticing...
The glitzy, laminated color ship cards are more appealing than B&W SSDs done with 1980's software...
Fleet scale lets you run multiple ships quickly...

Are some things left out? Yes:

No EW (although certain things do provide a built-in shift to the "To Hit" roll)
No Wild Weasels
No T-Bombs
No PPTs
No proximity Photons
Only one type of drone
No hidden EA (everything is pay as you go)
No hidden anything, in fact...

But if you're still on the fence, then might I suggest you download First Missions .
It gives you the ship cards for the Fed CA and the Klingon D7 and enough of the basic rules to get a feel for the game.

Also, where are you located? There may be forum members close to you that already play the game.

Again, Welcome to our family.

mike_espo · Post by **mike_espo** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:09 pm

Thanks Scoutdad

I reside in the Chicago Area. My local gamestore has a Friday nite SFB/FC group. Unfortunately, I did not keep in touch with my old friends who playtested with me in the '80s...so I will probably need new opponents.

I see on the FC site that there is updates for the rules. Thats cool!

As I said, I was looking at Romulan border for the start point. Is there any scenarios for the early Earth-Romulan War? I seem to remember that SFB had Atomic Missiles and Laser cannons or something.....Armor?

thanks

JimDauphinais · Post by **JimDauphinais** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 12:47 am

No hidden anything, in fact...

No hidden plotting to speak of and all of the information on the Ship Cards is public, but the following are performed simultaneously in secret and then immediately revealed:

- Baseline Speed Selection

- Selection of movement for any ships that are tied for movement precedence on a given subpulse

- Seeking Weapon targeting when two or more players are launching in a given Launch Phase

The first happens every turn, the second happens occasionally and the third is rarely bothered with. Furthermore, you can download from various places cards for Baseline Speed and Subpulse Movement selection that make secret selection a breeze.

Like Tony, I highly recommend First Missions for giving the system a try. I liked it enough for me to take a plunge into the system.

The Sixth Edition rulebooks have just started to come out. If you buy Romulan Border directly from ADB, it should guarantee you a copy of its Sixth Edition rules. If not, you'll likely get the Fifth Edition copy of the rules. However, the Fifth Edition rules are in good shape and most of the important changes from Fifth Edition to the Sixth Edition were published in last month's issue of Communique (which is a free download from the Federaton Commander website). If you like Romulan Border, it will be well worth your money to invest into a copy if the Sixth Edition of the Reference Rulebook (which is available for purchase as a PDF on e23 in addition to being available for purchase in print form elsewhere) in which case it will be no biggy to have the Fifth Edition of the Romulan Border rulebook.

There are playtest Early Years rules for Federation Commander that were in one of the past issues of Captain's Log. However, I don't believe even the Early Years stuff goes all the way back to the first Earth(Federation)-Romulan War. However, the sublight Romulan Warbird is one of the Early Years playtest ships. Tactically, it is sublight, has armor and is armed with Lasers.

The Romulan Eagle series ships and Federation Light Cruiser, all from the main Federation Commander period (General War Years), also have armor.

If you ever get down to St. Louis, we have an active Federation Commander group down here.

mike_espo · Post by **mike_espo** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 1:42 am

JimDauphinais wrote:
No hidden anything, in fact...
No hidden plotting to speak of and all of the information on the Ship Cards is public, but the following are performed simultaneously in secret and then immediately revealed:

- Baseline Speed Selection

- Selection of movement for any ships that are tied for movement precedence on a given subpulse

- Seeking Weapon targeting when two or more players are launching in a given Launch Phase

The first happens every turn, the second happens occasionally and the third is rarely bothered with. Furthermore, you can download from various places cards for Baseline Speed and Subpulse Movement selection that make secret selection a breeze.

Like Tony, I highly recommend First Missions for giving the system a try. I liked it enough for me to take a plunge into the system.

The Sixth Edition rulebooks have just started to come out. If you buy Romulan Border directly from ADB, it should guarantee you a copy of its Sixth Edition rules. If not, you'll likely get the Fifth Edition copy of the rules. However, the Fifth Edition rules are in good shape and most of the important changes from Fifth Edition to the Sixth Edition were published in last month's issue of Communique (which is a free download from the Federaton Commander website). If you like Romulan Border, it will be well worth your money to invest into a copy if the Sixth Edition of the Reference Rulebook (which is available for purchase as a PDF on e23 in addition to being available for purchase in print form elsewhere) in which case it will be no biggy to have the Fifth Edition of the Romulan Border rulebook.

There are playtest Early Years rules for Federation Commander that were in one of the past issues of Captain's Log. However, I don't believe even the Early Years stuff goes all the way back to the first Earth(Federation)-Romulan War. However, the sublight Romulan Warbird is one of the Early Years playtest ships. Tactically, it is sublight, has armor and is armed with Lasers.

The Romulan Eagle series ships and Federation Light Cruiser, all from the main Federation Commander period (General War Years), also have armor.

If you ever get down to St. Louis, we have an active Federation Commander group down here.

Thanks Jim

See your in Chesterfield. Used to live across the river in O'Fallon for a couple of years. Wife worked for Monsanto. Nice Town! Tough being a Cub fan in Cardinal Country though!!!

Wow! Energy allocation for all to see. Gotta get used to that one! I remember playing maybe 5-6 ships total with 4-5 guys....scenario took more than 6 hours to play and we only got maybe 3 turns in...

Now that Im older, don't have that much time.....FC has appeal that is is supposed to be quicker...

SFU_FEAR · Post by **SFU_FEAR** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:30 am

Hey, Scoutdad... I still play SFB! It just hasn't been for a while!

Scoutdad · Post by **Scoutdad** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 3:17 am

SFU_FEAR wrote:Hey, Scoutdad... I still play SFB! It just hasn't been for a while!

OK... technically Mike is correct. There are still 4 or 5 of us SFB players in town - but who has the time for an all day (or two day) battle?

We haven't played a game of SFB in over 3 years... but we still get in Fed Comm two or three times a month.

Dal Downing · Post by **Dal Downing** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 3:46 am

mike_espo wrote:As I said, I was looking at Romulan border for the start point. Is there any scenarios for the early Earth-Romulan War? I seem to remember that SFB had Atomic Missiles and Laser cannons or something.....Armor?

thanks

Hey Mike welcome aboard.

One more thing for FedCom. It is all pretty much one setting Late General War (All Refits and War Classes right from the start). Yes a B&W Book was put out with 72 Middle Years (Pre General War Ships / Pre Refits) in it. And in the Captians Logs there have been a couple of the Early Year Ships and some basic rules on how the Fed Com Rules would work in that time setting but there is no "Sub Light" - First Romulan War stuff out yet.

Also in FedCom there are no Fighters except Hydrian Stingers. There is work on a group of Bridge/Crossover rules for SFB being developed called Boarders of Madness where things like Fighters, Electronic Warfare or Mines would go so they will stay out of FedCom proper. If you just have to have some of the opld goodies thats where they will probably go.

Blammo · Post by **Blammo** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 4:08 am

Welcome, Mike.

I think most everyone else has covered everything, but I am glad you are here with us. The SF Universe get's in your blood and pretty much stays there.

We you get more settled in perhaps you might be interested in some PBEM games.

Anyway, let me know if you need anything...not that I can help, but I will try or point you in the right direction

Kang · Post by **Kang** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 7:15 am

Welcome to the group, Mike

This suggestion has been made before but I can't find the thread.

Firstly, as people have already said, try First Missions. This was what got me and many others on this forum into the game.

If you like First Missions - and I'm sure you will! - then there are several options. You can do what you have already mentioned, and buy a Border module. This gives you the latest rulebook, maps, counters and ship cards. If you like First Missions enough, then this is the way to go.

Thirdly, if you're still not sure after First Missions, then you could do worse than buy the FC Reference Rulebook electronic copy from e23, or the paper copy direct from ADB. I think it's about $15 or so, either way.

This could be a cheaper way into the game for you because it sounds as if you already have maps and counters from SFB, which you can use with FC; all the tables you need are in the rulebook, and/or can be downloaded from the Commanders' Circle on the FC website, and you can flesh out your fleets by using the ship cards from the Communique newsletter.

However, to my mind, part of the magic of FC is the high-quality game components and the sheer richness of the game system. You will probably want to buy the real thing, I'm sure, but the ideas above will give you a cheaper entry path if you need it.

The advantage of buying the electronic rulebook, btw, is that you can download later editions for free (to a point; the price includes minor updates but not major revisions), incorporating all the latest rules modifications. Granted, you will get the latest rulebook if you buy a Border module, but the electronic copy may be something you might want anyway in addition to the paper one from your Border module, because of this flexibility.

I hope this is helpful. Once again, welcome aboard!

Dal Downing · Post by **Dal Downing** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 1:15 pm

One more little tidbit. Yes First Missions is definitely the cheapest fastest way into FedCom. It is a extremely slimmed down copy of the very basic rules and gives you 2 Fleet Scale ships (Fed CA & Klink D 7). If if you think to yourself these ship do not look big enough you are looking for Squadron Scale ship cards in the full ruleset.

Once you decide yes your hooked there are actually 3 ways in. One is to pick up the Ref Rule Book (which is strictly all the rules, no ships, no scenarios, no fluff.) Or you can look at Fedearation Academy. The Base Rule Book with 4 fully laminated double sided cards FedCA, KlinkD7, Gorn BC, & Rom WB plus small counter sheet. And lastly just jump in with one of the Border Boxes.

Kang · Post by **Kang** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:26 pm

Fed Academy. Of course, I forgot about that. Good catch, DD.

JonPerry · Post by **JonPerry** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:28 pm

Wow! Energy allocation for all to see. Gotta get used to that one!

Except that it isn't really "energy allocation" for all to see. It's more of a "pay as you go" system. For all to see.

It's like this - your Klink cruiser has 37 power. You plan a base speed of 16, that leaves you with 21 power to spend. There. Done. And everybody knows you have 21 power left for the turn. Now, as you play out the rest of your turn, you spend that 21 *at the instant you use it*. Decide to fire 4 std disruptors? Pay your 8 power *right then*, leaving you with 13. And we all know you have that 13 left, as it is public knowledge. Fire a few phasers? Take that off your running total on the impulse you fire, leaving you with whatever.
So it isn't energy allocation in the traditional SFB sense.
In fact, there isn't even an energy allocation form anymore. Just your laminated full-color SSD, upon which you use dry erase markers to track everything you need to play the game.
Not having to flip back and forth between two different sheets of paper just to run my ship? Yes please!

Post by **Jean** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:32 pm

ACK! Bad formatting and I was running late and didn't check the preview. Praise be for "quote" that let me recover my missive!

Hi Mike,

I do know some folks who play SFB in the Chicago area if you want to hook up with them.

However, a lot of SFB players have picked up Fed Commander as it is perhaps easier to teach someone new all the rules. I promise you, if I can learn the rules, anyone can as this is really the first game like this I have played. (I come from an RPG background.)

Either Romulan Border or Klingon Border are good entry points, depending on whether you like Romulans or Klingons better. Packages exist for both that let you get the "missing" parts for the other set.

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mjwest · Post by **mjwest** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 4:44 pm

Jean wrote:ACK! Bad formatting and I was running late and didn't check the preview. Praise be for "quote" that let me recover my missive!

Also praise the little "X" button that lets the mistake (and subsequent silliness) fade into the mists of time ...